burke is irish, wont happen
- Dozzer

racist...

runs for to calm himself with a drink.

alright dozzer... where are you on this Kadri/Frattin thing?
- truth.serum

Let me help out:

As Kadri is currently awaiting an MRI to diagnose a suspected sprained knee, perhaps we don't need to have this great debate at this point in time.

Not apples to apples. Frattin is nearly 3 yrs older than Kadri.

It's his first camp and he's the golden boy who can do no wrong - much like Kadri was in his first camp.

Frattin has more giveaways per game than Kadri this preseason, but the commentators don't rave about them because no one's made an issue of it yet. Kadri has a history of giveaways, so he makes 1 or 2 in a game (Saturday) and gets raked over the coals.

Frattin has 4 similar giveaways entering the zone in the same game, and no one says poop.

They're being measured with different sticks.
- Big_Lightnin

Yeah I noticed that with other players too. Frattin has played well though, and put up good points on the board. Kadri seems as though he hasn't found the chemistry with anyone yet. Kadri has more natural skill, but Frattin is better in his own end. They are different players going for a 3rd line spot, and I think that's why people have him over Kadri at this point.

Not apples to apples. Frattin is nearly 3 yrs older than Kadri.

It's his first camp and he's the golden boy who can do no wrong - much like Kadri was in his first camp.

Frattin has more giveaways per game than Kadri this preseason, but the commentators don't rave about them because no one's made an issue of it yet. Kadri has a history of giveaways, so he makes 1 or 2 in a game (Saturday) and gets raked over the coals.

Frattin has 4 similar giveaways entering the zone in the same game, and no one says poop.

They're being measured with different sticks.
- Big_Lightnin

sorry man, disagree... Kaedri still looks lost out there and stops in his tracks far too often

Frattin's game is direct. He hits hard, skates hard and shoots the puck when he can...

racist...

runs for to calm himself with a drink.
- The Law

I'm assuming you will see your 14 brothers and sisters at the pub.

It is after 10:30 am, after all.

Not apples to apples. Frattin is nearly 3 yrs older than Kadri.

It's his first camp and he's the golden boy who can do no wrong - much like Kadri was in his first camp.

Frattin has more giveaways per game than Kadri this preseason, but the commentators don't rave about them because no one's made an issue of it yet. Kadri has a history of giveaways, so he makes 1 or 2 in a game (Saturday) and gets raked over the coals.

Frattin has 4 similar giveaways entering the zone in the same game, and no one says poop.

They're being measured with different sticks.
- Big_Lightnin

They're being lenient on Frattin because he also has 4 or 5 points so far playing on the third line....Kadri does not have that many. If Kadri was tearing it up offensively, not many people would be complaining right now.

sorry man, disagree... Kaedri still looks lost out there and stops in his tracks far too often

Frattin's game is direct. He hits hard, skates hard and shoots the puck when he can...
- truth.serum

Can we not institute a system whereby whenever he tries (and fails at) the "step over the blueline, hesitate, toe-drag" move, he's fined $5,000?

Doubt it and prove it.
- Unholy_Goalie

watch more closely

sadly nhl.com doesn't post realtime stats for preseason...

Saturday night when Healy was having his field day raping Kadri for his 2 giveaways, Frattin had 2 that were just as bad in the same period, and a couple more later.

And I'm not railing Frattin here. I love the kid and have suggested he could take MacArthur's spot. But he's still green as well and could definitely use more time in the AHL. He's got an NHL shot and is over 200lbs, so he looks like he belongs, but he's not walking on water the way some think he is.

alright dozzer... where are you on this Kadri/Frattin thing?
- truth.serum

at the start of pre-season i would of given it to kadri but not now. kadri has more skill but is lacking the fundamentals aspect of the game at this point imo

frattin looks like an NHLer, be it a young one, however I maintain the same concern about him as I always have.. when it comes to college prospects, its a flip of a coin to assess if they can play a full professional season, since college seasons arent even 3/4 as long as an NHL one.

lombardi over both of them if healthy.

Can we not institute a system whereby whenever he tries (and fails at) the "step over the blueline, hesitate, toe-drag" move, he's fined $5,000?
- Atomic Wedgie

In Kadri's defense, I noticed he was chipping and chasing a lot more often last night. The message is going to get through in that regard. It's just a matter of finding chemistry with someone.

Not apples to apples. Frattin is nearly 3 yrs older than Kadri.

It's his first camp and he's the golden boy who can do no wrong - much like Kadri was in his first camp.

Frattin has more giveaways per game than Kadri this preseason, but the commentators don't rave about them because no one's made an issue of it yet. Kadri has a history of giveaways, so he makes 1 or 2 in a game (Saturday) and gets raked over the coals.

Frattin has 4 similar giveaways entering the zone in the same game, and no one says poop.

They're being measured with different sticks.
- Big_Lightnin

I disagree and if you base this on the commentators as you're reasoning that we see Frattin ahead, then you are basically calling all of us blind. Frattin does not have as many giveaways as Kadri, Frattin has been head and shoulders above Kadri particularly in the defensive zone.

Now after saying this, I have high hopes for Kadri and refuse to give up on the guy, he is just not ready yet, especially mentally.

