Relatively sure that Stanbo did nothing really special to sign Panarin; it was solely because the Hawks had won the Stanley Cup at the time he signed, and more than likely he looked at it as fairly easy shot at getting a Stanley Cup in 2015-16.

Yeh I'd take the cups- the past is what it is.

Relatively sure that Stanbo did nothing really special to sign Panarin; it was solely because the Hawks had won the Stanley Cup at the time he signed, and more than likely he looked at it as fairly easy shot at getting a Stanley Cup in 2015-16.

Yeh I'd take the cups- the past is what it is.
- SC116

Its cause he knew Q was going to nickname him the Breadman

Thats a straw man argument.

The real question - would you rather have Bickell or Panarin or which one actually is a top line winger is Panarin.
- fattybeef

I have those with my wife also

I have those with my wife also
- vabeachbear

I’m betting you lose every one.

Its cause he knew Q was going to nickname him the Breadman
- vabeachbear

Touche ... ok pay that one :D

I’m betting you lose every one.
- paulr

Men in general always lose.

Not really. He had 28 points in the 2015 cup year which was the most since his first full year at 37. Didn't get over 30 points any other time.

Only one good playoff performance.

Just because he's the only guy doesn't mean you have to pay him.
- fattybeef

You don’t win in 2013 without Bickell…. So just let a guy who was integral to your cup win go?

No MS he earns every bit of that contract. Having TT makes absolutely no difference. Hawks aren’t winning with TT in any of the years after the 2015 cup win. Small perimeter player isn’t what was missing from the post 2015 Hawks teams.

my head explodes with the what if scenarios the Blackhawks got Toronto's Frank Mahovlich for cash with stan and Bobby?

Luck, line combos determine lots in the playoffs.

No one was more disappointed when they didn't have the $ to pay Breadman.
Was Breadman willing to compromise?

Kucherov gave the Lightnng one and so did Stamkos way back.

Maybe the group around Panarin didn't understand the recent past histories or chose to set a dollar and unwaver.
I don't truly know the minds on both sides of those $ talks to retain him.

I do know I have watched Breadman close in the Rangers last runs, and he he picks his spots and though I refuse any hockey boy timid, he protects his body pretty well with a few noncommitals to pucks. (That sounded diplomatic.)
Bickell was the perfect guy in their in that playoff...he did his job, saw the situation and rose to the occasion, he wanted his name on a Cup. And I don't think he ever hesitated to react in the game thinking he might be in a position where he could get damaged.
You could debate forever without ever concluding that series that year would have gone differently.
Love the players, hate the Cap

I forgot what year Keith had knee surgery. He was never the same after that either
- LAHawk




when Duncan keith was named the winner of the Conn Smythe?

I will never forget in that FIRST seires vs Nashvill, the way HE brought them back, I never disappointedly Turned away as Preds started scoring, and that comeback was lots of good hockey with Duncan in the middle.
- wiz1901

I just wanted to add I think Seabrook was pretty big in that comeback too, both him and Keith were really something in the playoffs when the games mattered.

I just wanted to add I think Seabrook was pretty big in that comeback too, both him and Keith were really something in the playoffs when the games mattered.
- breadbag

Seabrook was a monster in all of their runs, that’s why he got paid, unfortunately his body didn’t hold up. The Hawks didn’t have another defenseman that played his type of game, that’s why he was extended. He contributed more to the Blackhawks than Chelios ever did. If they were going to retire #7, it should have been for Seabs.

Seabrook was a monster in all of their runs, that’s why he got paid, unfortunately his body didn’t hold up. The Hawks didn’t have another defenseman that played his type of game, that’s why he was extended. He contributed more to the Blackhawks than Chelios ever did. If they were going to retire #7, it should have been for Seabs.
- Angotti

I just remember that series, I think both Keith and Seabrook had OTGWG that helped the Hawks in that series or it could have went the other way.

Goddamn you sound like those cub fans i can't stand and I'm a Cubs fan. So are you one of those that go to the game and don't pay attention and when something happens you cheer with the fans?
- BetweenTheDots

No. I want to watch entertaining hockey.

You don’t win in 2013 without Bickell…. So just let a guy who was integral to your cup win go?

