Carolina - If you are an NHL team and you are in the playoffs and still losing money you should not be an NHL team

Atlanta - If you have only made the playoffs once in team history and have done nothing to endear any fan following in a not hockey market you should not be in the NHL.

Phoenix - If you are in bankruptcy court and play in a city where more people are interested in watching Spga tour events then you should not be in the NHL

Tampa Bay, Panthers - If you are a team in florida and only have had one memorable season to speak of in your history then you should not be in the NHL.

New York Islanders - If your team viability depends on the approval of a monstrous development that will be funded through public money and a crazy owner then you are SOL and there are two other teams in the area that are better then you should not be in the NHL

Finally Nashville should move to Canada.
- danielmacd

get ur info straight!!!!!!

People that think Buffalo should be out don't know fuc k about hockey. We have been in the top 5 in attendance since the lockout. Over 5,000 people have payed 100 dollers on the season tickit waiting list. Our season tickits are up to 15,000 know and you would rather get rid of a team that has never won yet still shows passion for thier team. If you lived here you would know but seriously we love, breath, sleep, and eat hockey here just like a Canadien team. But the 13,000 crowds on the Island are great, so is Carolina and there fan base. If you truly believe Buffalo should be out then you prob need a reality check or something because then you don't know what's right for hockey. If Pitt is still a team then BUFFALo will always be a team. They are hockeytown USA along w Minn, DEt, and Philly. We are holding the wjc in 2010 and hosted the first winter classic but according to some really stupid fans on this board we don't deserve a team more then Tampa or Florida. This is a complete JOKE!
- SabresOnAWarpath

Alright, you've got the facts to back it up. So we're looking 6 years from now. 2015. If BUF isn't heading out, who is?

Kick out any team that has not won a Stanley Cup.

Or any team that has not one a Stanley Cup since 1968... you know who you are...
- jimmc7722

And the whole NHL would goto crap!!

No canucks leafs sens minni chicago and blues..........

You Canadians are ingrates, Bettman helped save Vancouver and Edmonton when your dollar was weak but please continue to be mis-informed.
- FirstClass

External forces however, it was not the way he's defending American teams who have basically never turned a profit in a decade, Nashville may have I'm not sure, but I am almost certain the Oil had had at least one profitable season, same with Vancouver.

This has been a respectful conversation, especially being a Preds fan for 11 years.

But, I want to know, and please try and be reasonable...

Why should Nashville go? Obviously we have had our struggles, but we have been making money as of late. We are a non-traditional market, but we are growing. If you don't believe it, research the youth hockey movement. It's seriously phenomenal.

I kind of feel like Nashville is, and has been, the kid brother that can never break in.

Why is this?

You Canadians are ingrates, Bettman helped save Vancouver and Edmonton when your dollar was weak but please continue to be mis-informed.
- FirstClass

vancouver was fine........ownership was always fine in vancouver
Ingrates?
How about the nhl welfare system that the canucks owner pays almost 20 mill a year for so nashville pheonix and the islanders to stay in the NHL

And the whole NHL would goto crap!!

No canucks leafs sens minni chicago and blues..........
- jakenewton

We have to start somewhere...

You Canadians are ingrates, Bettman helped save Vancouver and Edmonton when your dollar was weak but please continue to be mis-informed.
- FirstClass

Alright, so why don't we, without using the word ingrates, let this guy know how it could happen in Canada without it being a Bettman-based conspiracy. Wasn't too long ago that all the Canadian teams except the Leafs could have plausibly dropped off the map...

vancouver was fine........ownership was always fine in vancouver
Ingrates?
How about the nhl welfare system that the canucks owner pays almost 20 mill a year for so nashville pheonix and the islanders to stay in the NHL
- jakenewton

u have no idea what ur talking abouts its all bs

Shawn, this is a horrible idea. Why would you stir the pot, yet again, knowing that this would just turn into a flamefest against expansion/southern market teams? You're just perpetuating the idea that hockey doesn't belong in non-traditional markets.

Cheap journalism, IMO.

