Having someone like Crosby who is 25 signing until he is 35 is fine, he's the best player in the world and 35 is not that old.

Stamkos for 13 years now would bring him until he's 36, still not bad at all.

But Suter getting that until he's 40? Especially a player who has never played without Weber in the NHL? How do you know he's going to warrant his contract? If he doesnt, well then your stuck with him at a high cap hit and thus being overpaid.

I'm glad Burke doesnt throw out these deals.
- peddy-93

It's a risk the Wings are willing to take.

How is that ruining the league?

Having someone like Crosby who is 25 signing until he is 35 is fine, he's the best player in the world and 35 is not that old.

Stamkos for 13 years now would bring him until he's 36, still not bad at all.

But Suter getting that until he's 40? Especially a player who has never played without Weber in the NHL? How do you know he's going to warrant his contract? If he doesnt, well then your stuck with him at a high cap hit and thus being overpaid.

I'm glad Burke doesnt throw out these deals.
- peddy-93

Its my opinion, but he was the top d-man for the US at the most recent Olympics. Having watched the Preds, I think he'll do well in Detroit, without weber.

Having someone like Crosby who is 25 signing until he is 35 is fine, he's the best player in the world and 35 is not that old.

Stamkos for 13 years now would bring him until he's 36, still not bad at all.

But Suter getting that until he's 40? Especially a player who has never played without Weber in the NHL? How do you know he's going to warrant his contract? If he doesnt, well then your stuck with him at a high cap hit and thus being overpaid.

I'm glad Burke doesnt throw out these deals.
- peddy-93

and hence why we won't lure ufa's and big name players have no interest in being traded to toronto.
if detroit, nj, la, pittsburg and philly do it, judging by their success, I'd say Burke better wake the hell up.

I think Weber's play will actually decline without Suter. Kind of like Phaneuf after Calgary moved Hamrlik (Very underated d-man)
- mykokes

I respectfully disagree. Weber wasn't considered a Norris finalist the past 2 years and is considered one of the top dmen in the NHL for nothing.

Weber is top 3 in the NHL, Suter to me is top 10. I guess we'll see how they play without each other.

I still hate his uncle.
- Atomic Wedgie

Me too. lol

and hence why we won't lure ufa's and big name players have no interest in being traded to toronto.
if detroit, nj, la, pittsburg and philly do it, judging by their success, I'd say Burke better wake the hell up.
- Barx

Yeah, I'm getting a little sick and tired of Burke thinking that he has higher moral standards than 29 other GMs.

The NHL has an office. That office has staff that determines whether or not a contract is valid.

If it's legal, it's legal. Burke needs to shut up and do what's best for the Leafs, not what he thinks is ultimately in the best interests of the game of hockey.

It's a risk the Wings are willing to take.

How is that ruining the league?
- Atomic Wedgie

Well I'm not saying its completely ruining the league, but those deals for those certain players are inflating salaries for other players who dont warrant it. Wideman now getting 5.25? Carle is waiting for Suter to sign so he can make more $?

I'm not blaming those players for doing that, they're trying to cash in as much as possible.

Would you offer Suter 13 years if you were a GM?

Well I'm not saying its completely ruining the league, but those deals for those certain players are inflating salaries for other players who dont warrant it. Wideman now getting 5.25? Carle is waiting for Suter to sign so he can make more $?

I'm not blaming those players for doing that, they're trying to cash in as much as possible.

Would you offer Suter 13 years if you were a GM?
- peddy-93

yes, and I'd stick him right beside Dion.

Ok, the max I'd go is 10. But I'd gladly taking him on my team, let him qb my team, mentor Jake Gardiner and Morgan Reilly, play 26 minutes a night.

Well I'm not saying its completely ruining the league, but those deals for those certain players are inflating salaries for other players who dont warrant it. Wideman now getting 5.25? Carle is waiting for Suter to sign so he can make more $?

I'm not blaming those players for doing that, they're trying to cash in as much as possible.

Would you offer Suter 13 years if you were a GM?
- peddy-93

And why do you care?

The total $ for NHL salaries is capped - I don't particularly care if Suter gets more money - at the end of the day, it just means Joey Crabb gets less money.

It has absolutely no effect on the on-ice product.

