And I think him getting that 10-12 minutes a night has really helped him find his way without too much pressure.

What I really like is that he is picking the corners on those shots from both sides of the net.
- MBFlyerfan

It was wrong to elevate him to top line when Giroux was out, but yes, the 4th line was what prepared him for another level of responsibility, he should have the 3rd line now "cemented", as his 2 way ability is not only good enough, but warranted as such

.

Bryz relies on his size and initial positioning to make saves. He isnt quick enough to adjust on deflections. Bob has great quickness. I remember several saves against the isles where Bob had saves off of deflections. They seem to get by Bryz way too often.
- thephillynut

Bryzgalov is plenty quick enough. There has been a good number of deflection goals scored on Bryzgalov that he had no chance on. Neither would Bobrovsky have had a chance on.

It was wrong to elevate him to top line when Giroux was out, but yes, the 4th line was what prepared him for another level of responsibility, he should have the 3rd line now "cemented", as his 2 way ability is not only good enough, but warranted as such
- puckhead17

I think so too. He has earned some more minutes, maybe on the PP. I like how his offensive skills are starting to come out a bit.

How would you rank our rookies in order?

Here is my list based on play so far:

Couturier
Read
Harry Z
Schenn
Gustafsson
Rinaldo
Bourdon
- stveshdy

I think Read has to be at the top of the list. Couturier has been great, no doubt, and I love his game. But Read has played on a top line almost all season and hasn't looked out of place at all. He scores, he kills penalties, he's been doing it all, and doing more of it game in game out than Couturier has (thus far). And his speed is a weapon Couturier will never be able to match.

Long term, I think Couturier may develop into a better player. But right now, Read is still the cream of the Flyers' rookie crop. At least imo.

Bryzgalov is plenty quick enough. There has been a good number of deflection goals scored on Bryzgalov that he had no chance on. Neither would Bobrovsky have had a chance on.
- MJL

everyone can chip in & take both sides of the argument on the deflected goals syndrome

it comes down to another 3 goals on 24 shots, 87%, after while how often can someone say his save % is attributed to the defense?

The first 2 against he had no chance on, the 3rd one? Well that's what separates a $5 million goalie from a $2 million goalie

Even Keith Jones states in the intro "that save % needs to come up"

Ridiculous. Do yourself a favor and look at the shooting percentages of the top goal scorers in the League. You'll see that Carter's percentages with the Flyers are in norm with other top goal scorers. Carter isn't playing averages. You have to be a good enough offensive player to get that many shots on net. You don't have the facts.
- MJL

Please do yourself a favor and look stuff up before typing...

League top goal scorers - Shot %
Stamkos 19.74
Kessel 15.69
Gaborik 16.67
Michalek 19.83
Toews 17.16

Looking at the list of top goal scorers... You have to get down to the 28th goal scorer in the league to find some one with a worst shot % than Carters...

Flyers top goal scorers - Shot %
Giroux 16.22
Hartnell 18.11
Jagr 13.33
Briere 11.50
Read 13.68

Even on the Flyers.... If given a chance to pick, I would not want Carter shooting the puck. Statistically, he is less likely to score a goal than our top guys.

Please do yourself a favor and look stuff up before typing...

League top goal scorers - Shot %
Stamkos 19.74
Kessel 15.69
Gaborik 16.67
Michalek 19.83
Toews 17.16

Looking at the list of top goal scorers... You have to get down to the 28th goal scorer in the league to find some one with a worst shot % than Carters...

Flyers top goal scorers - Shot %
Giroux 16.22
Hartnell 18.11
Jagr 13.33
Briere 11.50
Read 13.68

Even on the Flyers.... If given a chance to pick, I would not want Carter shooting the puck. Statistically, he is less likely to score a goal than our top guys.
- leon neon

Carter was known for his "parking shot wristers"

everyone can chip in & take both sides of the argument on the deflected goals syndrome

it comes down to another 3 goals on 24 shots, 87%, after while how often can someone say his save % is attributed to the defense?

