Ryan Wilson: Was Cooke-Staal-Kennedy really that good? Was Cooke-Staal-Kennedy really that good?

What’s next? Straka Lang kovy?

Mario jagr traffic cone?

Kessel bonino hags?

Kraft koltsov fata?

Since the main argument about not giving Kessel the Conn Smythe seems to be that his deployment was easy, I’d like to see HBK done.

Whenever Staal was let go for salary reasons I thought they would have been better off to have kept him and traded Malkin. The boat load of talent they could have received for him would have set them up for a very long time.

Whenever Staal was let go for salary reasons I thought they would have been better off to have kept him and traded Malkin. The boat load of talent they could have received for him would have set them up for a very long time.
- Pelle31

And likely woulda cost us two cups.

Whenever Staal was let go for salary reasons I thought they would have been better off to have kept him and traded Malkin. The boat load of talent they could have received for him would have set them up for a very long time.
- Pelle31

I think the Pens offered the same money to Staal but he didn't want to be 3rd line.

I think the Pens offered the same money to Staal but he didn't want to be 3rd line.
- coohill

Correct. He signed the exact same deal Shero offered.

Staal's PK numbers might have been better if he wasn't with Craig Adams. Only time I can remember a PK forward who only covered one man and made his partner skate back and forth to cover 2 guys.

Since the main argument about not giving Kessel the Conn Smythe seems to be that his deployment was easy, I’d like to see HBK done.
- Victoro311

I'll always think of it as Crosby finally being recognized for his all-around play. Kessel tried harder on defense in the playoffs, but Crosby was one of the best at both ends and I'd say the gap between them defensively was much bigger than the offensive one.

I'll always think of it as Crosby finally being recognized for his all-around play. Kessel tried harder on defense in the playoffs, but Crosby was one of the best at both ends and I'd say the gap between them defensively was much bigger than the offensive one.
- Tojo.

I've always seen it as it was a close race and Kessel was slightly ahead but the voters likely wanted to ensure Crosby recieved a conn Smythe in his career. That and anyone from Toronto who voted likely wanted to snub Kessel.

Staal's PK numbers might have been better if he wasn't with Craig Adams. Only time I can remember a PK forward who only covered one man and made his partner skate back and forth to cover 2 guys.
- Tojo.

LOL dude was awful.

I've always seen it as it was a close race and Kessel was slightly ahead but the voters likely wanted to ensure Crosby recieved a conn Smythe in his career. That and anyone from Toronto who voted likely wanted to snub Kessel.
- Aaron_85

Sid also had 3 or 4 GWG's that year. I'm not a huge fan of how GWG's are notched on the stat sheet, but that probably helped and the fact that he was the Captain. Still think Kessel should have gotten it though. Dude was a +8 at 5v5, whereas Sid was a -2, even if he did get the harder assignments.

Sid also had 3 or 4 GWG's that year. I'm not a huge fan of how GWG's are notched on the stat sheet, but that probably helped and the fact that he was the Captain. Still think Kessel should have gotten it though. Dude was a +8 at 5v5, whereas Sid was a -2, even if he did get the harder assignments.
- j.boyd919

Kessel 100% should have gotten it. He was robbed.

I've always seen it as it was a close race and Kessel was slightly ahead but the voters likely wanted to ensure Crosby recieved a conn Smythe in his career. That and anyone from Toronto who voted likely wanted to snub Kessel.
- Aaron_85

I don't know if this is right or not but I'm pretty sure the voting was REALLY close to the point that the Toronto media's Kessel hate legitimately might have been the swing.

Staal left because he wanted to play with his brother!

I don't know if this is right or not but I'm pretty sure the voting was REALLY close to the point that the Toronto media's Kessel hate legitimately might have been the swing.
- Victoro311

What sucks is the PWHA didn't publish the votes publicly until 2018.