No MS he earns every bit of that contract. Having TT makes absolutely no difference. Hawks aren’t winning with TT in any of the years after the 2015 cup win. Small perimeter player isn’t what was missing from the post 2015 Hawks teams.
- bhawks2241

Yes you do.

30 point bangers are a dime a dozen.

Of any of the "power forwards" they had Byfuglien was the only one worth giving money and term to.

And Tampa won 2 cups with little euro forwards.

Yes you do.

30 point bangers are a dime a dozen.

Of any of the "power forwards" they had Byfuglien was the only one worth giving money and term to.

And Tampa won 2 cups with little euro forwards.
- fattybeef

The point isn’t big vs small, it’s Bickell who shows up during the playoffs vs Panarin who saves his best hockey for the regular season

Very interesting research showing the drafting success of General Managers. As you know I am a huge fan of the debate of who contributed the most on the drafting side of building the dynasty, Mike Smith/Dale Tallon/Stan Bowman. I think you may enjoy looking at the track records. https://scoutthe.xyz/draf...ringgmcharts/2013/2023/7/. Apologies if you have all seen this before.

Very interesting research showing the drafting success of General Managers. As you know I am a huge fan of the debate of who contributed the most on the drafting side of building the dynasty, Mike Smith/Dale Tallon/Stan Bowman. I think you may enjoy looking at the track records. https://scoutthe.xyz/draf...ringgmcharts/2013/2023/7/. Apologies if you have all seen this before.
- stevefrmglencoe

If you go back to 2000, when Smith became GM, it paints a very different picture of the 3. Bowman is 601 over, Mike Smith 612.4 over, and with only Tallon's tenure here, he was -1185.5, the worst drafting GM in the league during his tenure here.

Also, to be fair, I used the 7 year evaluations, so Bowman's full draft isn't included here. If I drop it to a 3 year eval, Bowman's drafting drops to 150, but he is still second best at drafting in the league while he was GM here.

While Bowman was GM on a 3 year eval, there are 4 GMs that draft worse than not having a GM:
Blake, Tallon, Yzerman and Snow.

The only one better than Bowman during this time is Jarmo from CBJ.

Yes you do.

30 point bangers are a dime a dozen.

Of any of the "power forwards" they had Byfuglien was the only one worth giving money and term to.

And Tampa won 2 cups with little euro forwards.
- fattybeef

Its not about the points… its when you get them.

Yes you do.

30 point bangers are a dime a dozen.

Of any of the "power forwards" they had Byfuglien was the only one worth giving money and term to.

And Tampa won 2 cups with little euro forwards.
- fattybeef

Talk about a straw man argument. Bickell had the second best point total during that 2013 run trailing only Kane. His nine goals were second to Sharp and Kane's 10.

They don't win without that output. It's funny how you canonize the guy that was a regular season hero and playoff meh but completely discount Bickell's effort in 2013. Look it up, because you and some others don't seem to remember but he was definitely in the conversation for the Conn Smythe that year.

Edit - They didn't/couldn't pay Byfuglien at the time. Seems to have worked out ok.

Talk about a straw man argument. Bickell had the second best point total during that 2013 run trailing only Kane. His nine goals were second to Sharp and Kane's 10.

They don't win without that output. It's funny how you canonize the guy that was a regular season hero and playoff meh but completely discount Bickell's effort in 2013. Look it up, because you and some others don't seem to remember but he was definitely in the conversation for the Conn Smythe that year.

Edit - They didn't/couldn't pay Byfuglien at the time. Seems to have worked out ok.
- HawkintheD

Teams that win in the playoffs need guys like Bickell, who can play even better when the rule book gets lax and space/time run out.

It's too bad he couldn't stay healthy.

Story of so many of the Hawks players from that time. Slowed down by health issues, shortened careers or just couldn't play up to their usual standard. Bickell's MS, Seabrook's back, Keith knee, Hossa dealing with his allergic reactions, Toews immune system, Crawford concussion,

Talk about a straw man argument. Bickell had the second best point total during that 2013 run trailing only Kane. His nine goals were second to Sharp and Kane's 10.

They don't win without that output. It's funny how you canonize the guy that was a regular season hero and playoff meh but completely discount Bickell's effort in 2013. Look it up, because you and some others don't seem to remember but he was definitely in the conversation for the Conn Smythe that year.

