do so and everything will be fine....

First game at the old "Madhouse" made me a fan, sitting in the
smoke filled upper balcony, feeling it shake like it was going
to collapse when a guy in red hit a guy in brown, it was amazing,
it was hockey, it was great.

Watching games, heartbreak of 71, hope in 92, then the darktime
until Rocky came in and put them back on the tube, winning 3 in 6
was beyond my imagination, seeing Corey grow into being a great
goalie, best in the league since 12, hating to see him go thru what
ever it is that's happening to him, personally I think the Malkin hit
was one to many for him, will we ever see him play again?

Anyhow I think Q is an impediment to the near future and Stan is
in totally over his head, NTC to Ward Kunitz, like duh

I just want compete, last year was as bad as it gets in hockey, no
fight no pushback no effort, it wasn't easy to watch my favourite
team and I actually started hoping for the Jets to win the Cup with
Buff.....they played the game how the Hawks used to

I'll share my story, since I feel mine is going to be very different from people on this board.

I grew up playing street hockey and pond hockey in the winters. We would play every night in the summer at our library and every weekend during the winter. But baseball was always my sport, so that's what I watched and played. I owned a Hawks sweater, but don't think I even listend/saw a game until college. My buddy was a big Hawks fans and I started watching games in 2008 and instantly became hooked. The constant action, the fights, the finesse and power. I started paying attention to everything I could, staying up late to watch the west coast games. Keith immediately became my favorite for everything he put out on that ice. '09 was my first experience at the UC for a Hawks game, and no more convincing was needed, I was a Hawks fan. Luckily for me, when I only need a year until I got to taste the thrill of victory. I know, bandwagon, oh well... I don't give a s**t. At that moment, it was my team and I loved hearing the cheers from those lifelongers who finally got it (I would get my Cubs a few years later ). I joined this board back in 2011 and started developing a greater knowledge for the sport, and the Hawks. Feeling the depth of the rivalries, planning out offseason and TDL moves. I know we all give the "One Goal" people crap for their marketing of the team, but it worked. The team, the players, the fans won me over and I'm not ever going to turn back. I hate talking down on bandwagon fans, mainly because I was there. You can call me one, but it is what it is. Everyone finds their sport and a team at different times. Embrace the newcomers and help educate. It's just a few more people to talk shop with.

This board has been fun since I joined. I've learned a lot and have had some fun debates. I mainly try and play devils advocate on a lot of things, not cause I love to argue, but it's a way to learn more about the sport. I don't ask why to challenge, but want a deeper understanding. Thanks for all you do, Justin (and JJ, if you're reading this).

They need to stop trying to win the way they did in the past.

Don’t go trying to find the next Hjalmarsson and Oduya. Just find competent D-men that know how to play the position.

Don’t try to find the next Shaw or Bolland, or Buff, find forwards that will play the system and be predictable. Obviously certain attributes are great to have, but they can’t be stuck in the past.

Each team changes every season, so what you did last year isn’t going to work the same as it didn’t before.
- Chunk

Mr or Ms Chunk, you are a must read for me. Concise, reasonable, clear minded, objective and despite what looks to be, and is really, very complicated in it's numerous dynamics/questions it's really quite simple.

For me it all starts as an organIzation, like any company, having one plan that all adhere to and buy into and then have the proper people in place to execute that plan. Simple, in theory.

You can't answer every question that will come up 2-3-4 yrs away but you can simply acquire the very best available players thru the draft and trades and coach/teach the system, whatever that is and has been agreed upon, and problem solve along the way allowing the talent and systems to do so.

Agree 100% the sooner management forgets the cup yrs the better except the takeaway being the depth of talent on those teams and coaching that got the best out of and slotted the talent correctly. Simple, in theory.

The complicated part is the hard cap. If you mangle that you have little chance of success and the Hawks are not starting with a blank slate as Vegas did. IMO the Hawks have to one by one correct their long term cap problems and each correction allows them to add 1 or 2 more players that will help. For me this is the most difficult part of getting back to relevancy. Do they do that by moving cap problems out or allowing time to fix it as these contracts expire?

This is where having an organIzational plan comes into play. How do they clear out cap issues and all the while collecting the best talent regardless of position and coaching the agreed upon system starting at Rockford.

