Jeremy Laura: The Overseas exodus is in full swing

I would go too, but I gotta stay here to vote (in person)

Mornin', J!
Makes sense that the younger players who need more development go; any ice time with structure, needs-based training, and direct supervision will make them more competitive and viable for the '20-'21 season. I think it's a smart move. Would also opine that The Captain has a very well-defined set of rules that European teams must follow in order to allow these kids to get some ice time, wouldn't be surprised to hear that part of the agreement was completed in consultation with dieticians, strength & conditioning, etc... articulated. The time spent there may well pay huge dividends come the start of next season.

Oh, the 'Canes really looked good v Rangers. Being in SC, I'm of course a fan by location so was happy to finally catch a game or 2. King Henry looked shaky in his last games for NYR. Really curious to see how the G situation plays out for DET, might be interesting to see KH & Bernie split time as the G situation develops.....maybe a bridge situation until the G of the Future arrives, or mentorship? Just an idea. Toronto looked like warmed-over @@@@ in Game 1, mediocre-at-best in Game 2, CBJ looked horrible in Game 2.....what's the deal?!?!? Reckon $$$ does not a Lord Stanley home make

Mornin', J!
Makes sense that the younger players who need more development go; any ice time with structure, needs-based training, and direct supervision will make them more competitive and viable for the '20-'21 season. I think it's a smart move. Would also opine that The Captain has a very well-defined set of rules that European teams must follow in order to allow these kids to get some ice time, wouldn't be surprised to hear that part of the agreement was completed in consultation with dieticians, strength & conditioning, etc... articulated. The time spent there may well pay huge dividends come the start of next season.

Oh, the 'Canes really looked good v Rangers. Being in SC, I'm of course a fan by location so was happy to finally catch a game or 2. King Henry looked shaky in his last games for NYR. Really curious to see how the G situation plays out for DET, might be interesting to see KH & Bernie split time as the G situation develops.....maybe a bridge situation until the G of the Future arrives, or mentorship? Just an idea. Toronto looked like warmed-over @@@@ in Game 1, mediocre-at-best in Game 2, CBJ looked horrible in Game 2.....what's the deal?!?!? Reckon $$$ does not a Lord Stanley home make
- mcmastermike1968

I'd take King Henrik for a year or 2 here. But I doubt he'd want to go to a bottom feeder like Detroit. If the AVS lose out in the WCF I could see them replacing Grubauer with Hank. That AVS team is stacked and will be a Cup contender for the next decade.

King Henrik wouldn't have to be Superman for them. Just make the odd big save when they need it. Like Hasek did for the Red Wings in 2002. Or Mike Vernon in 1997.

Columbus has scored 1 flukey goal and an empty net goal in 2 games. The Leafs absolutely embarrassed Columbus in game 2. If not for Korpisalo it would've been 6-0 Leafs. Hopefully Muzzin is ok. But even without him I can't see Columbus winning another game.

They literally never have the puck! Their pop gun offense won't beat the Leafs. Torts will likely read them the Riot act but Columbus doesn't score and they don't hit. The Leafs have been just as good defensively. Freddy Andersen has played great minus the one flukey goal in game 1.

Mornin', J!
Makes sense that the younger players who need more development go; any ice time with structure, needs-based training, and direct supervision will make them more competitive and viable for the '20-'21 season. I think it's a smart move. Would also opine that The Captain has a very well-defined set of rules that European teams must follow in order to allow these kids to get some ice time, wouldn't be surprised to hear that part of the agreement was completed in consultation with dieticians, strength & conditioning, etc... articulated. The time spent there may well pay huge dividends come the start of next season.

Oh, the 'Canes really looked good v Rangers. Being in SC, I'm of course a fan by location so was happy to finally catch a game or 2. King Henry looked shaky in his last games for NYR. Really curious to see how the G situation plays out for DET, might be interesting to see KH & Bernie split time as the G situation develops.....maybe a bridge situation until the G of the Future arrives, or mentorship? Just an idea. Toronto looked like warmed-over @@@@ in Game 1, mediocre-at-best in Game 2, CBJ looked horrible in Game 2.....what's the deal?!?!? Reckon $$$ does not a Lord Stanley home make
- mcmastermike1968

Canes look good for sure. There is so much buy-in from even the younger guys. Rod B has done such a good job getting the team to play together.

