Mike Augello: Leafs Pass The Leadership Torch From Tavares To Matthews

Sharing for those who missed the press conf.





One interesting tidbit I picked up (aside from confirmation that JT will wear an "A") was that in answering the ? about if JT would wear the "A" Tre did make mention that he and Berbue would discuss the leadership situation - which I think is in relation to who else wears an "A". Will be interesting to see how that plays out - maybe they will stop the rotating "A", maybe Willy will get to wear an A who knows!

"I’m honored to follow in John’s footsteps and continue our work in leading this team along with so many other leaders within our dressing room."
- mikeinbuffalo

He must really enjoy long summer vacations if he plans to follow in John's footsteps.

Well, this should certainly help.

Saw this on twitter - thought I'd share here as it's relatable to some of the conversations that have been happening last few days & is a bit of a counter point to the "Marner being the top point producer in the playoffs" point/argument.

Just food for thought (if accurate, as I'm also not sure if these are actually accurate or not).

Saw this on twitter - thought I'd share here as it's relatable to some of the conversations that have been happening last few days & is a bit of a counter point to the "Marner being the top point producer in the playoffs" point/argument.

Just food for thought (if accurate, as I'm also not sure if these are actually accurate or not).



- Cush29

That's not really a hard thing to find out. It's on NHL.com from game logs. It's quite accurate. The things it doesn't say are game performance etc. Not that it claims to do so. We've got one more year with the team with a new voice and an emboldened old voice. Add to that a new defense core and the hopes of a young goalie able to be healthy/stable, it's going to be an interesting year.

Saw this on twitter - thought I'd share here as it's relatable to some of the conversations that have been happening last few days & is a bit of a counter point to the "Marner being the top point producer in the playoffs" point/argument.

Just food for thought (if accurate, as I'm also not sure if these are actually accurate or not).



- Cush29

James Tanner: "Bad luck...for all four of them....for 6 consecutive years."

That's not really a hard thing to find out. It's on NHL.com from game logs. It's quite accurate. The things it doesn't say are game performance etc. Not that it claims to do so. We've got one more year with the team with a new voice and an emboldened old voice. Add to that a new defense core and the hopes of a young goalie able to be healthy/stable, it's going to be an interesting year.
- AdamFrench

I wasn't saying it was necessarily hard to find out.

I just wasn't super interested in doing a bunch of digging to validate it so I was putting it out there that the info was unverified.

The Leafs are the Buffalo Sabres of the NHL

Sharing for those who missed the press conf.



One interesting tidbit I picked up (aside from confirmation that JT will wear an "A") was that in answering the ? about if JT would wear the "A" Tre did make mention that he and Berbue would discuss the leadership situation - which I think is in relation to who else wears an "A". Will be interesting to see how that plays out - maybe they will stop the rotating "A", maybe Willy will get to wear an A who knows!
- Cush29

kptn

kptn
- dmnted

No clue what this means?

Saw this on twitter - thought I'd share here as it's relatable to some of the conversations that have been happening last few days & is a bit of a counter point to the "Marner being the top point producer in the playoffs" point/argument.

Just food for thought (if accurate, as I'm also not sure if these are actually accurate or not).



- Cush29

It's true - but what does it say versus what you choose to infer from it?

If you look at Series clinching games (a game where a win can end the series one way or the other), you have:

Matthews: 18GP, 6G, 7A, 1 GWG, 1 PPG
Marner: 20GP, 2G, 11A, 2 GWG, 3 PPA
Nylander: 20GP, 8G, 8A, 1 GWG, 1 PPG, 1 PPA
Tavares: 13GP, 5G, 5A, 1GWG, 1 PPA

From a points/game perspective both Nylander and Tavares are actually leading the team - but Marner and Matthews are 0.1 Points/game behind.

Ultimately the team as a whole fails itself when these games matter.