Do they have the plan makers and coaches to execute that plan in place? If not they are rudderless.

Justin, you where spot on about the lack of transparency. This whole notion about giving this team any civility is just ridiculous on its face.

If getting smoked last year 4 straight playoff games against Nashville was unacceptable, clearly missing the playoffs falls squarely on Stans head. Stan fired coach Q assistants and brought in his newm assistants, traded a top 6 30 goal scorer 89 point elite player.

This team has had a year to move Hossa contract, the lack of urgency or accountability now reflects McDonogha and Rocky level of commitment to the team, the fans and a winning attitude.

There is a lot of blame to go around, coach Q allowing Toews, Keith Seabrook to play below their expectations and commitment, by not benching them enough or at all to send a statement that their play is not acceptable.

Going out and wasting valuable spending money on manning , Kuntz is clearly a lack of direction or change that is needed to either win or rebuild .


When you dig deeper Stan offered all these contracts without any thought of this teams future health. Rockford has nobody ready or anyone who will just be a top 6 forward, their defenseman all are years away from making the jump and being ready.



I'm grateful we witnessed 3 cups but that doesn't give them a pass for 3 years removed from the cup and declining with no urgency , accountability or lack of vision to this organization.

Justin, curious how you came to this conclusion.

Did I want Stan Bowman to sign Calvin de Haan and some help at centre? Yes.

After looking at the above, can I blame him for not doing so? No. I really can't.

add another piece on defence (Justin Faulk, Tyler Myers level) to help solidify the backend

All 3 Dmen are similar in age 27, 26, 28, all competent and similar in salary with Meyers making 1 mil per more at 5.5 mil per. Is it that you don't see De Haan in their class?

As far as these Blackhwks are concerned its not the loosing of last season that i hate so much its just they were so boring to watch. So lethargic , pushed around by everyone and awful goaltending.
- mrpaulish

IMO there are more times than not this club has been unwatchable for more than last yr. Even when they were winning they had the attitude that they can "coast" thru 2 periods and turn it on for one and with their overwhelming talent it worked but for me wasn't fun to watch.

The Hawks have not been hungry as a group for a long while. You simply can't go deep in the playoffs unless the group as a whole is hungry.

The Hawks are really a one trick pony. If they can't score with speed/skill they lose. The system and players can't win any other way. They will never out grit/battle/hunger/power their way to a win. Only speed/skill and when it's not working they are unwatchable.

The core it seems can no longer will their way to a win.

Chicago born and bred (now living in Los Angeles). First live sporting event I attended was a pro-hockey game. Chicago Cougars of the WHA- was 1974 (the year they played Howe in the finals.) Was at the old International Amphitheater (saw the Shriner's circus there each year as a kid). Dad worked as a bartender on Rush street, and a lot of White Sox players and personal would come in (I have autographed napkins of Harry Carey, Jimmy Piersol, Ritchie Zisk, Lamar Johnson, and a host of others, so of course I was a Sox fan- growing up near Wrigley Field on Addison- so go figure- but that is another story), so baseball was my sport of choice (albeit I was 4 at the time).

My dad gets tickets for the game- 2 rows off the ice near the corner. Place is 1/2 empty, really do not understand the game, but its fast. about 1/2 way into maybe the 2nd or 3rd period, play is in our end, and a mob of players come crashing into the glass, and it shatters, and glass is everywhere. May dad freaks out, looks at me to make sure I am OK, and he would be allowed back in the house by my mother, and I look at him and scream something like "I LOVE THIS GAME". And that was the start.

Attended a number of games at the old barn, up in the rafters, throwing pennies onto the ice during Blues pre-skate (miss that place- yes it was falling apart, but no better place to see a game), and fell in love less with the team (although coolest logo in sports) and more with the atmosphere. Also played as a kid at Mcfetridge (sp) and "pond" hockey at Paul Revere and in the burbs. Not a fast or particularly skilled skater, so became a goalie. Gave it up around HS- too expensive to play with the fees and equipment (and my growth sports).

