That's idiotic. I get that you're on the "Schenn sucks" bandwagon but there's no such thing as addition by subtraction unless the guy is a lockeroom issue and there is literally zero evidence to show that, on the contrary Schenn looked like he was well liked and even had some leadership skills as well.

Schenn was slow footed but he's a defensive dman, he's not Drew Doughty skating up the rink and putting up points (although he did have more points than Gunnarson who is an offensive dman), he's a big crushing hitting dman (was among the league leaders in hits for every year of his career so far), he was second in the team in PIM and in fighting majors (tied with Rosehill and behind Brown) and his plus minus was -6, which isn't great but when you look at the rest of the dmen it's not that bad.
Franson: -1
Gardiner: -2
Schenn: -6
Gunnarsson: -9
Phaneuf: -10
Komisarek: -13
Liles: -14

I know I'm not happy about the prospect of going up against him when we play Philly. Hopefully now that he's playing on another team when we go up against him you'll be able to realize what he's capable when he's pounding our forwards into the boards.
- deerow84

You take Schenn and Komi off the ice you automatically improve

The Dion Phaneuf School of Defense. Yup.
- gravyface

Except that was only this last season, when his skating took a dive.

You know, as a 22 year old defensive Dman, getting few offensive zone starts, and no PP time, he put up 22 points, an increase in pace over his last season, despite reduced ice time. He's shown year over year offensive improvements since being drafted, and he's got a very good first pass.

The reason he was drafted so high was because he had more offensive potential than your average shutdown Dman. Don't be surprised in a few years if he's in the mid-to-high 30s.
- Feeling Glucky?

Perhaps and I'm not giving up on the guy, but he has alot of work to do to be consistently good defensively first and foremost and then worry about the points. He hasn't shown he can do the former yet.

You know, as a 22 year old defensive Dman, getting few offensive zone starts, and no PP time, he put up 22 points, an increase in pace over his last season, despite reduced ice time. He's shown year over year offensive improvements since being drafted, and he's got a very good first pass.

The reason he was drafted so high was because he had more offensive potential than your average shutdown Dman. Don't be surprised in a few years if he's in the mid-to-high 30s.
- Feeling Glucky?

Except that was only this last season, when his skating took a dive.
- Feeling Glucky?

He's been significantly more responsible defensively since coming to Toronto: point totals down, huge hits down, but that's to be expected with maturity.

OMG. So excited. Today's the day Schultz picks the Canucks!

Perhaps and I'm not giving up on the guy, but he has alot of work to do to be consistently good defensively first and foremost and then worry about the points. He hasn't shown he can do the former yet.
- gravyface

He's shown the former, up till this last season, when his skating disappeared.

Great rookie season, struggled at the start of his sophomore season(recovering from an injury that kept him from training), awesome 3rd season, bad 4th- after focusing too much on bulking up his upper body.


Underhill would have done wonders for him, as would a controlled defensive system, maybe being paired with a guy who didn't leave him out to dry every single shift.

OMG. So excited. Today's the day Schultz picks the Canucks!
- weirdoh

Schultz gives me the sh!tz.

He's been significantly more responsible defensively since coming to Toronto: point totals down, huge hits down, but that's to be expected with maturity.
- gravyface

Talking about Schenn, but yes, Phaneuf has improved defensively as well.

- faceto27

Not my fault you can't see whats there.

He's shown the former, up till this last season, when his skating disappeared.

Great rookie season, struggled at the start of his sophomore season(recovering from an injury that kept him from training), awesome 3rd season, bad 4th- after focusing too much on bulking up his upper body.


Underhill would have done wonders for him, as would a controlled defensive system, maybe being paired with a guy who didn't leave him out to dry every single shift.
- Feeling Glucky?

Again. Consistency. He's two for four so far.

Not my fault you can't see whats there.
- Feeling Glucky?

Apparently neither can Carlye and the rest of the Leafs brain trust

Again. Consistency. He's two for four so far.
- gravyface

A bad start following an injury doesn't show inconsistency... It shows he's not a robot.

Once he got back up to speed, he was excellent for the remainder of that season.

Apparently neither can Carlye and the rest of the Leafs brain trust
- faceto27

Why, because they traded him for a guy the same age that fills a need up front?


Yea, he must suck big time.

A bad start following an injury doesn't show inconsistency... It shows he's not a robot.

Once he got back up to speed, he was excellent for the remainder of that season.
- Feeling Glucky?

Dude, 2 of his 4 seasons have been good. Don't give me conditioning, non-factor injuries, defensive pairings excuses: he just flat out has not been consistently good defensively and for a supposed "shutdown" defenseman, that's not good enough.

Again. Consistency. He's two for four so far.
- gravyface

if you're worried about consistency you're not going to be a big jvr fan

Why, because they traded him for a guy the same age that fills a need up front?


Yea, he must suck big time.
- Feeling Glucky?

If he was all that you think he is, then no team would have traded Schenn

Fact of the matter, he is a legend in your own mind

Dude, 2 of his 4 seasons have been good. Don't give me conditioning, non-factor injuries, defensive pairings excuses: he just flat out has not been consistently good defensively and for a supposed "shutdown" defenseman, that's not good enough.
- gravyface

This

At the moment, I am starring at a pygmy walrus...

Why, because they traded him for a guy the same age that fills a need up front?


Yea, he must suck big time.
- Feeling Glucky?

Watching highlight video from 2002-2003 season. Mogilny may have been the best forward Sundin ever played with.

Also if you're wondering why Leafs can't grind out the latter part of the year, how does a third line of Connolly, Lombardi and Armstrong compare to Tucker, Corson and Green (All heart and grit)

if you're worried about consistency you're not going to be a big jvr fan
- Don'tForgetTocchet

a inconsistent forward is not the liability a inconsistent defenseman is

When a defenseman is inconsistent, the puck usually ends up in your own net

Dude, 2 of his 4 seasons have been good. Don't give me conditioning, non-factor injuries, defensive pairings excuses: he just flat out has not been consistently good defensively and for a supposed "shutdown" defenseman, that's not good enough.
- gravyface

Next season he's due for a good year. He'll do enough to prove the Leafs wrong. Then all of a sudden the 2013-14 season will come along and bring everybody back to reality.

Next season he's due for a good year. He'll do enough to prove the Leafs wrong. Then all of a sudden the 2013-14 season will come along and bring everybody back to reality.
- weirdoh

You're my favorite psychic.

Why? Because we need big slow "shutdown" d-men to take additional penalties? That's what we thought looked good on paper... maybe in 2002.
- gravyface

I find it interesting how the "Leaf faithful" will throw a kid like Schenn under the bus - after he's gone.

In the event you really believe the game is going completely to the little quick guys like the Karlsson's of the world.. I would suggest you take a look at the defense groups that both NJ and LA had in the final this year. I guess the Kings won in spite of Green, Scuderi and Mitchell. Yup those guys, along with Volchenkov really were noticable for there dazzling offensive displays. And that Boston team that won the year before - so many danglers on the blueline.

Any guessing as to what Pittsburgh does to rebuild their backline? Take a look who they had on the backline when they won the cup.

Next season he's due for a good year. He'll do enough to prove the Leafs wrong. Then all of a sudden the 2013-14 season will come along and bring everybody back to reality.
- weirdoh