In Flyers speak a long time is 2 years
- Buts16

I love the idea that you've mentioned -- for a few days now -- of acquiring Robyn Regehr from Buffalo. He has a NMC, but hopeful he'd waive it to come here.

they had johanson and he's not too shabby.
- isaiah520

True, but from all accounts he wasn't being made available. Lombardi had refused to even discuss Schenn with other teams until Richards was made available. Perhaps Howson was doing the same with Johanson

I love the idea that you've mentioned -- for a few days now -- of acquiring Robyn Regehr from Buffalo. He has a NMC, but hopeful he'd waive it to come here.
- bradleyc4

I have coveted Regehr for years. Always had a fantasy of getting him and Iggy from Calgary.

they shouldn't have cut him slack at that time and then suspend later for nonsense

address the specific action only
- Don'tForgetTocchet

Star players do get suspended, but generally, a star level player gets a lesser suspension than a grinder. For instance, say Matt Bradley threw the same hit Ovechkin did. I bet he gets more games. If a Cooke or Rinaldo threw the same hit, they get a lot more games.
- Jsaquella

Now that part I will agree with. People pay to see Ovechkin not Cooke or Rinaldo which is why the NHL gives less games. Thats something that will never change bc this league is all about "stars".

Now that part I will agree with. People pay to see Ovechkin not Cooke or Rinaldo which is why the NHL gives less games. Thats something that will never change bc this league is all about "stars".
- stveshdy

Hell, Malkin is a dirty guy, or at the very least a nasty SOB when he gets pissed off. If he was a third liner, he'd have several suspensions.

Not really.

Schenn was a known quantity, a kid almost universally regarded as one of the top prospects in hockey.

Had Couturier gone when he should have, in the top 4 or 5, then the Flyers end up with a kid like Hamilton, Zibanejad or Scheifele...not bad players, but not as good as Couturier-who was the top rated prospect in the draft before mono hurt his stock.
- Jsaquella

Yes but Voracek is considered to have more potential then Simmonds. I can agree the Schenn is greater then the average 8th pick, but Voracek is greater then Simmonds, at least potential wise at the time of the deal... So IMO the deals were very similar.

Hell, Malkin is a dirty guy, or at the very least a nasty SOB when he gets pissed off. If he was a third liner, he'd have several suspensions.
- Jsaquella

Yup. Nothing is going to change. The stars will be protected. Ovechkin had to be suspended bc it was obvious and a national televised games. They had to set an example that even "star" players can be suspended. It is what it is but Rinaldo has to be smarter before leaving his feet.

Yes but Voracek is considered to have more potential then Simmonds. I can agree the Schenn is greater then the average 8th pick, but Voracek is greater then Simmonds, at least potential wise at the time of the deal... So IMO the deals were very similar.
- RooNosHockey

Voracek and Simmonds were seen as similar players, or at least had similar production as NHLers. Both had knocks on them, for whatever reason.

You know, I would love to go back to some of the blogs during pre-season and see all the people that said we should send Couturier back to minors for another year of development.... I was one of those that said he should stay because he would learn more at the NHL level...

Yes, they absolutely did shut things down a lot better against the Leafs than they did against Detroit.

That's where the issue lies. If the players can't read and react, how much onus is on the coaches to start restricting their freedom?
- Jsaquella

Well the onus is already on the Coach. It's his philosophy and teaching to play the offensive side of the puck with a very high level of aggression. I personally think that's the wrong way to play. This team has no secondary forecheck, and lacks a neutral zone checking presence. If you beat their deep forecheck, it easy street through the neutral zone not to mention potential odd man rushes. The best teams read and react and check the puck all over the ice. They don't over comitt to an aggressive 2 man forecheck when there's not an opportunity to get there. And they make it difficult all the way up the ice. And they make you fight for every inch of ice. That's not there for this team on a regular basis. And a lot of it is on the players also.

Its either a suspendable hit or it isnt. I dont care if you are Matt Cooke or Martin St. Louis. Dont suspend a guy for a hit that doesnt fit a suspendable description because he has been suspended in the past for suspendable hits.

By doing that it makes everything hard to ascertain what is or isnt suspension worthy.
- jak521

agreed. just cause shanahan blew it by not suspending him before doesn't mean he should further bastardize the disciplinary process by doing a makeup for a hit that wasn't worthy of a decree.

Voracek and Simmonds were seen as similar players, or at least had similar production as NHLers. Both had knocks on them, for whatever reason.
- Jsaquella

They had similar numbers, but I'm pretty sure most people thought Voracek has/had a higher Ceiling then Simmonds.