As for what the future holds for the Hawks. If they believe they are better than they are, and make stupid trades, moves ala the White Sox 3-6 years ago, they will be a bubble playoff team at best. I think a full rebuild and dumping any assets you can (think Lou might like Kane to make up for losing JT? What about Dallas or Rangers or Tampa and Keith? Yes rebuilds take time and do not always work, but we have some really good pieces to trade (and no Hossa's contract is NOT one of them) which would bring back a mix of young players with potential as well as draft picks. Think we could be back sooner than the current rebuild on the fly that we seem to be trying. Either way, I have NO PROBLEM with them rebuilding. Just do it right.

Started liking the Hawks in the 90s because my dad was a huge fan.

Cared way more about basketball until after the 04-05 lockout, when my friends and I started going to games for $6 (with student ID). We likely cared more about the fights and getting on the jumbotron, which was surprisingly easy when there was 3 other people in your entire section. The games were lackluster, to say the least. Sharp and Keith looked ok, as did Seabrook. But when your best players are Mark Bell, Barnaby, Calder, etc. it's going to be a long season.

I was far from a diehard at that time, and definitely wish I took more advantage of $6 tickets. I cared more about music and high-school stuff until the Hawks took flight with Toews/Kane.

I joined my brother's fantasy league in 2011, and that's when the obsession really got out of hand. Analytics books, websites, forums like this, and way too much money spent.

I think my favorite part about being a fan was either Game 1 of the 2013 Cup that went to double OT, my dad ponied up for the tickets and took my brother and I. We had last row seats but they might as well have been lower VIP box to me.

Either that memory or going to almost every game of the tragic 2014 playoff run. My brother and I went to almost every game last minute, a couple times in the pouring rain. It was all for naught but man was that a great time to be a hockey fan.

Hey JL...great blog and nice job sneaking Myers in there.

I think Myers could be a player the Jets are willing to part with, they need to re-sign Hellebuyck, Trouba and Morrissey. Cap wise they don't need to dump Myers, but cash-flow is another issue.

Myers contract is up after next season, but so is Laine, Conner and Wheeler. Maybe they find a way to keep Myers, but I doubt it. The only questions would be - do they Jets hang on to Myers for another run and lose him for nothing or do they try to recoup an asset knowing the'd not sticking around long term?

From what I've been of Myers he's either really solid or really terrible, and I've seen both extremes often in the same game. He wouldn't be a bad addition, but certainly not worth overpaying for.

Zhamnov is one of the smoothest players I have ever seen in live action. He takes a lot of unwarranted heat from fans and that is mainly because he was traded for the popular JR.
I got hooked on the Hawks watching Bobby Hull and his big slap shot on grainy black and white rural television.
- 67hawks

I seriously couldn't believe it when Zhamnov became a Hawk!
I agree...soooo smooth.
Just effortless stick-handler it seemed.
One of the few players to score 5 goals in a game as well.
Every time I show people my office at home...they are dumbfounded by my collection of mostly Zhamnov and some Larmer stuff!
Sad part is when I am ready to let it go to a good home...I will have nobody to leave it too lol
At least not in Winnipeg

When new faces replaces Toews and Seabrook, a deeper rebuild is in progress. There is enough talent assembled right now to be competitive on a nightly basis, even if they wind up loosing more often than not.

Due to Rick's explanation about the terms in a contract, it appears that both player and team benefits when player retires on his own accord. But how does that happen when a player does not retire?

Can the player be made a player/coach and healthy scratch? I don't know what the choices are to risk with Toews and Seabrook once (whenever that comes) they are way bad. Which probably is at minimum one or more years away

Perhaps you or someone else has some information how to address for her d clinung performance from Toews are Seabrook. The new collective bargaining agreement is two seasons away......if new provisions are written and agreed upon.

My goal now, is to get my little ones into it. Maybe not playing, just because it's up to them, but at least enjoying the show of a game, and seeing how fast it is in reality. Sorry this is long winded, but I've enjoyed hockey most of my life, and i've never been asked what has made me a hockey or hawks fan. thanks for reading.
- stazrulez

If I could interject I'd say you don't have to go to an NHL game (500 bucks for a family of 4) to get little ones "hooked" on the sport. The USHL provides incredible talent, speed, goaltending, contact, hungry hockey by quite a few players who will play NHL hockey 4-5 yrs out with those who don't will play AHL or NCAA. It's high level hockey.