Toronto, for me, is so dangerous on the attack. They can hold onto the puck forever. Tavares, to his credit, can skate 200 ft like a beast. They get lost in their own end. Columbus just doesn’t have the firepower to take advantage. Matthews could be a 200ft guy, just needs to condition differently. If he puts that together he’ll be outstanding all over. He’s blue line in right now. That will have to change in the future

I'd take King Henrik for a year or 2 here. But I doubt he'd want to go to a bottom feeder like Detroit. If the AVS lose out in the WCF I could see them replacing Grubauer with Hank. That AVS team is stacked and will be a Cup contender for the next decade.

King Henrik wouldn't have to be Superman for them. Just make the odd big save when they need it. Like Hasek did for the Red Wings in 2002. Or Mike Vernon in 1997.

Columbus has scored 1 flukey goal and an empty net goal in 2 games. The Leafs absolutely embarrassed Columbus in game 2. If not for Korpisalo it would've been 6-0 Leafs. Hopefully Muzzin is ok. But even without him I can't see Columbus winning another game.

They literally never have the puck! Their pop gun offense won't beat the Leafs. Torts will likely read them the Riot act but Columbus doesn't score and they don't hit. The Leafs have been just as good defensively. Freddy Andersen has played great minus the one flukey goal in game 1.
- gergeswillems

CBJ plays structured, but you’re right. If you can’t score you better play the physical game. On the attack, TOR is a nightmare to face. You have to get the puck behind them for sure and CBJ just isn’t Lighting it up

I'd take King Henrik for a year or 2 here. But I doubt he'd want to go to a bottom feeder like Detroit. If the AVS lose out in the WCF I could see them replacing Grubauer with Hank. That AVS team is stacked and will be a Cup contender for the next decade.

King Henrik wouldn't have to be Superman for them. Just make the odd big save when they need it. Like Hasek did for the Red Wings in 2002. Or Mike Vernon in 1997.

Columbus has scored 1 flukey goal and an empty net goal in 2 games. The Leafs absolutely embarrassed Columbus in game 2. If not for Korpisalo it would've been 6-0 Leafs. Hopefully Muzzin is ok. But even without him I can't see Columbus winning another game.

They literally never have the puck! Their pop gun offense won't beat the Leafs. Torts will likely read them the Riot act but Columbus doesn't score and they don't hit. The Leafs have been just as good defensively. Freddy Andersen has played great minus the one flukey goal in game 1.
- gergeswillems

The Avs already have two legitimately very good goalies right now, both of whom are under contract through at least next season. Grubauer is almost certainly better than Lundqvist at this point in his career, and honestly I think Francouz is even better than Grubauer and probably should be the one starting. So even if Grubauer falls out of favor and loses his gig, his replacement is already on the roster.

Barring some kind of galaxy brain expansion draft shenanigans I don't see why Colorado would have any interest.

The Avs already have two legitimately very good goalies right now, both of whom are under contract through at least next season. Grubauer is almost certainly better than Lundqvist at this point in his career, and honestly I think Francouz is even better than Grubauer and probably should be the one starting. So even if Grubauer falls out of favor and loses his gig, his replacement is already on the roster.

Barring some kind of galaxy brain expansion draft shenanigans I don't see why Colorado would have any interest.
- Sven22

I've never been sold on Grubauer.

I've never been sold on Grubauer.
- gergeswillems

You were right earlier. Whatever goalie is in net is going to face league high SOG and more turnovers than the German bakery in Allen Park. It’s just a shooting gallery out there right now.

You were right earlier. Whatever goalie is in net is going to face league high SOG and more turnovers than the German bakery in Allen Park. It’s just a shooting gallery out there right now.
- Jeremy Laura

Hank is likely retiring anyway.

I've never been sold on Grubauer.
- gergeswillems

Never had a below average season statistically. Better numbers (overall) than Holtby during their three years together as the unquestioned due in Washington. Very good numbers so far in Colorado.

