Theo Fox: Curved Groove Thoughts on the emerging debate on whether the Blackhawks should move Kirby Dach to wing, bump him to the 3rd line, or even reassign him to the AHL.

Plus, a look at the Hockey News 2021-22 Prospects Unlimited edition and seeing projected outlooks for several Chicago youngsters.

Unless the new GM looks to pull a rabbit out of a hat, it is tough to imagine improvement comes from a trade. Until a team is fleeced in the bartering, don't expect gifts.

This team is farther behind turning the corner and competing for a playoff spot if projection for both Dach and Mitchell fall short. There remains a large remaining schedule so we can look at progress sometimes more in minor leagues, in incremental fashion. That could mean segments of 2o gp or whatever.

Once I spoke to the Icehogs old play- by -play announcer and he compared improvement seen from one increment to the next. This is a reasonable way to gauge development. I am sure Theo, for wom II am appreciative for his Rockford files, concurs and can address this topic later this season.

Theo referenced Beaudin development from increment to increment last season. But this season Beaudin was off to a rocky start, though he has been better lately

The development is a process for prospects to be sure. Whether short term for a year like what our friend Darth Kane feigns will be the case for high end prospect C Caufield. And not the long wait to see Justin Holl carve out a career - which is precarious now as a Maple Leaf but perhaps he could land elsewhere and stick around. Yes, Holl was Blackhawks prospect once upon a time. He tried wing, too, before returning to the blueline

While there are disappoints along the way - C Kyrs may be one example - he might catch on elsewhere. He is in a numbers game here. I suggest his size and style is such that others have come along whom the old and new GM want to see now more than Kyrs. Perhaps the GM's are not as enthralled with Kyrs now - who knows.

Intriguing prospects could become role players in the NHL. Both forwards and dmen.

Intriguing prospects include Rogula due to his shot and size. He is working on using his large frame to pin and check the opponent regularly. His shot, oh my if that could be a weapon sort of like a secret weapon coming from a third pair. Reportedly hus skating is improved

I know Galvas' experience showed well in camp. I discount the horrendous shots surrendered by Rockford due to the same Colliton system and some bad dmen like Krutil and Stanton shouldn't be in the AHL.

I am also intrigued by Crevier composure and steadiness. His big frame can be an advantage defending. Like others trying to play in a man's league, Crevier needs to get stronger. We have read encouraging reports on Kaiser and Vlasic too. They skate well. Vlasic needs to get meaner - will he - as he develops he could use his size and strength to play a physical brand.

Veterans will be dumped at trade deadline and over next off season. The future is the kids

To reference an old White Sox season advertisrment: "The kids can play," but just how well how soon.

We're waiting it out

I'd keep Dach in the NHL. He plays defense well for a center already. He's not overmatched physically. He gets a few greasy goals and voila, he's got offense numbers too.

i first saw Hossa play live in Jr for Portland. right away you could tell he was a special player. best free agent signing ever!

Lists like this are always suspect, but perhaps this is what the decision makers saw when they changed the process and went after Jones, McCabe, Johnson, Fleury….

Three (at the time) in the top-100, no other blue-chippers, a whole lot of B-listers.

Sounds like there won’t be much top-level skaters coming up soon - the current roster in The Show is as good as it’s going to get. Players not here yet are merely replacements for those that are, not dramatic improvements, except for Reichel.

Not a blue-chipper on the blue line in the system.

Kane and Toews (both off-contract after next season), Jones and deBrincat (young and proven), Dach and Reichel (young and unproven) - is that enough A-listers to move this team forward to Cup-contention? The rest are merely JAGs. (Even Hagel.).

How many top-level players does a team need to compete for a Cup?

Not a good evaluation of Bowman’s activities in rebuilding a roster.

Oh, well - we can always hope that this list is as bad a talent evaluation as most of the others.