The first 2 against he had no chance on, the 3rd one? Well that's what separates a $5 million goalie from a $2 million goalie

Even Keith Jones states in the intro "that save % needs to come up"
- puckhead17

Agree 100% and I'm tired of the "he needs to be better" talk. Everyone sounds like Andy Reid. The guy is a veteran, not a rookie. They gave big money to a goalie to get consistency in net, and all they've gotten is consistent mediocrity.

everyone can chip in & take both sides of the argument on the deflected goals syndrome

it comes down to another 3 goals on 24 shots, 87%, after while how often can someone say his save % is attributed to the defense?

The first 2 against he had no chance on, the 3rd one? Well that's what separates a $5 million goalie from a $2 million goalie

Even Keith Jones states in the intro "that save % needs to come up"
- puckhead17

I agree 100%. The 3rd goal last night is not one of those deflections that he had no chance on. It was a makeable save. For some reason, he didn't see the puck until it was through him.

everyone can chip in & take both sides of the argument on the deflected goals syndrome

it comes down to another 3 goals on 24 shots, 87%, after while how often can someone say his save % is attributed to the defense?

The first 2 against he had no chance on, the 3rd one? Well that's what separates a $5 million goalie from a $2 million goalie

Even Keith Jones states in the intro "that save % needs to come up"
- puckhead17

Hey Puckhead, as I'm sitting here enjoying my coffee and shaking off a hangover thought i'd offer you a cup too...

Please do yourself a favor and look stuff up before typing...

League top goal scorers - Shot %
Stamkos 19.74
Kessel 15.69
Gaborik 16.67
Michalek 19.83
Toews 17.16

Looking at the list of top goal scorers... You have to get down to the 28th goal scorer in the league to find some one with a worst shot % than Carters...

Flyers top goal scorers - Shot %
Giroux 16.22
Hartnell 18.11
Jagr 13.33
Briere 11.50
Read 13.68

Even on the Flyers.... If given a chance to pick, I would not want Carter shooting the puck. Statistically, he is less likely to score a goal than our top guys.
- leon neon

That's this year! Clearly in my reply, I said in Carter's years with the Flyers. This false argument has come up before. I've looked at the numbers extensively. And posted them before to refute that. Shall we do it again?
And I'm game to keep on discussing it with you, and will gladly provide the facts.
I'd want Carter shooting the puck if he was still with the Flyers. He was one of the top goal scorers in the League in his time with the Flyers.

Again?
- tangent_man

Some can never let things go.

This is the stuff that totally cracks me up. Carter has one of the best wrist shots in the entire League, and Couturier's actually goes in? Carter didn't score 46 goals one Season and for a 4 year span was one of the top goals scorers in the entire League. Where do these statements come from?
- MJL

MJL im sorry but you are wrong. Carter would skate down the right wing EVERY single time on a consistent basis and shoot for the left corner of the net, miss completely and then watch the puck go all the way around the boards and back into our zone. Have you seen Coots do anything boneheaded like that?

The goalie situation is tricky. I don't envy Laviolette.

Based on performance, you can certainly make a case that Bob deserves to play more. But the more Bob plays the less likely I think Bryz will find his game and become the goalie his contract demands. I think he has to play his way out of this, and while he's doing that, there are going to be some bumps in the road. But I feel we need to get that out of the way and play Bryz until he gets it together.

If I were coaching this team, I would look at the schedule for the next month or so and if there are, say 20 games, I would tell Bryz straight up that he's getting 17 of the 20 no matter what. Give Bob a game here or there to keep him involved a little bit, but tell Byrz right now that he's playing those 17 games and that this is his chance to get on a roll and me what he can do.

I know it shouldn't make a difference, but it seems to me that Lava's method of not telling the goalies who is starting until the day of the game may be wearing on Byrzgalov's confidence. I understand all the arguments why this shouldn't matter, and why he should earn his money no matter when he's told who's playing, etc., etc.