If you look at the minutiae of the elimination games you see evolution from Nylander, as an example - he was good against Washington in 2017 but failed to register a point (5 shots), but was largely a no show against Boston in 2018 (no shots, -1, but he did have 2 assists, but since he is a shooter for us it's a blemish not a black mark), again in 2019 no shots and -2, 2020 against Columbus 2 shots, no points and -3. 2021 against Montreal he had a goal and 2 shots, and the last few games - he was good in our loss to Florida with 6 shots and an assist, or all three elimination games against Boston this year where he had 5 shots in each and wasn't a negative in any of the games.

The challenge with measuring Marner is that he's not a shooter, so you have games - like the loss to Washington in 2017 - where his stat line is a 0 - no shots, no assists - nothing. 2018 against Boston he had an assist and was -2; 2019 against Boston nothing (5 shots) and was -1. Against Columbus he had a big game to keep us alive (3 assists, 8 shots) but in the elimination game he came up empty with 1 shot and was -1. Montreal 2 shots and -1. Tampa 2022 was an assist and 2 shots and then Tampa 2023 was 3 shots and +2 before turning in a 5 shot and nothing to show for it performance against Florida. This year against Boston he really wasn't himself, I contend. Game 7 he was -1 and had a shot.

Now when I bear this poop out in terms of what I watched and what I was thinking - I thought at times Marner was beaten around by Florida but he was still making plays, we just weren't cashing past Bobrovski. I felt that we still largely outplayed them in the series but were goalied. This year Marner was not effective against Boston - I think we can generally agree on that - but the team as a whole didn't really excel. The only one we found, collectively, who really stood out was Nylander and for one game, Matthews.

i hope they dont do a stupid torch pass that the habs do every couple years

i hope they dont do a stupid torch pass that the habs do every couple years
- drexel

Every couple of years?

Don't be silly.

They've been doing it every year since 2008 ffs.

We're all tired of seeing the goddamn torch!

Every couple of years?

Don't be silly.

They've been doing it every year since 2008 ffs.

We're all tired of seeing the goddamn torch!
- Scabeh

Dio has rocked for a long, long time,
Now it's time for him to pass the torch.
He has songs of wildebeests and angels,
He has soared on the wings of a demon.

It's true - but what does it say versus what you choose to infer from it?

If you look at Series clinching games (a game where a win can end the series one way or the other), you have:

Matthews: 18GP, 6G, 7A, 1 GWG, 1 PPG
Marner: 20GP, 2G, 11A, 2 GWG, 3 PPA
Nylander: 20GP, 8G, 8A, 1 GWG, 1 PPG, 1 PPA
Tavares: 13GP, 5G, 5A, 1GWG, 1 PPA

From a points/game perspective both Nylander and Tavares are actually leading the team - but Marner and Matthews are 0.1 Points/game behind.

Ultimately the team as a whole fails itself when these games matter.

If you look at the minutiae of the elimination games you see evolution from Nylander, as an example - he was good against Washington in 2017 but failed to register a point (5 shots), but was largely a no show against Boston in 2018 (no shots, -1, but he did have 2 assists, but since he is a shooter for us it's a blemish not a black mark), again in 2019 no shots and -2, 2020 against Columbus 2 shots, no points and -3. 2021 against Montreal he had a goal and 2 shots, and the last few games - he was good in our loss to Florida with 6 shots and an assist, or all three elimination games against Boston this year where he had 5 shots in each and wasn't a negative in any of the games.

The challenge with measuring Marner is that he's not a shooter, so you have games - like the loss to Washington in 2017 - where his stat line is a 0 - no shots, no assists - nothing. 2018 against Boston he had an assist and was -2; 2019 against Boston nothing (5 shots) and was -1. Against Columbus he had a big game to keep us alive (3 assists, 8 shots) but in the elimination game he came up empty with 1 shot and was -1. Montreal 2 shots and -1. Tampa 2022 was an assist and 2 shots and then Tampa 2023 was 3 shots and +2 before turning in a 5 shot and nothing to show for it performance against Florida. This year against Boston he really wasn't himself, I contend. Game 7 he was -1 and had a shot.