I mean, has he ever been one of the league's very best goaltenders? No, probably not. But it's hard to put up the numbers he has, for as long as he has, as consistently he has, without at least being pretty good. (Which is probably more than the King can say at 38, sadly.) Certainly good enough considering the team he has in front of him.

And again, I think Francouz is even better. He should have been in the NHL six or seven years ago.

I would love it if Detroit could exploit the expansion draft to weasel one of these guys out of Colorado.

Real quick hit before I head 14hrs North back to MI for a funeral: Over the past few weeks I've looked at the comments section of other blogs here. I've found, consistently, YOURS has more insightful, informed, and congenial comments. The folks you have commenting are imaginative, considerate, and possess a great sense of humour. LOVE this blog, your comments, and the amount of thought you create, J. Well done, lad!

Does it matter?

This player...that goalie??

Does it even matter???

Does it matter?

This player...that goalie??

Does it even matter???
- bruceflyers

Oh Hi Bandwagon Brucey! Eating in between meals are ya? Ahhhhh.... Beavis?????

Never had a below average season statistically. Better numbers (overall) than Holtby during their three years together as the unquestioned due in Washington. Very good numbers so far in Colorado.

I mean, has he ever been one of the league's very best goaltenders? No, probably not. But it's hard to put up the numbers he has, for as long as he has, as consistently he has, without at least being pretty good. (Which is probably more than the King can say at 38, sadly.) Certainly good enough considering the team he has in front of him.

And again, I think Francouz is even better. He should have been in the NHL six or seven years ago.

I would love it if Detroit could exploit the expansion draft to weasel one of these guys out of Colorado.
- Sven22

Yet it was Holtby who won the Stanley Cup for Washington in 2018 after Grubauer $hit the bed in round 1. But let's criticize future hall of famer King Henrik who actually led his Rangers to a SCF appearance.

Yet it was Holtby who won the Stanley Cup for Washington in 2018 after Grubauer $hit the bed in round 1. But let's criticize future hall of famer King Henrik who actually led his Rangers to a SCF appearance.
- gergeswillems

Grubauer played 105 minutes in the 2018 playoffs. Barely five periods of hockey.

If your argument is that letting in a few bad goals over the course of less than two games outweighs everything else Grubauer has done in his entire career, I don't know what to tell you. I'm confident you can find a stretch of two equally bad consecutive playoff games for probably every single goaltender in the entire Hall of Fame.

The fact that Holtby got the opportunity and ran with it doesn't mean that Grubauer couldn't have done the same if the coach had decided to stick with him. Washington had two good goalies that year, but you can only play one at a time. So it goes.

Also, no disrespect to King Henrik, who should be a slam dunk Hall of Famer if there's any justice in the universe. But everybody gets old.

Grubauer played 105 minutes in the 2018 playoffs. Barely five periods of hockey.

If your argument is that letting in a few bad goals over the course of less than two games outweighs everything else Grubauer has done in his entire career, I don't know what to tell you. I'm confident you can find a stretch of two equally bad consecutive playoff games for probably every single goaltender in the entire Hall of Fame.

The fact that Holtby got the opportunity and ran with it doesn't mean that Grubauer couldn't have done the same if the coach had decided to stick with him. Washington had two good goalies that year, but you can only play one at a time. So it goes.

Also, no disrespect to King Henrik, who should be a slam dunk Hall of Famer if there's any justice in the universe. But everybody gets old.
- Sven22

Woulda coulda shoulda is always a nice game to play. If Schneider doesn't run into Marleau in the 2007 WCF and Hossa doesn't play with a torn rotator cuff in the 2009 SCF then maybe the Red Wings 3peat.

What I do know is that Holtby saved the Caps in 2018 just like Osgood saved the Red Wings in 2008 when Hasek $hit the bed in Nashville. It's not theory. It happened.

Woulda coulda shoulda is always a nice game to play. If Schneider doesn't run into Marleau in the 2007 WCF and Hossa doesn't play with a torn rotator cuff in the 2009 SCF then maybe the Red Wings 3peat.