This is all my opinion only.

racist...

runs for to calm himself with a drink.
- The Law

i'm polish, fire away

well truthfully i'm a mutt breed, typical canadian lol

watch more closely

sadly nhl.com doesn't post realtime stats for preseason...
- Big_Lightnin

So you don't have proof. Great.

Kadri is creating giveaways for being selfish and stupid. Frattin has had giveaways that step from inexperience. There's a difference. Kadri should know better but ignores to make the right play.

First time I read that, I thought your wrote "PK" (yeah, I'm on crack).

Good thing I didn't write a post questioning your sanity.
- Atomic Wedgie

you could still write that post, if i havent given you a reason to question it yet I am sure its not far off

i'm polish, fire away

well truthfully i'm a mutt breed, typical canadian lol
- Dozzer

lol you like Poles

I disagree and if you base this on the commentators as you're reasoning that we see Frattin ahead, then you are basically calling all of us blind. Frattin does not have as many giveaways as Kadri, Frattin has been head and shoulders above Kadri particularly in the defensive zone.

Now after saying this, I have high hopes for Kadri and refuse to give up on the guy, he is just not ready yet, especially mentally.

This is all my opinion only.
- LeafMan

fire him...........i mean trade him

Can we not institute a system whereby whenever he tries (and fails at) the "step over the blueline, hesitate, toe-drag" move, he's fined $5,000?
- Atomic Wedgie

Or shot with a taser.

moreso 4-on-4 than on the PP though. PP mostly (ideally) spent set-up in the zone - open ice speed doesn't come into play as much.

Kessel and Lombardi on a 4on4 would be fun to watch
- Big_Lightnin

yeah it would, and lombardi is defensively responsible if I am not mistaken

lol you like Poles
- AdamFrench

no, i am a pole!

wait....

lol

I'm assuming you will see your 14 brothers and sisters at the pub.

It is after 10:30 am, after all.
- Atomic Wedgie

... only if they're awake.

In Kadri's defense, I noticed he was chipping and chasing a lot more often last night. The message is going to get through in that regard. It's just a matter of finding chemistry with someone.
- AnnGee44

Wow was the chip and chase in vogue last night, eh?

Nice to see the lunch bucket guys kept to a simple system and played it very well.

Although I'm not sure it will work as well against more experienced d-corps.

And while I'm evaluating last night's play, kudos to Ron Wilson.

I thought pulling shaky James Reimer at the end of the first period was the smart thing to do.

Once they put in confident James Reimer at the start of the second period, things seemed to settle down.

watch more closely

sadly nhl.com doesn't post realtime stats for preseason...

Saturday night when Healy was having his field day raping Kadri for his 2 giveaways, Frattin had 2 that were just as bad in the same period, and a couple more later.

And I'm not railing Frattin here. I love the kid and have suggested he could take MacArthur's spot. But he's still green as well and could definitely use more time in the AHL. He's got an NHL shot and is over 200lbs, so he looks like he belongs, but he's not walking on water the way some think he is.
- Big_Lightnin

here is the page for the leaf stats, just click on the recap icon

http://mapleleafs.nhl.com...b/schedule.htm?gameType=1

This is kind of the point. EVERY illegal/dangerous hit SHOULD be suspended. Who gives a (frank) if people get sick of it. Once the players figure out what's allowed and what's not, they either change the way they hit, or get suspended longer and longer. Either way, you get the bad hits out of the game, which is exactly his intention.
- Big_Lightnin

I'm not disagreeing with the intending effect of creating a deterrent.

But with the precedent that Shanny has set, we're looking at two possibilities:

a) There is a major suspension handed out almost once per night.

b) He lets his foot off the gas a little bit and gets ripped for being an inconsistent hypocrite and lose his credibility until the point where Colin Campbell looks like an upgrade.

Personally, I think we're headed for Option B. Rightly or wrongly, people will get sick of the endless suspensions and he will have to let some stuff slide.

At that point, the commitment to precedent setting, transparency, and consistency will go out the window and we're back to square one.

I'm not disagreeing with the intending effect of creating a deterrent.

But with the precedent that Shanny has set, we're looking at two possibilities:

a) There is a major suspension handed out almost once per night.

b) He lets his foot off the gas a little bit and gets ripped for being an inconsistent hypocrite and lose his credibility until the point where Colin Campbell looks like an upgrade.

Personally, I think we're headed for Option B. Rightly or wrongly, people will get sick of the endless suspensions and he will have to let some stuff slide.

At that point, the commitment to precedent setting, transparency, and consistency will go out the window and we're back to square one.
- Leeman4Gilmour

he should keep it up, its the only way the players will learn.. sadly its come down to this

I'm not disagreeing with the intending effect of creating a deterrent.

But with the precedent that Shanny has set, we're looking at two possibilities:

a) There is a major suspension handed out almost once per night.

b) He lets his foot off the gas a little bit and gets ripped for being an inconsistent hypocrite and lose his credibility until the point where Colin Campbell looks like an upgrade.

Personally, I think we're headed for Option B. Rightly or wrongly, people will get sick of the endless suspensions and he will have to let some stuff slide.

At that point, the commitment to precedent setting, transparency, and consistency will go out the window and we're back to square one.
- Leeman4Gilmour

Most of these endless suspensions are to 4th line goons.

Bring it on.

The NHL stuck to their guns with obstruction calls, and the game is miles better because of it.