Now when I bear this poop out in terms of what I watched and what I was thinking - I thought at times Marner was beaten around by Florida but he was still making plays, we just weren't cashing past Bobrovski. I felt that we still largely outplayed them in the series but were goalied. This year Marner was not effective against Boston - I think we can generally agree on that - but the team as a whole didn't really excel. The only one we found, collectively, who really stood out was Nylander and for one game, Matthews.
- Monkeypunk

To answer your ? / speak to the bolded.

It says / tells me Marner has not produced as many points in games 4-7 as the others full stop. The fact (or excuse) he is viewed by some as a passer and not a shooter doesn't hold water here - if he's the top notch playmaker he should have racked up points via assists in games 5 - 7 shouldn't he? Are we going to say others not scoring is the problem because Marner's playmaking was at the same level in the playoffs it was in the regular season?

I get that this can easily be a chicken and egg thing, "guys don't score so the playmaker looks bad" vs "playmaker doesn't set up the guys to score well in the playoffs so they don't score and look bad" - the truth is it's probably both to some degree but when the elite playmaker has half the points of the next player from the 'core'.....

To me it doesn't make sense to say Marner shouldn't' be expected to score because he's an elite playmaker and not a shooter, IMO he should be both at 10.9M but in games 5-7 he hasn't really been either.

It's fine to say the entire team has failed in games 5-7 for the most part and you wont' get any argument from me but I think it's fair and accurate to say Marner has failed harder than the others. He has 5 points in the past 5 years in games 5-7 which is half of any of the other core players 7 plays on PP1 and the 1st line vs JT or Willy who are on PP1 but 2nd line.

As far as your stats around "series clinching" games most series are going 5 or more so to me the stats around games 5-7 are far more important / telling.

Honestly I don't care if a guy isn't great in game 4 but can pick it up in games 5-7, series sweeps don't happen often enough IMO.

No clue what this means?
- Cush29

i though it was short captain

i hope they dont do a stupid torch pass that the habs do every couple years
- drexel

nope, it was a pat on the chest by the previous captain

James Tanner: "Bad luck...for all four of them....for 6 consecutive years."
- jmatchett383

true.

i though it was short captain
- dmnted

Ah! lol

Got it. Brain is more mushy than normal today as I'm on day 2 of 4 of conducting virtual interviews.

Man it's wild how unprepared some folks are and how little listening they do when being interviewed.

I feel like some of it is like this:

"tell us your favourite colour and why it's your favourite"


"yep ok sure. Dog, I love dogs and lamps and the number 7 because fried green tomatoes"

So painful.

To answer your ? / speak to the bolded.

It says / tells me Marner has not produced as many points in games 4-7 as the others full stop. The fact (or excuse) he is viewed by some as a passer and not a shooter doesn't hold water here - if he's the top notch playmaker he should have racked up points via assists in games 5 - 7 shouldn't he? Are we going to say others not scoring is the problem because Marner's playmaking was at the same level in the playoffs it was in the regular season?

I get that this can easily be a chicken and egg thing, "guys don't score so the playmaker looks bad" vs "playmaker doesn't set up the guys to score well in the playoffs so they don't score and look bad" - the truth is it's probably both to some degree but when the elite playmaker has half the points of the next player from the 'core'.....

To me it doesn't make sense to say Marner shouldn't' be expected to score because he's an elite playmaker and not a shooter, IMO he should be both at 10.9M but in games 5-7 he hasn't really been either.

It's fine to say the entire team has failed in games 5-7 for the most part and you wont' get any argument from me but I think it's fair and accurate to say Marner has failed harder than the others. He has 5 points in the past 5 years in games 5-7 which is half of any of the other core players 7 plays on PP1 and the 1st line vs JT or Willy who are on PP1 but 2nd line.

As far as your stats around "series clinching" games most series are going 5 or more so to me the stats around games 5-7 are far more important / telling.