Shawn, this is a horrible idea. Why would you stir the pot, yet again, knowing that this would just turn into a flamefest against expansion/southern market teams? You're just perpetuating the idea that hockey doesn't belong in non-traditional markets.

Cheap journalism, IMO.
- ProudestMonkey

This has been a respectful conversation, especially being a Preds fan for 11 years.

But, I want to know, and please try and be reasonable...

Why should Nashville go? Obviously we have had our struggles, but we have been making money as of late. We are a non-traditional market, but we are growing. If you don't believe it, research the youth hockey movement. It's seriously phenomenal.

I kind of feel like Nashville is, and has been, the kid brother that can never break in.

Why is this?
- jmayfield

I honestly wonder if it has as much to do with Nashville as it does with perceptions that there is a double-standard as far as buying and relocating teams goes, something that definately got amplified with the downfall and poor vetting of Boots. Not saying that I subscribe to this, but I do wonder if this is more the reason that a hate-on for Nashville specifically...

No I do not. Compare the numbers from 06, after the lockout, to 07 right after winning the cup, to before the lockout. The year before the lockout they had just over 12k on average. Now they're at 16.5k, down from 17.3k two years ago and slightly down from 16.6k a year ago. Are they the worst? No, however currently the worst has no FLA teams either on a strict numbers basis.
- keslover17

Their season ticket sales went up in both down years after the cup win, even though the team was on the outside looking in. And I would say you'd be hard pressed to find any fanbase that is "excited" when their team is losing. I think Loyal might be a better word.

Just saying, there are about 8 teams I'd can before the Hurricanes, from an unbiased perspective. 29 from a biased one.

I honestly wonder if it has as much to do with Nashville as it does with perceptions that there is a double-standard as far as buying and relocating teams goes, something that definately got amplified with the downfall and poor vetting of Boots. Not saying that I subscribe to this, but I do wonder if this is more the reason that a hate-on for Nashville specifically...
- shawn_gates

It's a huge reason people hate on Bettman!

This has been a respectful conversation, especially being a Preds fan for 11 years.

But, I want to know, and please try and be reasonable...

Why should Nashville go? Obviously we have had our struggles, but we have been making money as of late. We are a non-traditional market, but we are growing. If you don't believe it, research the youth hockey movement. It's seriously phenomenal.

I kind of feel like Nashville is, and has been, the kid brother that can never break in.

Why is this?
- jmayfield

I wouldn't take it personally.

People just don't know much about other teams and there markets.

Nashville is an easy target.

Look @ Pittsburgh a few years ago. They could fill the arena. Now look.

Detroit... you couldn't get tickets... now you can walk up to the ticket window and get tickets.

I wouldn't take it personally.

People just don't know much about other teams and there markets.

Nashville is an easy target.

Look @ Pittsburgh a few years ago. They could fill the arena. Now look.

Detroit... you couldn't get tickets... now you can wal up to the ticket window and get tickets.
- jimmc7722

They picked in the top 5, 4 times. They should be good!

I'm pretty annoyed this conversation keeps coming up anyway. all it manages to do is upset us smaller fanbase teams when we get attacked (and often rightfully so, within the context of the argument). However, why not talk about who is most likely to get moved? That's a more pressing topic than this BS.

Then there’s the Joe Blow side of me who likes to stir the pot a little bit by raising these hypotheticals with myself and others!

I'm sure.

Hope it's fun for you sitting in front of the laptop with some Jergens and a box of tissues, trying to drum up stupid flame war.

I'm sure.

Hope it's fun for you sitting in front of the laptop with some Jergens and a box of tissues, trying to drum up stupid flame war.
- caneshockeyguy

Ditto.

Shawn, this is a horrible idea. Why would you stir the pot, yet again, knowing that this would just turn into a flamefest against expansion/southern market teams? You're just perpetuating the idea that hockey doesn't belong in non-traditional markets.

Cheap journalism, IMO.
- ProudestMonkey

Not meant to be a flame-fest by any means. What I'm trying to see is the opinion of readers in terms of what they think would happen under certain circumstances. In no way is this trying to perpetuate anything against non-traditional markets. In fact, if you take a look at my comments you'll see that if anything I'm trying to have people consider the fact that it could very well be a Canadian team that takes the fall in the process.

