Kevin Francis: Ottawa Senators potential UFA targets Hockey Plays

The comments by Trent Mann are not necessary unless you expand on them. He's alienating a fanbase. Tell us a bit about the reality you live in rather than trying to burn fans.

Nevertheless, this draft was a crapshoot due to a weird scouting year. Let's see in 2-3 years before we judge. There is a real chance none of the first rounders result into anything more than 3/4 D-men or top 6 forwards. These aren't hard to find via trade/free agency/producing in your in your system. Rest of the draft, as any year, you're almost just throwing darts.

The free agent targets in the blog are all hard passes for me. Use the money on the RFA's coming down the pike.

Last year many of us hoped for a largescale youth movement. While we got that to some degree, many players were brought in to assist in the process. This may depend on if hte team thinks JBD is NHL ready, or needs a bit of time in Belleville.


Will a similar situation occur, or will we see something more like:

Tkachuk Norris Batherson
Stutzle Pinto Dadonov
Formenton White Brown
Paul Tienry Watson

Wildcard: Brown

Florida got Reinhardt for a very good price. Ottawa could have easily matched or bettered the Florida offer. Reinhardt has already signalled that he wants to sign a long term deal and the language from his camp sounds reasonable.

Wonder if Dorion held back from going all in. Does he remain on the edges looking to jump in on one of the larger fishes that are still being floated.

Ottawa, Anahiem, LA, Columbus...perhaps Montreal have the cap space and assets to do a deal for Eichel. We hear that the two teams leading the charge are Minnesota and Rangers. But, let's be realistic, Minnesota is dead in the water. They do not have sufficient cap space beyond next year to accommodate an Eichel contract. The buy outs of Suter and Parise were not helpful. The Rangers, on the other hand, have some nice pieces but they are not prepared to offer up any elite pieces.

I am not a fan of Sens chasing Eichel. Would be more content with a solid veteran presence like Monaghan or Henrique at a more modest cost.

The comments by Trent Mann are not necessary unless you expand on them. He's alienating a fanbase. Tell us a bit about the reality you live in rather than trying to burn fans.

Nevertheless, this draft was a crapshoot due to a weird scouting year. Let's see in 2-3 years before we judge. There is a real chance none of the first rounders result into anything more than 3/4 D-men or top 6 forwards. These aren't hard to find via trade/free agency/producing in your in your system. Rest of the draft, as any year, you're almost just throwing darts.

The free agent targets in the blog are all hard passes for me. Use the money on the RFA's coming down the pike

Honestly, i don't think those comments were directed at fans.....i think they were directed at media and blogger types. I HIGHLY doubt Mann and PD are on twitter reading what fans say, but i'm sure they're seeing what's being said on Sportsnet, The Athletic, etc

Any D traded for or signed will have to be right handed. That eliminates a lot of names. And any team with a minute eating RD the Sens need with one or two years left on contract is probably better served waiting until the trade deadline. Same goes for a centre.

Draft was a total crapshoot after first 8 picks. In 5 years, somebody drafted in the 5th round will win the MVP because no one could properly evaluate players. Next year's draft (11 picks?) will be the one Mann and Dorian will be judged on. As will how Matt Murray plays next year.

Honestly, i don't think those comments were directed at fans.....i think they were directed at media and blogger types. I HIGHLY doubt Mann and PD are on twitter reading what fans say, but i'm sure they're seeing what's being said on Sportsnet, The Athletic, etc
- sensarmy_11

Yes, I think you are exactly right. Most of these media guys are part time amateurs trying to defend the fact that they failed to have Boucher even close to their top 10 list. It is now apparent that other teams also had him well above these amateur sleuths.

Just as important, they live in an echo chamber telling one another what they believe the scouts are seeing and thinking. But, if, as was the case this past year, the scouts had very little to see, the amateurs are just blowing shades of smoke based on a very limited hockey season.

After doing a little reading, in order to secure Boucher, it looks like the Senators could have only traded down to Columbus, Calgary, Buffalo or Detroit as New York was set to select him at 15th. Apparently the Bruins were also very high on Boucher.

This quote from a Bruins media source made me chuckle:

Boucher is a heat-seeking missile on skates and he makes his presence felt as early and often as he can. When finishing checks, Boucher isn’t the type to let up. Instead, he’s the type to try and put you through the glass whenever the opportunity arises.