And Midgets in our area is fantastic. The Chicago Mission is always a top 5 or 10 nationally ranked club. The Chicago Young Americans, Team Illinois and Chicago Fury are damn solid as well. Fantastic talent and speed that feeds the USHL, Major Junior and the NCAA.

Point is there are a lot of fantastic options ranging from 10 bucks a ticket to free that can be enjoyed as a family. I'd also add that at these levels the players are made accessible to fans. There are always skate with the team after Saturday games and players signing for and meeting and talking with kids after the game.

Really the best way to hook a kid on the sport is at the Jr or Midget level cuz they meet, talk with and skate with these players. They are not faceless people on tv but real human beings with personalities. No way you get that at the NHL, AHL or even ECHL level.

Mr or Ms Chunk, you are a must read for me. Concise, reasonable, clear minded, objective and despite what looks to be, and is really, very complicated in it's numerous dynamics/questions it's really quite simple.

For me it all starts as an organIzation, like any company, having one plan that all adhere to and buy into and then have the proper people in place to execute that plan. Simple, in theory.

You can't answer every question that will come up 2-3-4 yrs away but you can simply acquire the very best available players thru the draft and trades and coach/teach the system, whatever that is and has been agreed upon, and problem solve along the way allowing the talent and systems to do so.

Agree 100% the sooner management forgets the cup yrs the better except the takeaway being the depth of talent on those teams and coaching that got the best out of and slotted the talent correctly. Simple, in theory.

The complicated part is the hard cap. If you mangle that you have little chance of success and the Hawks are not starting with a blank slate as Vegas did. IMO the Hawks have to one by one correct their long term cap problems and each correction allows them to add 1 or 2 more players that will help. For me this is the most difficult part of getting back to relevancy. Do they do that by moving cap problems out or allowing time to fix it as these contracts expire?

This is where having an organIzational plan comes into play. How do they clear out cap issues and all the while collecting the best talent regardless of position and coaching the agreed upon system starting at Rockford.

Do they have the plan makers and coaches to execute that plan in place? If not they are rudderless.
- Mr Ricochet

Thanks! (It's Mr.). I've "ranted" on this a couple of times, but I wouldn't go past a 5 year deal on any player unless it is someone like Kane and he is under 27. I prefer 3-yr deals as it provides a lot more leeway (and in a lot of cases probability) to make trades if needed.

I doubt they can get out from under any of the heavy contracts without sending a solid asset along with them (for the record, I personally don't see Toews as a bad contract right now). I'm not opposed to them going this route, but I don't think it can be simply a salary dump. Find a way to get something of value coming back.

With the moves so far this offseason, I see three things:
1) Crow is not going to be ready to start the season.
2) they are not comfortable with filling the lower, more defensive-minded, lines with rookies.
3) They are trying to do everything they can to move out at least two of the defensemen they currently have signed.

I don't like the idea of having two scoring lines, a "checking line" and whatever you want to call the fourth. I think you should build four lines that play fast, attacking-the-net hockey.

So much for being concise!!

It's way too hard to tell. I think they have a set of 3 year plans depending on how this season goes. One to rebuild and the other to compete. They need a few guys to bounce back, and a few more to step up.


- Antz96

I think you are right, 96. I think they are lets see what we have mode while doing no harm in doing so. And I think they are giving themselves to the TDL to see "where" they are.

If they decide there isn't a reasonable 1 or 2 cup runs left Keith and AA may very well go at the TDL and the organIzation can no longer claim anything other than some sort of rebuild publicly.

Thanks! (It's Mr.). I've "ranted" on this a couple of times, but I wouldn't go past a 5 year deal on any player unless it is someone like Kane and he is under 27. I prefer 3-yr deals as it provides a lot more leeway (and in a lot of cases probability) to make trades if needed.

I doubt they can get out from under any of the heavy contracts without sending a solid asset along with them (for the record, I personally don't see Toews as a bad contract right now). I'm not opposed to them going this route, but I don't think it can be simply a salary dump. Find a way to get something of value coming back.

With the moves so far this offseason, I see three things:
1) Crow is not going to be ready to start the season.
2) they are not comfortable with filling the lower, more defensive-minded, lines with rookies.
3) They are trying to do everything they can to move out at least two of the defensemen they currently have signed.