But some goalies have a tendency to be head cases, and Byrz seems to be one of those (as was plainly on display in 24/7, among other places). I think he needs a bit of special handling to maintain his confidence. In Phoenix, his status as the number 1 goalie was never in question. He never had to worry that if he played a bad game, that the team would insert Labarbara as the starter. He knew he'd be back in there next game no matter what. He certainly doesn't feel that way here. And certainly his own play has a lot to do with that. But if we ever want him to become the goalie we're paying for, we need to get him feeling that way. And I think the only way to do that is to play him, and play him a lot, and tell him up front that's what is going to happen.

MJL im sorry but you are wrong. Carter would skate down the right wing EVERY single time on a consistent basis and shoot for the left corner of the net, miss completely and then watch the puck go all the way around the boards and back into our zone. Have you seen Coots do anything boneheaded like that?
- Richieattack18

I don't even need to reply to this. It refutes itself.

As always, a good read, with a lot of spot on analysis.

With kids like Schenn and Couturier, one has to expect ups and downs. It seems one or the other will get a chance to step up into the top 6 now that JvR is down. Hopefully, they seize it.

As for the goalies, I'm repeating what I said on the gameday blog. I have been one of the biggest supporters, or at least defenders of Bryzgalov on here. I have faith he will turn things around, but at the same time, it's hard to not want to let Bob loose and see what he can do when he's playing the good teams, and not the Isles and Hurricanes.

I think Joe Russomanno has a valid point-Bob has played mostly poor teams, or at least mostly offensively inept teams. He has been better than Bryzgalov, but he's also faced lesser competition.

Looking at his game log, he's gotten the start against one real contender(Rangers twice) and two teams with good firepower(Toronto & Pittsburgh). So far he's started against Ottawa(before they turned things around), Toronto, Winnipeg, Devils, Carolina, Winnipeg, Isles, Montreal, Rangers, Montreal, Dallas, Pittsburgh, Rangers, Carolina, Isles.

That's 2 starts each against Montreal, Carolina, Winnipeg and the Isles. I think it's time to start playing the kid against the better teams. Over the next 4 games, I'd give Bryz the Wild and Devils and Bob the Isles and Bruins. Alternate them in each game.
- Jsaquella

Hey thanks for the props JSaq


But yea I have no problem with giving Bob some of these big starts and seeing what he does with them. If he can put in performances against NJ and Boston this weekend like he did in his last two starts then by all means... make him the starter I suppose until Bryz can win it back. If he can't then, which should happen anyway, the Flyers really need to look at the fact their team's defensive woes are too much their goalies can't keep pace.

Which besides all the trade specualtion and this guy v.s that guy that ain't here no more talk I'd like to read more elaboration on how to fix things like, per say the top line that suddenly looks "lost in the woods"

Carter takes a lot of low percentage shots from the wing without screens it's an easy save.
I like Carter but IMO Couturier could possibly be a selke winner.

Brys has to be better and for everyone to be quick to blame team D is making excuses.
No, he isn't getting much help to many times.
When your getting paid to be the top guy and are expected to be an top goalie then it's not unreasonable to expect him to steal a point or game here and there.

I want to see the guy succeed and the team D get it's act together.
Maybe that's just part of a big turnover in the lineup thing.
I expected growing pains this season so it's not unrealistic to go through peaks and valleys as a team.
Hopefully they can avoid the second half of the season crash.

The goalie situation is tricky. I don't envy Laviolette.

Based on performance, you can certainly make a case that Bob deserves to play more. But the more Bob plays the less likely I think Bryz will find his game and become the goalie his contract demands. I think he has to play his way out of this, and while he's doing that, there are going to be some bumps in the road. But I feel we need to get that out of the way and play Bryz until he gets it together.

If I were coaching this team, I would look at the schedule for the next month or so and if there are, say 20 games, I would tell Bryz straight up that he's getting 17 of the 20 no matter what. Give Bob a game here or there to keep him involved a little bit, but tell Byrz right now that he's playing those 17 games and that this is his chance to get on a roll and me what he can do.

I know it shouldn't make a difference, but it seems to me that Lava's method of not telling the goalies who is starting until the day of the game may be wearing on Byrzgalov's confidence. I understand all the arguments why this shouldn't matter, and why he should earn his money no matter when he's told who's playing, etc., etc.