The consensus seems to be that many teams are very much going to dislike playing the Senators in the near future.

Yes, I think you are exactly right. Most of these media guys are part time amateurs trying to defend the fact that they failed to have Boucher even close to their top 10 list. It is now apparent that other teams also had him well above these amateur sleuths.

Just as important, they live in an echo chamber telling one another what they believe the scouts are seeing and thinking. But, if, as was the case this past year, the scouts had very little to see, the amateurs are just blowing shades of smoke based on a very limited hockey season.
- spatso

Fact is all draft rankings had him either at the end of the 1st round or later. Even Bob McKenzie who uses pro scouts polls for his rankings had Boucher at 29th. Its possible he could have went in the mid to late teens but anyway you look at it, it was a reach at 10.

Maybe this will look good in a couple of years (like Seider at 6th) or maybe it won't. They probably could have traded down a bit and got something more for it.

Have a look at Tyler Boucher's 16 and 17 year old seasons. They are very similar production to Brady Tkachuk. If Boucher was able to maintain his game before getting sick / hurt, his numbers in his second year would have been the same as Tkachuk's.

Brady
2015-16 US U17 GP=32 4G 4A 36PIMs
2016-17 US U18 GP=24 12G 11A 73PIMs

Tyler
2019-20 US U17 GP=24 4G 7A 43 PIMs
2020-21 US U18 GP=5 3G 2A 13 PIMs

I am curious as to how Boucher's season at college is going to progress and I certainly look forward to comparing it to Tkachuk's.

I now believe the Senators' scouts look at Boucher as being a player close to or somewhat equivalent to Brady Tkachuk with the key difference being Boucher plays on the RW. If you have one of these players on your first/second and another on your second/third line, teams are not going to enjoy their games against the Senators.

I will admit that I was surprised and a little disappointed during the draft. Now, after doing a little reading and watching some tape, I am perfectly fine with the pick.

Hjalmarsson......how come no one mentions signing Hjalmarsson???? A defensive stalwart. Has his play fell off a cliff? Has he stated that he stays in the desert?? Is he retiring?

Hjalmarsson......how come no one mentions signing Hjalmarsson???? A defensive stalwart. Has his play fell off a cliff? Has he stated that he stays in the desert?? Is he retiring?
- HenryHockey

It’s seem I read he s retiring today, not sure. If someone else can confirm

With so many young players the Sens want to go big which is an asset to give them more room to develop. Boucher is an animal which is what the team needs. We don’t need Brady in the penalty box defending these guys all the time.

In regards to this years draft, how can anyone possibly criticize any teams picks. The OHL didn’t play a game etc etc. It sounds like Boucher was ranked much higher than the public lists and could be a great player down the road. Dorian and Mann have an excellent track record and have gotten flack from the uneducated fans for picking players like Brady T and Sanderson over Drysdale, these were the right decisions. The big question mark however is Logan Brown! This will be his last opportunity if he isn’t traded.

Honestly, i don't think those comments were directed at fans.....i think they were directed at media and blogger types. I HIGHLY doubt Mann and PD are on twitter reading what fans say, but i'm sure they're seeing what's being said on Sportsnet, The Athletic, etc
- sensarmy_11

Whether it be the fans or media, the comments reeked of "I'm a head scout and you're not". Like ok, thanks for the reminder, how about shedding some light about the reality you are living in and we are not?

I'm fine with the pick but just say you had him ranked in your teams top prospects and move on. Strange comment to me that will just get fans and media more riled up.

I actually like the Boucher pick at the time and now after more research but you can't ignore the predictable criticism of the pick that was to come. I am even more on the side, that it was a poop year for scouting. Off the board picks in a perceived crap draft year were to be expected. The Mann comments were lame.

Anyways, lets (frank)ing stop talking about drafts and prospects and finally start talking about the team taking shape, finally.

Any D traded for or signed will have to be right handed. That eliminates a lot of names. And any team with a minute eating RD the Sens need with one or two years left on contract is probably better served waiting until the trade deadline. Same goes for a centre.