Thanks Theo - Let's not forget Dach lost an entire year being out with a wrist injury (and it wasn't even due to an NHL game). Included with that is the year off also included Toews being away from the ice. I am not an athlete or a hockey player, so I am not sure how a wrist injury may or may not affect the way you play, hold your stick, shoot, take face-offs, but I think everyone is being a bit hard on this kid now.

"He's not overmatched physically."

I disagree with this. But he is still a kid. A 10 or 12 stint in the A might be a good thing at this point.

Comparing his production (PPG) directly with the two players drafted before him and the player after (J. Hughes, K. Kakko & B. Byram) he is the second most productive player of the top 4 drafted in 2019.

He plays special teams and seems more defensively responsible than you would expect for a 20 year old playing the pivot. One thing I don't think he gets enough credit for (because he needs to work on his shooting/ability to finish plays) is how many high quality scoring chances he gets. Eventually he is going to start putting 2 and 2 together and burying more of those and his production will increase.

I'm not sure sending him to the AHL would really help his development at this point, when he clearly belongs in the NHL and can handle top 6 minutes. It's better for the team to have him learning in the NHL as he can obviously be a responsible role player as is.

I don't think Kirby has been a disappointment at all. He seems like he's well on his way to becoming a difference maker in the league and for this team. He also missed almost the entirety of last season (and probably returned too early) after a major wrist break. Perhaps a little more patience with a 20-year-old of his size and ability would be warranted here.

Just my opinion, but I don't agree with your assessment of him at all.

Thanks Theo - Let's not forget Dach lost an entire year being out with a wrist injury (and it wasn't even due to an NHL game). Included with that is the year off also included Toews being away from the ice. I am not an athlete or a hockey player, so I am not sure how a wrist injury may or may not affect the way you play, hold your stick, shoot, take face-offs, but I think everyone is being a bit hard on this kid now.
- powerenforcer

Agreed PE. We have to show some patience with him. I really think he should be given a list of things to work on, sent to Rockford and be allowed to work on those skills in an environment with far less pressure.

Dach continues to display the positives he showed in junior.
He is a s art two way centre.
Does he have the face off figured out?

Does he have a major league shot from the perimeter?

Those will come.

I would view a Rockford trip as a panic button.

I have no idea about his inner confidence or over confidence about his NHL experience, but I am betting he thinks he belongs.

I am sure letting others take the face-off as he is positioned on the flank in the start of the play is something he wants to change.


Marc Scheifele was a 34 point player in his 3rd season, and really wasn't isn't more than a 48% face off winner now and historically.

That IS still better than offensively than what we have gotten from Dach, but I think patience is the key. He plays and entire ice better than Scheifele is instinctively disciplined defensively and usually back there helping out AS the opposition is entering the attack zone.

On Dach, A few years ago on the-rink's podcast they had Bill Placzek on there talking about him. He was described as a multi-tooled pass first big guy who can back check and play in his own zone but probably isn't going to blow your skirt up.

I don't think there's been anything to be disappointed about the player. He was never predicted to be a dominant force except by the bozo's who were comparing him to a Getzlaf type player.

He looked very good when he first came up, broke his wrist playing with children because the former GM was super smart, did not look great in the games he played last year (obviously) and is working to regain form after no having played a complete season since he was in the minors.

He doesn't look terribly out of place and he needs to figure out when playing with Kane that he probably shouldn't be the one holding onto the puck. Putting him the middle with Towes on one side and Kubalik on the other probably helps because then he can be in the set up role he is probably more comfortable with. Or just flipping him and Toews if you can't get over moving Toews to wing to accommodate his current level of play accomplishes the same thing.

But all in all, he's played fine up and down the ice, and has been the reliable defense first, pass first maybe hold the puck too long player he was described as. Seems a little ridiculous to be disappointed with someone who meets expectations.

Agreed PE. We have to show some patience with him. I really think he should be given a list of things to work on, sent to Rockford and be allowed to work on those skills in an environment with far less pressure.
- paulr

I often agree with the marinate in the AHL thing. Better for the young defensemen to play top 4 and special teams in Rockford than 5/6/7 minutes and matchups in Chicago. Better for a kid with top six potential to play top six on the Rock than 4th line in Chicago.