Edit - They didn't/couldn't pay Byfuglien at the time. Seems to have worked out ok.
- HawkintheD

Bickell was the 2013 version of Byfuglien. Too bad Bickell had vertigo that the Chicago doctors couldn't diagnose properly, which is not the first time that had happened. Sharp was misdiagnosed and ended up on the DL for 4 weeks more than he needed to be at one point in his Chicago career

Just because it's the off season dog days .... and Stanbo came up, earlier ... and I hated this trade of his, I present this video of Nick Foligno beating the snot out of Dale Wiese.

https://www.hockeyfights.com/fights/97171

Talk about a straw man argument. Bickell had the second best point total during that 2013 run trailing only Kane. His nine goals were second to Sharp and Kane's 10. They don't win without that output. It's funny how you canonize the guy that was a regular season hero and playoff meh but completely discount Bickell's effort in 2013. Look it up, because you and some others don't seem to remember but he was definitely in the conversation for the Conn Smythe that year. Edit - They didn't/couldn't pay Byfuglien at the time. Seems to have worked out ok.
- HawkintheD

Hockey's Cup runs have heroes that "got" the "big rallying play" whether it was watching big Buff against the Canucks in that one Cup series, or Bickell in the other, or the previously mention !st series last Cup Preds _ Duncan Keith, or Dolly St. Laurent in '62, and that's why playoffs can /is so watchable. Players give such efforts and in some, it stays, as part of "a level up" in the improvement and the careers flourish.
I suspect that the hawk team top down won't stop with finding a top six.
Same on a top 3 they build the backend around.
They continue to patch their 7-12 forwards through the pipeline, and always having $ this early to outside patch an immediate fill.

Believe me, I think we fans have plenty good chance to have enough well mannered kids they can advance throughout the line up, some ending with like those Bickell playoff heroes.

What was always the funniest thing I got out of big Buff departure is how his use with the Jets on the PP, his point totals, well, he suddenly was a darling to the press, and an All-Star player. I loved the way he played, but I think most didn't think he had anywhere near the "inflated value" the echos of raves he get from the announcers and press, but that is just it, We watch and our team acquires a...guy...and we read their out of market opinions, on how great he is, and that has me, you, the hawk faithful all over full of anticipation that "this IS the impact guy!" Sometimes an ownership can actually bring in guys who grow into a smart hockey CLUB and any an ALL can be a Bickell.

I just wanted to add I think Seabrook was pretty big in that comeback too, both him and Keith were really something in the playoffs when the games mattered.
- breadbag

With you there.

Hockey's Cup runs have heroes that "got" the "big rallying play" whether it was watching big Buff against the Canucks in that one Cup series, or Bickell in the other, or the previously mention !st series last Cup Preds _ Duncan Keith, or Dolly St. Laurent in '62, and that's why playoffs can /is so watchable. Players give such efforts and in some, it stays, as part of "a level up" in the improvement and the careers flourish.
I suspect that the hawk team top down won't stop with finding a top six.
Same on a top 3 they build the backend around.
They continue to patch their 7-12 forwards through the pipeline, and always having $ this early to outside patch an immediate fill.

Believe me, I think we fans have plenty good chance to have enough well mannered kids they can advance throughout the line up, some ending with like those Bickell playoff heroes.

What was always the funniest thing I got out of big Buff departure is how his use with the Jets on the PP, his point totals, well, he suddenly was a darling to the press, and an All-Star player. I loved the way he played, but I think most didn't think he had anywhere near the "inflated value" the echos of raves he get from the announcers and press, but that is just it, We watch and our team acquires a...guy...and we read their out of market opinions, on how great he is, and that has me, you, the hawk faithful all over full of anticipation that "this IS the impact guy!" Sometimes an ownership can actually bring in guys who grow into a smart hockey CLUB and any an ALL can be a Bickell.
- wiz1901

I worked with the Superior Court Judiciary of British Columbia in the early 2000s. I had to go to Prince George to do some work. The main judge there at the time, His Honourable Judge Paret, and I were talking hockey when it came up I was a Blackhawks fan.

He asked me to join him in his chambers where the had one wall dedicated to Dustin. He said "this guy will be the unicorn that the Blackhawks have been looking for and if developed properly, will win a cup for Chicago." He was correct, even though the Hawks were at their lowest point of the 2000s at the time