Honestly I don't care if a guy isn't great in game 4 but can pick it up in games 5-7, series sweeps don't happen often enough IMO.
- Cush29

Honestly I care that a player is great throughout the playoffs - and we have yet to see that from _any_ of them. But I firmly believe that games 1-4 matter too. Playing like garbage and then trying to come back and win it in games 5-7 is some serious Ricky Steamboat action. We don't need that, either.

The reason I like looking at whether a game was clinching or not is that not all game 5s are created equal. Games 6 & 7 are, by definition, a game where a team can be eliminated.

To the point I think you're making, though, when it comes to rising to the occasion - which is that "in the moment" thing Marner has definitely left was wanting more, but unfortunately so have our other core players. But Marner has tragically bad games 6&7 stats.

Now I'm looking at their careers as a Leaf, not just from 2019, but:

Marner

Game 1: 9GP, 4G / 5A; 1 GWG 0 PPG 3 PPA
Game 2: 9GP, 4G / 7A; 0 GWG 1 PPG 5 PPA
Game 3: 9GP, 0G / 9A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 3 PPA
Game 4: 9GP, 2G / 10A; 1 GWG 0 PPG 4 PPA
Game 5: 9GP, 0G / 5A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 1 PPA
Game 6: 7GP, 1G / 1A; 1 GWG 0 PPG 0 PPA
Game 7: 5GP, 0G / 2A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 0 PPA


Matthews

Game 1: 9GP, 2G / 4A; 0 GWG 1 PPG 1 PPA
Game 2: 9GP, 3G / 10A; 3 GWG 0 PPG 5 PPA
Game 3: 9GP, 4G / 3A; 1 GWG 1 PPG 2 PPA
Game 4: 9GP, 6G / 3A; 1 GWG 3 PPG 1 PPA
Game 5: 8GP, 4G / 2A; 1 GWG 0 PPG 0 PPA
Game 6: 6GP, 4G / 0A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 0 PPA
Game 7: 5GP, 0G / 3A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 0 PPA


Nylander

Game 1: 8GP, 3G / 0A; 0 GWG 1 PPG 0 PPA
Game 2: 8GP, 2G / 4A; 1 GWG 1 PPG 0 PPA
Game 3: 8GP, 3G / 3A; 0 GWG 1 PPG 0 PPA
Game 4: 9GP, 5G / 6A; 1 GWG 2 PPG 2 PPA
Game 5: 9GP, 2G / 5A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 1 PPA
Game 6: 7GP, 3G / 3A; 1 GWG 0 PPG 0 PPA
Game 7: 5GP, 2G / 2A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 1 PPA

Tavares

Game 1: 7GP, 1G / 3A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 2 PPA
Game 2: 6GP, 5G / 0A; 0 GWG 2 PPG 0 PPA
Game 3: 6GP, 0G / 1A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 1 PPA
Game 4: 6GP, 1G / 3A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 1 PPA
Game 5: 6GP, 1G / 5A; 0 GWG 1 PPG 0 PPA
Game 6: 4GP, 3G / 0A; 1 GWG 0 PPG 0 PPA
Game 7: 3GP, 1G / 0A; 0 GWG 0 PPG 0 PPA

In Game 7, if it's not Nylander, the team sucks. What is really telling about the team is that in games 5-7 the power play goes to poop. If you use that same metric (that you'd want to dismiss, but I think it's a crucial metric for a player and a team) of clinching games:

The Leafs are 24/123 on the PP in normal games (19.5%), and 4/43 (9.3%) in series clinching games. Our opposition, for the record is 33/124 (26.6%) and 10/43 (23.3%) in those same games.

Those stats can't be laid solely at the feet of Marner as much as many want to do so.

For the record I've said all along that I'm not opposed to moving on from Marner or Nylander - as long as the trade brings in a piece we need. Cap flexibility with no clear plan on what to do with the cap room is pointless and makes us worse. But both are excellent players who have been maligned unfairly at times for much of their time here.

Leafs

Well, this should certainly help.
- Pacificgem

Let them have their day.
Anyway, the train wreck in Edmonton is far more interesting.