With Dach, imo, it depends on what is on his list of things to work on. If it is his shot, I'm not sure how it will improve more in the AHL that in the Show. As far as pressure goes, not a lot of that in Chicago at this point.

Sometimes it just takes a few years for guys to click. We gave up on Teravainen too early. Look at a guy like Troy Terry having a breakout season with the Ducks at 24. Plenty of reason for optimism with Dach. He's still only 20 and a year behind schedule cause of his injury. Just keep giving him an opportunity and the results will come eventually.

I wouldn't doubt the comparison could arise, but I always saw Dach along the lines of Couturier. Haven't seen enough of him to know whether his defensive game is as consistent as Couts' was at that age, but I wouldn't be surprised to see him follow that kind of trajectory.

I often agree with the marinate in the AHL thing. Better for the young defensemen to play top 4 and special teams in Rockford than 5/6/7 minutes and matchups in Chicago. Better for a kid with top six potential to play top six on the Rock than 4th line in Chicago.

With Dach, imo, it depends on what is on his list of things to work on. If it is his shot, I'm not sure how it will improve more in the AHL that in the Show. As far as pressure goes, not a lot of that in Chicago at this point.
- mohel

(frank) you Troll! How dare you disagree with me! I will never again respond you! And anything you say from this point on I will disagree with it, even if I agree with it.

Joking aside. If there were one or two things Dach needed to work on I’d agree to leave him in the NHL, however there are a number of things he has problems with. He came out of junior and his weakness was scoring, he has trouble getting his shot off, his tends to stickhandle himself into trouble, he’s weak on faceoffs, when he doesn’t have the puck he seldom gets himself into open areas for a pass and at times in the offensive zones he can get caught standing still watching the play develop instead of finding open ice and making plays happen. And yes there are definitely strong points to his game. He’s an excellent passer, he’s very creative finding guys for passes, he’s not afraid to go to tough areas and his defensive work is way above average for someone of his age and experience, which is unusual.

Dach in the Hawks lineup does nothing for Chicago this season. Dach learning and working on his weak points in Rockford may be very beneficial for Chicago next season, assuming of course your assertion he can learn all of it playing in the NHL is true.

Dach was drafted to be the next Toews but he’s developing into the next Anisimov.

I’m in the keep Dach up in the NHL at this time. He’s responsible defensively, and he’s getting scoring chances, once he starts converting on those chances he’ll be fine. He needs to add strength, that can probably be facilitated more so with the Hawks than with the Hogs. One 3 point game and he’s at .50 PPG pace.

Sometimes it just takes a few years for guys to click. We gave up on Teravainen too early. Look at a guy like Troy Terry having a breakout season with the Ducks at 24. Plenty of reason for optimism with Dach. He's still only 20 and a year behind schedule cause of his injury. Just keep giving him an opportunity and the results will come eventually.
- Hawkeynation

I don’t think anyone gave up on Teravainen. He was a cap casualty plain and simple. We could, and have, argued till we’re blue in the face what the right course of action would have been to solve the cap woes. But, I’m pretty sure nobody, including Stan really wanted to part with him.

I don’t think anyone gave up on Teravainen. He was a cap casualty plain and simple. We could, and have, argued till we’re blue in the face what the right course of action would have been to solve the cap woes. But, I’m pretty sure nobody, including Stan really wanted to part with him.
- Ogilthorpe2

But i like his point about Teuvo, he started out on the 3rd line here, Q liked his defense enough to keep him playing with the big boys, and as he got older, even though there were some rumored complaints about how he'd rather play golf in the offseason, his offensive ability began to blossom as he got older. I'm afraid we will see the samething with Boqvist in Columbus, and hopefully the same thing with Dach

Today @ 10:22 AM ET
I’m in the keep Dach up in the NHL at this time. He’s responsible defensively, and he’s getting scoring chances, once he starts converting on those chances he’ll be fine. He needs to add strength, that can probably be facilitated more so with the Hawks than with the Hogs. One 3 point game and he’s at .50 PPG pace.