Well the onus is already on the Coach. It's his philosophy and teaching to play the offensive side of the puck with a very high level of aggression. I personally think that's the wrong way to play. This team has no secondary forecheck, and lacks a neutral zone checking presence. If you beat their deep forecheck, it easy street through the neutral zone not to mention potential odd man rushes. The best teams read and react and check the puck all over the ice. They don't over comitt to an aggressive 2 man forecheck when there's not an opportunity to get there. And they make it difficult all the way up the ice. And they make you fight for every inch of ice. That's not there for this team on a regular basis. And a lot of it is on the players also.
- MJL

I guess what I'm trying to say is, at what point does the coach need to be more proactive in restraining freedom to attack, rather than rely on the players to read and react?

It's definitely a two fold issue.

They had similar numbers, but I'm pretty sure most people though Voracek has/had a higher Ceiling then Simmonds.
- RooNosHockey

Probably, but it wasn't like people saw Voracek as a future stud and Simmonds as a career third liner. I don't think the difference was that great.

Voracek and Simmonds were seen as similar players, or at least had similar production as NHLers. Both had knocks on them, for whatever reason.
- Jsaquella

the prob w// jake is that for all of his hustle, he's just not very productive. still think he could have leino type #s eventually.

Yup. Nothing is going to change. The stars will be protected. Ovechkin had to be suspended bc it was obvious and a national televised games. They had to set an example that even "star" players can be suspended. It is what it is but Rinaldo has to be smarter before leaving his feet.
- stveshdy

The only star that won't be protected is G. What a disgrace....

Probably, but it wasn't like people saw Voracek as a future stud and Simmonds as a career third liner. I don't think the difference was that great.
- Jsaquella

Yea, probally about the same difference that people saw between Schenn, and an 8th overall pick. I'm just saying the value just about equals out. Schenn is better then an 8th overall pick, how much better is an unknown... and Voracek is slightly better value then Simmonds... The return for Carter and Richards was about even, and IMO both players could have gotten the same package from both teams...

the prob w// jake is that for all of his hustle, he's just not very productive. still think he could have leino type #s eventually.
- isaiah520

When you consider how young Voracek is, he still has time to develop into a player. I havent seen much of him in Columbus, but it looks like he is learning a lot from Jagr on how to use your body to protect the puck. I just hope Jagr shows him how to shoot like he used too..

Yea, probally about the same difference that people saw between Schenn, and an 8th overall pick. I'm just saying the value just about equals out. Schenn is better then an 8th overall pick, how much better is an unknown... and Voracek is slightly better value then Simmonds... The return for Carter and Richards was about even, and IMO both players could have gotten the same package from both teams...
- RooNosHockey

carter had less value than I thought...even less now. he just needs to be in the right situation because he's prob not a guy that is a leader...more of a nice complimentary piece.

When you consider how young Voracek is, he still has time to develop into a player. I havent seen much of him in Columbus, but it looks like he is learning a lot from Jagr on how to use your body to protect the puck. I just hope Jagr shows him how to shoot like he used too..
- RooNosHockey

Speaking of Jagr he would have to take a paycut for me to even consider bringing him back next year. I have concerns about his age and health. I think his work ethic is good for the younger players to see but I dont know if he is worth the cap hit in the end for the production.

Yea, probally about the same difference that people saw between Schenn, and an 8th overall pick. I'm just saying the value just about equals out. Schenn is better then an 8th overall pick, how much better is an unknown... and Voracek is slightly better value then Simmonds... The return for Carter and Richards was about even, and IMO both players could have gotten the same package from both teams...
- RooNosHockey

If Schenn had been in the 2011 draft, he'd have been a top two or three pick. Maybe even the top pick.

When you consider how young Voracek is, he still has time to develop into a player. I havent seen much of him in Columbus, but it looks like he is learning a lot from Jagr on how to use your body to protect the puck. I just hope Jagr shows him how to shoot like he used too..
- RooNosHockey

he can really wire the puck when he bears down, but he can't control it just yet. I'd move him for a schenn level dman.

the prob w// jake is that for all of his hustle, he's just not very productive. still think he could have leino type #s eventually.
- isaiah520

This is very true. He looks very dangerous when carrying the puck but I really don't think he sees the ice very well yet. He fails to see a play develop. It's somewhat disappointing but he is still young. I would be fine if they resigned him to similar money. To me he hasn't warranted a raise to that 3.5 mil mark.

If Schenn had been in the 2011 draft, he'd have been a top two or three pick. Maybe even the top pick.
- Jsaquella

still don't get EDM taking RNH. how are you going to improve drafting small skill guys w/ that back line. Larson has lived up to the hype and I find it hard to believe that RNH was rated that much higher. at some point, needs matter and now EDM is scrambling for dmen, re-signing slugs like sutton...makes no sense