What I do know is that Holtby saved the Caps in 2018 just like Osgood saved the Red Wings in 2008 when Hasek $hit the bed in Nashville. It's not theory. It happened.
- gergeswillems

So what you're saying is, because Grubauer played badly in two games in 2018, you don't care about the fact that he has been a consistently very good goaltender for the vast majority of the remaining 189 regular season and playoff games he has played over the rest of his career?

Osgood had tons of bad playoff series. So did Roy. So did Brodeur. So did Hasek. In career playoff series at the starter Osgood was 7-1 when his team was 20 or more regular season points better than their opponents, and 8-8 when they weren't.

Hey man, remember 1953 when the Wings won the President’s Trophy then bombed out in the first round of the playoffs? Sawchuk went 2-6 with a 3.66 GAA. What a bum, bet he never makes the Hall of Fame.

I tend to think that discounting a player with a long track record of consistently good play over a couple of bad games is spectacularly harsh. Good lord, everybody has bad games sometimes. Maybe not Lidstrom, actually. But everyone else.

So what you're saying is, because Grubauer played badly in two games in 2018, you don't care about the fact that he has been a consistently very good goaltender for the vast majority of the remaining 189 regular season and playoff games he has played over the rest of his career?

Osgood had tons of bad playoff series. So did Roy. So did Brodeur. So did Hasek. In career playoff series at the starter Osgood was 7-1 when his team was 20 or more regular season points better than their opponents, and 8-8 when they weren't.

Hey man, remember 1953 when the Wings won the President’s Trophy then bombed out in the first round of the playoffs? Sawchuk went 2-6 with a 3.66 GAA. What a bum, bet he never makes the Hall of Fame.

I tend to think that discounting a player with a long track record of consistently good play over a couple of bad games is spectacularly harsh. Good lord, everybody has bad games sometimes. Maybe not Lidstrom, actually. But everyone else.
- Sven22

Yeah sure. Grubauer would've been the next Terry Sawchuk if he was just given the opportunity. Good Lord a future Hall of Famer too. See what I did there? Hey man, projection is cool! Even in 1953!

Yeah sure. Grubauer would've been the next Terry Sawchuk if he was just given the opportunity. Good one.
- gergeswillems

Straw man. I never said Grubauer was the next Sawchuk. In fact I specifically stated I didn't think he was ever one of the very best goalies in the NHL.

What I do think is that he's pretty good. I base that conclusion on the the fact that he has a long track record of being pretty good, with good numbers relative to the league, and his teammates (who have also tended to be pretty good goaltenders).

My objection is that you would condemn an entire career on the basis of a two game sample. Great goalies have bad stretches all the time. On the flipside, Michael Leighton took a team to game six of the SCF and he sucks. Two games tells you virtually nothing about a player.

Straw man. I never said Grubauer was the next Sawchuk. In fact I specifically stated I didn't think he was ever one of the very best goalies in the NHL.

What I do think is that he's pretty good. I base that conclusion on the the fact that he has a long track record of being pretty good, with good numbers relative to the league, and his teammates (who have also tended to be pretty good goaltenders).

My objection is that you would condemn an entire career on the basis of a two game sample. Great goalies have bad stretches all the time. On the flipside, Michael Leighton took a team to game six of the SCF and he sucks. Two games tells you virtually nothing about a player.
- Sven22

Straw man. Perfect way to describe what you've said. If Grubauer is so good then why hasn't he won anything? Hockey is a team sport. I get it. Ok so has Grubauer won a Vezina? Has he been nominated for a Vezina? How many Playoff rounds has he won?

Are you going to keep moving the goal posts? 80 career wins. 18 wins in a season is his career high which he's done twice. .920 career save percentage. I'll give you that one. It seems he can't win or keep a starting job though. Why is that?

Straw man. Perfect way to describe what you've said. If Grubauer is so good then why hasn't he won anything? Hockey is a team sport. I get it. Ok so has Grubauer won a Vezina? Has he been nominated for a Vezina? How many Playoff rounds has he won? Are you going to keep moving the goal posts?
- gergeswillems

Why would he be nominated for a Vezina? He's not one of the three best goalies in the NHL, or even close to it, and never has been.