Angotti

If you keep Dach in the NHL, you should not be playing him between ADB and Kane. Play him as a third (or second) line center, and tell him to drive that line, instead of deferring to the 2. Why would you want a pass first center playing with Kane? I would want a finisher (ADB obviously), and ideally to me Toews (or try Kurashev, or Strome with King's tweaks of the system).

But i like his point about Teuvo, he started out on the 3rd line here, Q liked his defense enough to keep him playing with the big boys, and as he got older, even though there were some rumored complaints about how he'd rather play golf in the offseason, his offensive ability began to blossom as he got older. I'm afraid we will see the samething with Boqvist in Columbus, and hopefully the same thing with Dach
- BetweenTheDots

Last week you wanted Dach in Rockford to work his game, today you want him to stay in Chicago to work on his game. So which one is it?

I often agree with the marinate in the AHL thing. Better for the young defensemen to play top 4 and special teams in Rockford than 5/6/7 minutes and matchups in Chicago. Better for a kid with top six potential to play top six on the Rock than 4th line in Chicago.

With Dach, imo, it depends on what is on his list of things to work on. If it is his shot, I'm not sure how it will improve more in the AHL that in the Show. As far as pressure goes, not a lot of that in Chicago at this point.
- mohel

Maybe more shots will go in against AHL goalies, and it will give him more confidence. I like him with Kane and ADB, but I feel like he looks to pass rather than assess the play. Maybe if he has more confidence in his shot, he will shoot first if that's what the defense is giving him. That line could be a killer line if all 3 of them would shoot; the defense wouldn't know who to cover.

(frank) you Troll! How dare you disagree with me! I will never again respond you! And anything you say from this point on I will disagree with it, even if I agree with it.

Joking aside. If there were one or two things Dach needed to work on I’d agree to leave him in the NHL, however there are a number of things he has problems with. He came out of junior and his weakness was scoring, he has trouble getting his shot off, his tends to stickhandle himself into trouble, he’s weak on faceoffs, when he doesn’t have the puck he seldom gets himself into open areas for a pass and at times in the offensive zones he can get caught standing still watching the play develop instead of finding open ice and making plays happen. And yes there are definitely strong points to his game. He’s an excellent passer, he’s very creative finding guys for passes, he’s not afraid to go to tough areas and his defensive work is way above average for someone of his age and experience, which is unusual.

Dach in the Hawks lineup does nothing for Chicago this season. Dach learning and working on his weak points in Rockford may be very beneficial for Chicago next season, assuming of course your assertion he can learn all of it playing in the NHL is true.
- paulr

Yep, I fully agree that Chicago's needs take a back seat to the development of any player at this point. I'm not very worried about Dach either way; I think the key to his development is his mindset, and I think he's like ADB in that regard. So, I think he is the least of their problems.

Last week you wanted Dach in Rockford to work his game, today you want him to stay in Chicago to work on his game. So which one is it?
- paulr

Cruiser: I thought I would sign up before I was drafted.

Hulka: Son, there ain't no draft no more.

Cruiser: There was one?

But i like his point about Teuvo, he started out on the 3rd line here, Q liked his defense enough to keep him playing with the big boys, and as he got older, even though there were some rumored complaints about how he'd rather play golf in the offseason, his offensive ability began to blossom as he got older. I'm afraid we will see the samething with Boqvist in Columbus, and hopefully the same thing with Dach
- BetweenTheDots

Keep in mind who was in front of him on that team. Kane and Hossa on the RWs. Saad, Sharp, Bickell on the LWs. That team also had the human multi-tool, Andrew Shaw.

The Hawks, as currently constructed, don't have that type of talent.