Draft was a total crapshoot after first 8 picks. In 5 years, somebody drafted in the 5th round will win the MVP because no one could properly evaluate players. Next year's draft (11 picks?) will be the one Mann and Dorian will be judged on. As will how Matt Murray plays next year.
- GrimmdaGoalie

I wonder if the Sens would consider Savard as a fit at the RD. He’s declined some but played big minutes on highly competitive CLB teams. Savard may only want to go to a Cup contender. But he’s from Quebec and if the salary and term is right, he could
work.





Boucher looks to have a solid chance of being a valuable bottom 6 player. Sillinger who was picked right behind him seemed to be the best player available. Sillinger is projected to be an offensive force with top 6 potential. Boucher isn’t a bad pick but I think you gotta go with the next best player in the top 10 picks.

Whether it be the fans or media, the comments reeked of "I'm a head scout and you're not". Like ok, thanks for the reminder, how about shedding some light about the reality you are living in and we are not?
I'm fine with the pick but just say you had him ranked in your teams top prospects and move on. Strange comment to me that will just get fans and media more riled up.

- Gord_Wilson_2.0

Indeed... funny how most teams don't have to do this kind of damage control before the draft weekend is even finished...
https://www.thescore.com/...-doesnt-know-what-we-know

Does it have something to do with the Sporting News giving them the worst grade of any team at the draft, or the Hockey News discussing them as the first big loser of the day? Probably, but surely you could have seen that heat coming when you go off the board so often that your 6th round pick is being cited as your best selection. Not to mention that going out of your way to arrogantly claim that you "know" for sure that Boucher would have been picked in the top-20 is a complete lie. At best, you might have some general intel that he was on the radar of other teams, but there's no way to know which teams would have made the same reach pick to select him. Meanwhile, Dorion's endorsement of the picks was almost hilariously passive...

"We targeted some players and we were able to get all of them. It's a great day for our organization, adding some prospects to our group."

It's like he's describing the functional act of successfully drafting players into the NHL, instead of being even remotely excited about the specific players involved. But he's right... they certainly did have "some players" on a list, and managed to add "some prospects" to their group. That statement will hold up in court, and nobody can deny that. High five.

I wonder if the Sens would consider Savard as a fit at the RD. He’s declined some but played big minutes on highly competitive CLB teams. Savard may only want to go to a Cup contender. But he’s from Quebec and if the salary and term is right, he could work.
- Minnyhock

Savard is someone I had been thinking could be a valuable RHD partner for Chabot, but I think Montreal is seriously after him, especially given Weber's injury. Given the Cup win, he could also wind up with more term and salary than the Senators really want to commit to. And with the emergence of Bernard-Docker, they might want to be careful about not jamming up the RHD situation, because Zaitsev and Zub are already competent options there, plus Thomson could start to push for more ice time as well.

The real killer for them is the C situation on the scoring lines. They did absolutely nothing to even try to address this at the draft, Logan Brown is on the last of his nine lives, and there's nothing even remotely resembling that in their otherwise deep prospect pool. So it's time for Dorion to work some magic... and btw Stepan v2.0 is not going to be good enough.

Savard is someone I had been thinking could be a valuable RHD partner for Chabot, but I think Montreal is seriously after him, especially given Weber's injury. Given the Cup win, he could also wind up with more term and salary than the Senators really want to commit to. And with the emergence of Bernard-Docker, they might want to be careful about not jamming up the RHD situation, because Zaitsev and Zub are already competent options there, plus Thomson could start to push for more ice time as well.

The real killer for them is the C situation on the scoring lines. They did absolutely nothing to even try to address this at the draft, Logan Brown is on the last of his nine lives, and there's nothing even remotely resembling that in their otherwise deep prospect pool. So it's time for Dorion to work some magic... and btw Stepan v2.0 is not going to be good enough.
- khawk

Friedman link Strome to a possibility at Ottawa again yesterday

I wonder if the Sens would consider Savard as a fit at the RD. He’s declined some but played big minutes on highly competitive CLB teams. Savard may only want to go to a Cup contender. But he’s from Quebec and if the salary and term is right, he could
work.