My general impression is that Grubauer fits somewhere near the midpoint between "elite" and "average." "Good," if you will. I've stated my reasons why, and been consistent about that.

Let's talk logical fallacies now for a second.

Straw man = taking an opponent's argument, misrepresenting it, and then arguing against it. You did this to me by accusing me of making points that I did not make and holding opinions that I do not hold. If you believe I have done it to you, please tell me because, while I enjoy a spicy argument here and there, I don't want to misunderstand or mischaracterize your position.

As for "moving the goalposts," I also haven't done that. (Nor have you, for that matter.) I think my position has been consistent and clear. We just seem to disagree over the best way to decide if a given goaltender happens to be any good or not.

Why would he be nominated for a Vezina? He's not one of the three best goalies in the NHL, or even close to it, and never has been.

My general impression is that Grubauer fits somewhere near the midpoint between "elite" and "average." "Good," if you will. I've stated my reasons why, and been consistent about that.

Let's talk logical fallacies now for a second.

Straw man = taking an opponent's argument, misrepresenting it, and then arguing against it. You did this to me by accusing me of making points that I did not make and holding opinions that I do not hold. If you believe I have done it to you, please tell me because, while I enjoy a spicy argument here and there, I don't want to misunderstand or mischaracterize your position.

As for "moving the goalposts," I also haven't done that. (Nor have you, for that matter.) I think my position has been consistent and clear. We just seem to disagree over the best way to decide if a given goaltender happens to be any good or not.
- Sven22

Nah your opinion isn't fact. Believe what you will. Your entire premise was accusing me of condemning Grubauer based on 2 playoff games with the Caps in 2018. I said that I've never been sold on Grubauer. I never said he was useless or not an NHL goalie.

You then went on to straw man your assumption by being sarcastic. I gave it right back to you in the same manner. You deserved it. That being said Grubauer has at least proven to be a decent goalie when he's splitting time in the crease with another goalie. I'll admit his stats are better than I originally thought.

What I should've said is that I've never been sold on Grubauer as a starting goalie. He simply lacks the resume to back that up. He's 28 years old. Good age for a goalie. I'd actually take him in Detroit as long as Bernier is still here. Split the games and hope the team improves. They can't get any worse.

80 career wins. 18 wins in a season is his career high which he's done twice. .920 career save percentage. I'll give you that one. It seems he can't win or keep a starting job though. Why is that?
- gergeswillems

So you added this part to your comment after I started writing my response. A few thoughts:

In both places he's played he was competing for time against an older, more established goaltender who was also very good at the time (Holtby in Washington, Varlamov in Colorado).

One of the realities of being a "pretty good" goaltender is that I think your career arc often depends a lot on opportunity. If you're the only goaltender worth a crap on your team, you'll play a lot and probably be pretty well regarded. If you're always alongside a Holtby or a Francouz you might not play as much and will probably be consistently underrated.

Either way I'm more interested in his actual on-ice performance than how much his coaches used him. So that .920 matters a lot more to me than the other stuff.

But that's one way of looking at it. I'm certainly not claiming my way is the only way.

Nah your opinion isn't fact. Believe what you will. Your entire premise was accusing me of condemning Grubauer based on 2 playoff games with the Caps in 2018. I said that I've never been sold on Grubauer. I never said he was useless or not an NHL goalie.

You then went on to straw man your assumption by being sarcastic. I gave it right back to you in the same manner. You deserved it. That being said Grubauer has at least proven to be a decent goalie when he's splitting time in the crease with another goalie. I'll admit his stats are better than I originally thought.

What I should've said is that I've never been sold on Grubauer as a starting goalie. He simply lacks the resume to back that up. He's 28 years old. Good age for a goalie. I'd actually take him in Detroit as long as Bernier is still here. Split the games and hope the team improves. They can't get any worse.
- gergeswillems

Thanks for the feedback and the clarification. You're right, I did straw man you a bit, and I apologize. I see where you're coming from a lot better now.

And re-reading the sarcasm, I can see why I came off a little bit, uh, well, Richardish. Truly, I was just trying to have some fun, so sorry about that too.