Would I offer Suter 13 years? Do you really care what I would do? The GM of the Detroit Red Wings is willing to do it - and call me crazy, but I think his opinion is more important than mine.

Maybe not as important as Uggie's opinion, though.

Yeah, I'm getting a little sick and tired of Burke thinking that he has higher moral standards than 29 other GMs.

The NHL has an office. That office has staff that determines whether or not a contract is valid.

If it's legal, it's legal. Burke needs to shut up and do what's best for the Leafs, not what he thinks is ultimately in the best interests of the game of hockey.
- Atomic Wedgie

I agree with you that I dont like his morals either, but i dont think he wants to do those deals because of the league, but because he doesnt want to screw the Leafs in the long run

And why do you care?

The total $ for NHL salaries is capped - I don't particularly care if Suter gets more money - at the end of the day, it just means Joey Crabb gets less money.

It has absolutely no effect on the on-ice product.

Would I offer Suter 13 years? Do you really care what I would do? The GM of the Detroit Red Wings is willing to do it - and call me crazy, but I think his opinion is more important than mine.

Maybe not as important as Uggie's opinion, though.
- Atomic Wedgie

Had to laugh at that

I agree with you that I dont like his morals either, but i dont think he wants to do those deals because of the league, but because he doesnt want to screw the Leafs in the long run
- peddy-93

Burke can't have it both ways.

It either handcuffs teams, or it is a blatant attempt at cap circumvention.

Considering that salaries continue to go up, it's actually a good idea in the long run.

$7 million a year may seem like a lot of money for Suter today, but it may not be the average salary in 10 years.

Yeah, I'm getting a little sick and tired of Burke thinking that he has higher moral standards than 29 other GMs.

The NHL has an office. That office has staff that determines whether or not a contract is valid.

If it's legal, it's legal. Burke needs to shut up and do what's best for the Leafs, not what he thinks is ultimately in the best interests of the game of hockey.
- Atomic Wedgie

his self-righteous schtick has worn way thin.
his ideals are prehistoric.
would he ice a team of goons like the broadway bullies? no-cause the game has changed.
well guess what Burke, contracts have changed as well.

Well I'm not saying its completely ruining the league, but those deals for those certain players are inflating salaries for other players who dont warrant it. Wideman now getting 5.25? Carle is waiting for Suter to sign so he can make more $?

I'm not blaming those players for doing that, they're trying to cash in as much as possible.

Would you offer Suter 13 years if you were a GM?
- peddy-93

it's insane to blame feasters idiocy on inflated salaries.
you don't want to pay up, then don't fricken pay.
but elite talent like parise and suter will demand long term contracts.....it's common knowledge amongst all gms with the exception of Burke.

and hence why we won't lure ufa's and big name players have no interest in being traded to toronto.
if detroit, nj, la, pittsburg and philly do it, judging by their success, I'd say Burke better wake the hell up.
- Barx

Well, these are high risk/high reward deals we're talking about here: of these long-term front-loaded contracts, which ones have actually panned out in the long-run?

Sample set is pretty small, but so far we've got Luongo: you think that deal's working out for VAN now? Sure, they got a few years of good hockey out of him, but already they're looking at dumping him because a cheaper, better, younger version came along in Schneider. DiPietro? Terrible deal. Rick Nash's contract isn't looking so hot now. Hell, Carter and Richards' value only went up (or stayed at par) because they were part of a cup-winning team and had a decent playoff run.

Burke has said all along that he's not against long-term contracts, but front-loaded cap circumvention deals; he's said for the right player, he'd do a long term deal, but he likes 5 year deals better.

I don't blame him. You never know what the next CBA is going to bring and nobody wants to find themselves in a Chicago situation where they're lost a lot of very good core guys because of a cap situation.

Burke can't have it both ways.

It either handcuffs teams, or it is a blatant attempt at cap circumvention.

Considering that salaries continue to go up, it's actually a good idea in the long run.

$7 million a year may seem like a lot of money for Suter today, but it may not be the average salary in 10 years.
- Atomic Wedgie

Gotta disagree slightly with this. Burke set the team up so that no salary is signed after this season. Pretty simple reason, he knew that there was a new CBA coming up.
Whatever happens at this CBA could determine a lot about cap, salary, revenue sharing, etc.
Burke is running the Leafs like a business and made sure that he was not committed to anything major after a point of uncertainty.
Things will change after the CBA is agreed upon

Burke can't have it both ways.