But some goalies have a tendency to be head cases, and Byrz seems to be one of those (as was plainly on display in 24/7, among other places). I think he needs a bit of special handling to maintain his confidence. In Phoenix, his status as the number 1 goalie was never in question. He never had to worry that if he played a bad game, that the team would insert Labarbara as the starter. He knew he'd be back in there next game no matter what. He certainly doesn't feel that way here. And certainly his own play has a lot to do with that. But if we ever want him to become the goalie we're paying for, we need to get him feeling that way. And I think the only way to do that is to play him, and play him a lot, and tell him up front that's what is going to happen.
- BringBack25

I was in agreement with this before, but I'm moving away from it. What if Bryzgalov doesn't improve his play in those 20 games? How many points will have been thrown away due to insufficient goaltending? The time is come to play the best player and forget about who was brought in for what, and who's making what. I think it's time that Bryzgalov is shown that he is going to have earn playing time.

I don't even need to reply to this. It refutes itself.
- MJL

I'm more of the anti carter crowd but even I have to admit that saying Everytime he skated down the right side... it went back the other way for a goal" is a huge exaggeration. It happened from time to time but not all the time and probably not even a majority, and missed shot statistics don't prove or disprove that.

MJL im sorry but you are wrong. Carter would skate down the right wing EVERY single time on a consistent basis and shoot for the left corner of the net, miss completely and then watch the puck go all the way around the boards and back into our zone. Have you seen Coots do anything boneheaded like that?
- Richieattack18

Cater is as streaky a forward as Boucher is as streaky a goalie, both of there streaky natures should be common phrase as say the "mendoza line"

Agree 100% and I'm tired of the "he needs to be better" talk. Everyone sounds like Andy Reid. The guy is a veteran, not a rookie. They gave big money to a goalie to get consistency in net, and all they've gotten is consistent mediocrity.
- thephillynut

Maybe the defense needs to get better. Bzy view during most games is the asses of the opposing team. We need a defenseman that can clear the crease. There is a lot of trade talk, hopefully we get a big body with a nasty edge to his game. We don't need a puck moving defenseman.

I thought you'd like that
- JoeRussomanno

Oh the Sunday morning hangover


You would have probably still had whether we won or not

I'm more of the anti carter crowd but even I have to admit that saying Everytime he skated down the right side... it went back the other way for a goal" is a huge exaggeration. It happened from time to time but not all the time and probably not even a majority, and missed shot statistics don't prove or disprove that.
- JoeRussomanno

The numbers clearly point out that Carter hits the net the overwhelming majority of the time with the Flyers. And that number is also in the norm with the top shot producers in the League.

I was in agreement with this before, but I'm moving away from it. What if Bryzgalov doesn't improve his play in those 20 games? How many points will have been thrown away due to insufficient goaltending? The time is come to play the best player and forget about who was brought in for what, and who's making what. I think it's time that Bryzgalov is shown that he is going to have earn playing time.
- MJL

I was also for letting Bryz play himself out of his funk however, if he just continues to put together bad games what is the point. At the end of the day the Flyers goal should be to win. Winning has been happening a lot more when Bobrovsky has been in net so play him.

I was in agreement with this before, but I'm moving away from it. What if Bryzgalov doesn't improve his play in those 20 games? How many points will have been thrown away due to insufficient goaltending? The time is come to play the best player and forget about who was brought in for what, and who's making what. I think it's time that Bryzgalov is shown that he is going to have earn playing time.
- MJL

Like I said above, I think you give Bob starts against Boston and NJ and see what happens. I hope I'm wrong but at this time I don't think Bob has much better than a 3 goal performance against Boston with a softie in there. I just think the constant pressure from the several high quality scoring chances the Flyers allow their goalies to face leads to these soft goals. I mean I just saw Thomas look very normal in a loss to Carolina and Vancouver when his team played poorly.

Perhaps Bryzgalov is to us what Khabibulin was to Chicago, I don't know but I do agree the time has come to give the best players the ice time. If not in a conference this tight we could easily be out of contention for the playoffs.