I don't like the idea of having two scoring lines, a "checking line" and whatever you want to call the fourth. I think you should build four lines that play fast, attacking-the-net hockey.

So much for being concise!!

- Chunk

Kinda gets back to my earlier post where it's really simple but it isn't at the same time. It's simple in that you need an organIzational plan with the correct decision makers and coaches in place that all buy in and execute that plan.

The hard part is being concise on what that plan is. As you post what you would do there is always more than one way to skin a cat. With that in mind I'm really ok with any damn plan. Just have ONE and have the correct people in place to execute an ORGANIZATIONAL plan.

I don't think the Hawks have one right now except looking at the draft I think they correctly all agree for now do no harm as they figure this thing out, hopefully by the TDL.

IMO management is a lot like players. Some are better for one role than the other and slotting them correctly is important. Some GM's are builders some maintainers. Some coaches better with a younger group and develop some better with vets and x's and o's.

Thank you for the trek on Memory Lane. Nice job, all.

I could fill a page, so I will just say:
Lloyd Pettit
Gate 3 1/2
Could not see the scoreboard from under the first balcony
Wayne Messmer, Harvey Wittenburg
Sportsvision
Northland sticks
Keith Magnuson, Pit Martin, Dennis Hull
Ted Bulley, Reggie Kerr, Terry Ruskowski
Doug Wilson, Al Secord, Orval Tessier
Greg Gilbert, Jocelyn Lemieux, Dirk Graham
Alexander Karpovtsev, Tyler Arnason, Brandon Bochenski...
and then...

Here is a question to Justin and the panel would trade Debricant for a top 4 dman not saying Faulk or Myers I wouldn't trade him for either of those 2 but Trouba yes, your thoughts and opinions are welcome.
- Scott1977

I'd do a Trouba for Dcat and think the Hawks would. Would WPG? There is zero doubt one of their top players will have to go to be cap compliant in 2 yrs. Masterful job of moving Mason and Armia clearing 5 mil in space.

I'd do a Trouba for Dcat and think the Hawks would. Would WPG? There is zero doubt one of their top players will have to go to be cap compliant in 2 yrs. Masterful job of moving Mason and Armia clearing 5 mil in space.
- Mr Ricochet

I would too, but I doubt Winnipeg does.

Guessing they’ve talked to Waddell and the rest of Trashers 2.0 about Faulk/Hossa, but the Canes will need their cap space pretty soon for the young pups. Problem is the Hawks don’t have another young, promising Teuvo-like player to send us to take on the Hossa contract 🤔 that’s the issue at hand. #ThanksAgain
- FinnGod

Anisimov for Skinner. Canes are still short a legit centerman.

LOVE IT JUSTIN! Greatly respect and appreciate your posts, and your crackdown on the trolling/personal attack posters which have seemed to increase over the last few months.

Tyler Myers, yes please! Hossa contract moved without giving up an A level prospect or 1st (2nd in 2019 should be a 30s pick so that might get it done with a B level prospect).


Also love the "my hockey story".

Born and raised in Darien, IL (DGS for HS). Dad never played hockey until his late 20s early 30s he started playing pickup outdoor roller hockey then men's league ice and obviously fell in love with the greatest game in the world. I actually played my first year of hockey outside roller hockey with Darien Youth Club (which produced a lot of NCAA players btw @ DenverU and Notre Dame) and my first year ice hockey was at the Darien Sportsplex for the HOUNDS. That was when the Blue Jackets and Wild came into the league so I had the Blue Jackets jersey with my Dad as the Head Coach for both Roller and Ice hockey basically until PeeWee. I was a coast to coast dominant offensive Dman in Squirt House my first year,(I'm very humble I was like 3.0 PPG from defense - it was house league though LOL).

The Huskies played out of Sportsplex at that time and the Peewee AA Huskies coach wanted me to play on his team my 2nd year but it was crazy expensive (and only got worse) and my dad wanted to coach me again. So, my 2nd year of Ice Hockey I played Northwest Huskies on Defense again, and yes it was lower competition, but dominated.

3rd year I played Huskies PeeWee AA team and transitioned to Center/Wing and we lost to the Blues in the State Championship at The Edge. Sorry goalies, but I still blame the goalie who let in the first TWO shots of the game....