It either handcuffs teams, or it is a blatant attempt at cap circumvention.

Considering that salaries continue to go up, it's actually a good idea in the long run.

$7 million a year may seem like a lot of money for Suter today, but it may not be the average salary in 10 years.
- Atomic Wedgie

True. Nobody considers inflation.

If the Red Wings are offering Suter $90 million for 13 years, I'd up the ante and make it $100 mil. $7.7 million cap hit for the next decade and he probably won't play right until 40, anyway.

Phaneuf/Suter may just be one of the best pairings in the league. It has a similar dynamic as Weber/Suter and Suter's steady defense allow Phaneuf to go back to his bull-in-a-china-shop days.

You can comfortably move Gunnar in a package for a top 6 forward, as well.

I have no problem giving Suter (or Parise, for that matter) crazy money. It's damn near impossible to overpay elite talent. They'll always be elite players and there will always be a market for them.

Well, these are high risk/high reward deals we're talking about here: of these long-term front-loaded contracts, which ones have actually panned out in the long-run?

Sample set is pretty small, but so far we've got Luongo: you think that deal's working out for VAN now? Sure, they got a few years of good hockey out of him, but already they're looking at dumping him because a cheaper, better, younger version came along in Schneider. DiPietro? Terrible deal. Rick Nash's contract isn't looking so hot now. Hell, Carter and Richards' value only went up (or stayed at par) because they were part of a cup-winning team and had a decent playoff run.

Burke has said all along that he's not against long-term contracts, but front-loaded cap circumvention deals; he's said for the right player, he'd do a long term deal, but he likes 5 year deals better.

I don't blame him. You never know what the next CBA is going to bring and nobody wants to find themselves in a Chicago situation where they're lost a lot of very good core guys because of a cap situation.
- gravyface

god forbid we win a cup.

his self-righteous schtick has worn way thin.
his ideals are prehistoric.
would he ice a team of goons like the broadway bullies? no-cause the game has changed.
well guess what Burke, contracts have changed as well.
- Barx

Until the new CBA comes out, those loopholes are closed, and teams with contracts that circumvent the cap are penalized and/or have a one-shot amnesty.

god forbid we win a cup.
- Barx

True dat Still, gotta suck to be CHI. If they could've kept that core together, perennial cup contenders.

http://mapleleafshotstove...ortsnetfan590/#more-30164

Anybody listen to this? Seriously, quality stuff. Poulin provides a lot of details regarding the entire process, from draft to UFA. Found it refreshing compared to Burke's rhetoric.

Oh and Burke's coming up on 590 at 5:20pm.

Until the new CBA comes out, those loopholes are closed, and teams with contracts that circumvent the cap are penalized and/or have a one-shot amnesty.
- gravyface

i don't give a flyingfuk about the CBA, I want a team that builds with elite talent.
the rules are the same for everyone, but Burke thinks he knows how to build better than anyone else.
his five-year plan failed.
his ten-year plan is failing.

Until the new CBA comes out, those loopholes are closed, and teams with contracts that circumvent the cap are penalized and/or have a one-shot amnesty.
- gravyface

Speaking of this, does anybody know how the CBA is rumored to look after these negotiations?

Are the owners pushing for shorter contract limits and stronger penalties for cap circumvention?

In any case, I don't see how paying a guy to play until he's 40 is really circumvention, anyway. Players play til 40 all the time.

True dat Still, gotta suck to be CHI. If they could've kept that core together, perennial cup contenders.
- gravyface

I'll take a Cup.
....then go ahead, destroy the team and start over.

i don't give a flyingfuk about the CBA, I want a team that builds with elite talent.
the rules are the same for everyone, but Burke thinks he knows how to build better than anyone else.
his five-year plan failed.
his ten-year plan is failing.
- Barx

So much angst in here last couple of days, wow.

Go ahead and listen to Poulin's interview today: he talks about Parise, how the NJ Devils haven't had a UFA leave the organization that's been offered a contract save for Niedermayer, and how that factored into the discussion. I still think Parise is going to resign, just like Brodeur did, just like Salvator did.