I'm asking people to do this in a respectful manner and I think for the most part people have been doing so. I have no investment in perpetuating any preconceived notions here. If anything I'd love to look at this whole idea from outside the box and move away from the idea that non-traditional teams are the most vulnerable...

Not meant to be a flame-fest by any means. What I'm trying to see is the opinion of readers in terms of what they think would happen under certain circumstances. In no way is this trying to perpetuate anything against non-traditional markets. In fact, if you take a look at my comments you'll see that if anything I'm trying to have people consider the fact that it could very well be a Canadian team that takes the fall in the process.

I'm asking people to do this in a respectful manner and I think for the most part people have been doing so. I have no investment in perpetuating any preconceived notions here. If anything I'd love to look at this whole idea from outside the box and move away from the idea that non-traditional teams are the most vulnerable...
- shawn_gates

But did you honestly think that people were going to come on here and not list half the southeast division + Phoenix? It doesn't seem like this is progressing the debate past where it's already been as much as spinning the wheels. Did anybody here really "think outside the box?"

I like it. Relegate the team to the AHL like they do in soccer.
- Martin Cinzar

I want SOME North American league to set up a relegation/promotion thing... Would be perfect for Major League BAseball........ but this isn't BaseballBuzz, is it?

I'm pretty annoyed this conversation keeps coming up anyway. all it manages to do is upset us smaller fanbase teams when we get attacked (and often rightfully so, within the context of the argument). However, why not talk about who is most likely to get moved? That's a more pressing topic than this BS.
- CanesRallyCry

If anything something like this is a good opportunity for smaller fanbase teams to correct conceptions of people who are not from that area. I think people have been pretty respectful with the comments, and at the same time I think people would be open to hearing other perspectives, as would I, which is one of the reasons I posed the question.

Great discussion topic.....I had to leave the room, my wife is yelling and cussing cause the Bachelorette lost its sound on tv!

Wow.....you are just waiting for mud to start being slung in this one.

I'll give my six:

1) My favorite life long team, the Islanders. We can't deny it, we do not draw well and we are almost 3 decades away from our dynasty with not much to cheer about since. I think that the Lighthouse project would save us but without, LI would probably lose a team.

2) Atlanta. They have a nice building in the center of town but Atlanta was spoiled with 13 pennents (sp?) by the Braves and getting people in the building on hockey night has been tough. It is too bad because the in-game entertainment is top notch.

3) Florida. Sorry FLA, it's just not working near you. Sure, you had the one good run but since then there has been nothing to cheer about. Chalk it up to just having too nice weather in December.

4) Phoenix. Even with the Great One it's not going to work. They build an arena not near downtown (that is right I think) and they have no real rival. I loved the "white out" but I think in some parallel universe the Jets are thriving still in Winnipeg.

5) Nashville. They were close to being moved a few years and from what I am hearing they are still not as popular as the Elvis look-a-like contests that happen every Saturday down there.

6) The New York Rangers...........Just kidding.....the Islander in me couldn't help himself...

6) Buffalo.....This is probably a big surprise but from what I can gather (from the Buffalo fans that actually have a Sabres bar here in Baltimore) that they don't spend money as much as they need to compete and their popularity is waning. Plus, with Bastille taking a team to Southern Ontario, they are going to be in huge trouble at the gate (this and the new Passport rules crossing the USA/Canada border).

Special Mention. Carolina. If they hadn't been doing so well these past years they would be a lock but them like the Devils keep playing pretty well and it's tough to contract teams that have a good strategy. I would also say the Devils since they have trouble drawing and their new building isn't exactly in the safest place in NJ.

Well, I'm sure I've made mistakes here but I'm just speculating.
- clebo99

You sure have. Buffalo has most of their games sold out and had a 95% renewal rate on season tickets, plus added and additional 1,500 and still have thousands on the waiting list. The Winter Classic was named sport event of the year for 2008 by Business Week. The 2011 IIHF World Junior Hockey Championship will be held in Buffalo and paid for by the Sabres.