Whenever Staal was let go for salary reasons I thought they would have been better off to have kept him and traded Malkin. The boat load of talent they could have received for him would have set them up for a very long time.
- Pelle31

Thing is if Shero drafted correctly during the draft we traded Staal we could of had Forsberg. And it's not hindsight because I was pissed off the second he passed on Forsberg. Getting Dumo, Sutter and the 8th overall pick for Staal was actually a good return, Shero just (frank)ed up the pick badly.

So Sheros top trades here in no particular order:
Kunitz/Tangradi for Whitney
Hossa/Dupuis for Armstrong, Esposito plus more crap
Dumo,Sutter, 8th overall for Staal
Neal/Nisk for Gogo
Guerin for conditional 4th(Became a 3rd)

Kessel 100% should have gotten it. He was robbed.
- Rinosaur

Sid was given it because the league didn't know if he'd ever win again and they wanted to get it to him. 2017 Sid was more deserving.

I meant to post here to tell you guys that JFresh is doing all sorts of retro cards for players now. Seems RW knew this too. Some cool to see ones there like Federov and Sundin so far

I think the Pens offered the same money to Staal but he didn't want to be 3rd line.
- coohill

Playing with Eric was a huge factor too I believe.

Kessel 100% should have gotten it. He was robbed.
- Rinosaur

"Robbed" is a little too dramatic here IMO.

Sid also had 3 or 4 GWG's that year. I'm not a huge fan of how GWG's are notched on the stat sheet, but that probably helped and the fact that he was the Captain. Still think Kessel should have gotten it though. Dude was a +8 at 5v5, whereas Sid was a -2, even if he did get the harder assignments.
- j.boyd919

Sid was calling and running plays at FO's like a QB that run. He was engaged AF. He had the far tougher assignments not being on the 3rd line and like you said scored 3 outta 4 game winners in the ECF, a series they were down 3 games to 2 in.

You see people sh!t on Hart winners or Norris winners getting those awards because of point totals...there was more to Sid's Conn Smyth win than him being 2nd overall in Penguins points and only 3 less than The Phil.

Certainly dont wan't to knock The Phil by saying any of this, he deserved it too and would of been a good choice for it as well. Fact is the Pens dont win that or the 2017 cup without Phil...obviously not without Sid, either.

Sid was calling and running plays at FO's like a QB that run. He was engaged AF. He had the far tougher assignments not being on the 3rd line and like you said scored 3 outta 4 game winners in the ECF, a series they were down 3 games to 2 in.

You see people sh!t on Hart winners or Norris winners getting those awards because of point totals...there was more to Sid's Conn Smyth win than him being 2nd overall in Penguins points and only 3 less than The Phil.

Certainly dont wan't to knock The Phil by saying any of this, he deserved it too and would of been a good choice for it as well. Fact is the Pens dont win that or the 2017 cup without Phil...obviously not without Sid, either.
- MattStrat

I'm happy Sid won. He was deserving and I'm not saying he's not. During the "Toews Better" era, a lot of hay was made about how Sidney Crosby just wasn't a very good captain and intangibles had to be taken into consideration when evaluating Toews. Well, you're right. Sid intangibled the ever living poop out of that Cup run, and the whole hockey world took note. I felt like that was the first time people unequivocally appreciated his greatness and no one wElL aKtUalY'ed his accomplishments with "well, but he's a female dog", "well, but he's not a great leader like Toews", "well, he's not any good defensively", or "well, he's no Ovi on offense." Everyone jumping to his defense after Couture's stupid Crosby cheats comments was a big turning point in his perception.

All that is to say I'll never say Sid didn't deserve it, but it felt like a career culmination award and an admission that people were wrong about him, because if voting were scaled to only the playoffs and all narratives outside of those specific playoff games were excluded, Kessel deserved it more. What makes me feel bad for Phil is that the very next season Sid was the clear cut Conn Smythe winner, so if the reason the voters voted for Sid was because they felt he in some way shape or form that he deserved a Smythe on his legacy even if they thought Phil was better, subconsciously or not, it ended up being unnecessary. Obviously no one could have known that though.

"Robbed" is a little too dramatic here IMO.
- MattStrat

No to me.