Boucher looks to have a solid chance of being a valuable bottom 6 player. Sillinger who was picked right behind him seemed to be the best player available. Sillinger is projected to be an offensive force with top 6 potential. Boucher isn’t a bad pick but I think you gotta go with the next best player in the top 10 picks.
- Minnyhock

Also good friend with Chabot and trained with him in the summer and on the same pair when play little tournament. But like Khawk said Montreal seem to have an agreement in place

For anyone interested, here is an in depth pre-draft scouting article on Boucher.

https://smahtscouting.com...ing-report-tyler-boucher/

Friedman link Strome to a possibility at Ottawa again yesterday
- Crosside

Strome might be the final outcome.

I am perplexed by the Reinhardt trade to Florida. Ottawa was reported as being very interested and could have easily offered a better option to Buffalo (including a #10 pick). Makes me think Dorion has something different taking shape.

I hope the Sens stay as far away as possible from Eichel. But Strome in a 3 way with Buffalo and Rangers could make sense.

My preferred option remains Henrique.

Indeed... funny how most teams don't have to do this kind of damage control before the draft weekend is even finished...
https://www.thescore.com/...-doesnt-know-what-we-know

Does it have something to do with the Sporting News giving them the worst grade of any team at the draft, or the Hockey News discussing them as the first big loser of the day? Probably, but surely you could have seen that heat coming when you go off the board so often that your 6th round pick is being cited as your best selection. Not to mention that going out of your way to arrogantly claim that you "know" for sure that Boucher would have been picked in the top-20 is a complete lie. At best, you might have some general intel that he was on the radar of other teams, but there's no way to know which teams would have made the same reach pick to select him. Meanwhile, Dorion's endorsement of the picks was almost hilariously passive...

"We targeted some players and we were able to get all of them. It's a great day for our organization, adding some prospects to our group."

It's like he's describing the functional act of successfully drafting players into the NHL, instead of being even remotely excited about the specific players involved. But he's right... they certainly did have "some players" on a list, and managed to add "some prospects" to their group. That statement will hold up in court, and nobody can deny that. High five.
- khawk

It seems that all your efforts of the past 3 months going through draft rankings to pre-select the best players for Ottawa was a big waste of time.
Given the limited viewings, it is no surprise to see greater divergence between draft rankings lists and draft selections, especially from round 2 onwards.
As for Ty Boucher, he does seem to have good speed/skill to go with the pure nastiness. I'd have to think that the New York Rangers would have selected him at 15th overall, given their excessive team softness which was exposed by a lack of response in the Tom Wilson incident.

Strome might be the final outcome.

I am perplexed by the Reinhardt trade to Florida. Ottawa was reported as being very interested and could have easily offered a better option to Buffalo (including a #10 pick). Makes me think Dorion has something different taking shape.

I hope the Sens stay as far away as possible from Eichel. But Strome in a 3 way with Buffalo and Rangers could make sense.

My preferred option remains Henrique.
- spatso

Me I would like both. Henrique to replace Tierney and Strome for playing with Stutzle. But I m scared Dorion trade the 2022 first pick

For anyone interested, here is an in depth pre-draft scouting article on Boucher.

https://smahtscouting.com...ing-report-tyler-boucher/
- HoweHatrick

Good perspective.

Great scouts look at the strengths and weaknesses of a young prospect's game. They then set about deciding if they can take the best of what he does and develop him so he can execute at that level every shift. They look at the worst and determine if it is a fixable error. Great scouts don't look at what you are playing against other kids. They need to project what you can be playing against hardened professionals.

Amateur evaluators get seduced into loving flash, creativity and offensive production. But there are only a few in every draft that can bring this to the NHL level. Can a kid be developed to play an NHL game is far more complex than a simple assumption that your USHL scoring numbers are the best indicators of your probability of success.

It seems that all your efforts of the past 3 months going through draft rankings to pre-select the best players for Ottawa was a big waste of time.
Given the limited viewings, it is no surprise to see greater divergence between draft rankings lists and draft selections, especially from round 2 onwards.
As for Ty Boucher, he does seem to have good speed/skill to go with the pure nastiness. I'd have to think that the New York Rangers would have selected him at 15th overall, given their excessive team softness which was exposed by a lack of response in the Tom Wilson incident.
- SensFan25

It will cause a freak out among the amateur commentators if the Sens and Rangers do a three way and part of the package going back to the Rangers includes Boucher.

But, I just don't think the Rangers are crazy enough to blow it all up and pull the trigger in a deal for Eichel.