Played Bantam AA Huskies the next year, then played AAA Team Illinois for my Bantam Major.

I was the last cut from the AAA Team Illinois Midget Minor team, so instead of playing for The Chill who were based out of Orland Park at the time, I decided to go play Huskies and I actually made the Midget Major U18 AA Huskies team as a 15yr old first year midget. That Huskies Midget Major team featured current Ice Hog, Evan Mosey (who I also went to HS with). We won Central States Championship, and won the IL State Championship at The Edge. WOOOO!

Following that season, I was burnt out. I had lost the fire, I had discovered girls and partying, and I decided that if I wasn't going to be 100% committed to playing hockey and pursuing NCAA D1, then I shouldn't play. Soooo, I essentially quit hockey, joined the DGS HS Hockey team which was basically a beer league and a joke with guys getting drunk and stoned before games, smoking cigs in the locker room. LOL Dominated a couple games, and then quit hockey completely the next month.

3 years later while at Ohio State, I found out there was D1 Roller Hockey. I missed playing, so I walked onto the Roller Hockey team and had blast playing roller for 2 years. Also, I started officiating hockey with IHOA at age 12, yes that's right, TWELVE year old ref. Age 12-21 I officiated and made over $10,000 from age 12-16 and I bought my own car with cold hard cash.

So, sorry for the essay, but I have lived, breathed, and slept hockey for most of my life. I got burnt out from the many years of literally ONLY playing hockey every weekend and multiple nights a week. School and hockey were all I did year round.
BUT, like I said, I missed the game too much after quitting in HS and had fun playing College Roller hockey. So, as a 90s kid, I was raised on Amonte and Daze and Kyle Calder LOL. SO, all I knew was bad Hawks hockey. It was an unbelievable run from 2008 to 2015, and I loved every minute. However, like Rocky Wirtz said, nothing lasts forever. Sorry not sorry guys/gals, this team will NOT win a cup with Toews/Seabrook leading the way. They are shells of their former selves, Hossa was as much the team MVP as Keith/Kane...just not gunna happen. We all know my thoughts on Stan Bowman, and I hope you can see why I am so adamant about getting a former player in charge. IMO, you simply CANNOT have the same level of knowledge of the sport, how to assess a player, or how to build a winning team if you haven't been on the ice, getting dirty, battling for pucks, getting your clock cleaned by a big Dman, or trying to get to the net. Bowman is a money guy, but he can't even manage the Cap effectively. FIRE STAN to save this team.


Sorry for the essay, thanks for reading and Thank you Justin for the blogs and prompt!

You would be best to define what you mean by 'rebuild'. If you mean tear it down completely and operate for a few years like the Buffalo Sabres or Arizona Coyotes striving for 31st place, you can forget that happening.

The Hawks are retaining their draft picks, drafting and developing players internally. Whether you agree with that strategy or not, that's whats happening until further notice.

And by the way, unless it is a compliance buy out, buying out players on big contracts to get rid of them isn't very good fiscal strategy most of the time. On the salary cap it commits the team to double the remaining length of the existing contract. I don't think anybody would want to see Toews or Seabrook on the cap hit books for 10 or 12 years. So it isn't 'just money.'
- RickJ

Would you consider moving Keith at the TDL for a legit top prospect and a 1st rounder a total rebuild?

Anisimov for Skinner. Canes are still short a legit centerman.
- Mr Ricochet

Like Hawks have them in trees?

Justin, very nice blog. It's always nice for more readers, especially the long-time readers, to join in and add their perspectives to the conversation. I was a long-time reader before starting to write posts a few years ago, and hope others will feel comfortable doing so soon. I love reading posts from the regulars but also enjoy fresh points of view and even the eagerness of younger fans. Doesn't matter if you're a diehard or a so-called bandwagoner: we all love the same team. Although this is a whole ball of wax, IMHO, the corporate fan is the most annoying.

Anisimov for Skinner. Canes are still short a legit centerman.
- Mr Ricochet

For a 3-time 30 goal scorer the Canes would want a respectable roster player. Not an overrated trash panda who takes draws with the knob of his twig. AA isn’t worth skinner.