they had a ton of injuries, but also lacked roster depth to overcome those injuries.

they added forward depth, but i still think they are at least one good forward short of a playoff team, regardless of who is coach.
- Tumbleweed

last year the coyotes lost their first twenty games (pretty much) and in the NHL, while hitting the cap floor, you should still win almost 40% of your games, even if you try to lose. There is just nothing but horrible luck about going 0-18-2 to kick off the season.

Add in the fact that Raanta Chychrun and Hjallmarsson missed half a season each and that Max Domi completely checked out, the team had no chance. However that aside, this roster, if healthy, will compete for the playoffs.

Mabye a huge TV market, but that has nothing to do with being a big NHL market.

Mpls/St.Paul and Greater Minnesota bleeds hockey and is still considered a "small" NHL market.

It seems fairly evident that average Arizonians simply do not care about NHL hockey.

last year the coyotes lost their first twenty games (pretty much) and in the NHL, while hitting the cap floor, you should still win almost 40% of your games, even if you try to lose. There is just nothing but horrible luck about going 0-18-2 to kick off the season.

Add in the fact that Raanta Chychrun and Hjallmarsson missed half a season each and that Max Domi completely checked out, the team had no chance. However that aside, this roster, if healthy, will compete for the playoffs.
- james_tanner1

no team goes without injuries. it's the gm's job to make sure there is enough depth to overcome them.

yotes need 1, maybe 2 forwards yet before they can be a playoff team. and that's assuming keller gets better, galchenyuk works out and strome finds his game. if any of those guys underachieve, it becomes harder.

last year the coyotes lost their first twenty games (pretty much) and in the NHL, while hitting the cap floor, you should still win almost 40% of your games, even if you try to lose. There is just nothing but horrible luck about going 0-18-2 to kick off the season.

Add in the fact that Raanta Chychrun and Hjallmarsson missed half a season each and that Max Domi completely checked out, the team had no chance. However that aside, this roster, if healthy, will compete for the playoffs.
- james_tanner1

Finally something realistic.

He has not stated that. And the point would be to convince him to stay and/or sign him before you trade for him.
- james_tanner1

If he signed first then sure. But he has stated that he won't resign in Columbus, who has a much brighter future than Arizona. So people assume that he goes to a bigger market.

Personally, I don't get what the issue with Columbus is. Anyone know? Is it Tortorella? The team seems really well built to me, a couple more pieces and they could go far.

Actually, if you look it up, we are the sixth largest city in the US by population, and Maricopa County is the 4th largest in the country. To say we are a "small" market is simply uneducated. We have 3 main issues regarding this team re: attendance:

1. They put the arena on the wrong side of town, plain and simple. If the arena was on the east side of town, a completely different story

2. We are a transient city. We have fans from so many teams that move here and live here that it was tough for the Coyotes to gain traction (more on that in number 3). But with the youth hockey market growing at exponential levels, this is changing

3. Other than the 3 straight seasons we made the playoffs from 2010-2012, we have haven't put a winning product on the ice since the late 90's. When the Suns are losing, their attendance flops. Same for the D-backs. It's the nature of this town and the fanbase (unfortunately). I became a season ticket member for the Yotes in their worst season ever. I have not renewed yet, but probably will given the upward trajectory of the franchise I am seeing.

The NHL hasn't left this market for a reason, and they won't. They'll leave Ottawa or Calgary long before they ever leave here. Just my opinion, but they wouldn't have fought as long and hard as they have only to throw up their hands and leave.
- gmiel1980

I'm kind of educated, thanks for the nice comment though. Large population, doesn't mean that enough of that population will ever become hockey fans.

Mabye a huge TV market, but that has nothing to do with being a big NHL market.

Mpls/St.Paul and Greater Minnesota bleeds hockey and is still considered a "small" NHL market.

It seems fairly evident that average Arizonians simply do not care about NHL hockey.
- MnGump

Exactly.

If he signed first then sure. But he has stated that he won't resign in Columbus, who has a much brighter future than Arizona. So people assume that he goes to a bigger market.

Personally, I don't get what the issue with Columbus is. Anyone know? Is it Tortorella? The team seems really well built to me, a couple more pieces and they could go far.
- mgriffen

If you’re to take Panarin and his agent at their word then there isn’t anything wrong with Columbus other than it’s just not a city he wants to be in for some reason.

Exactly.
- rrentz

arizona ends up top 10 in national tv audiences for many games during the playoffs.

lots of transplants from the mid-west and north-east.

arizona ends up top 10 in national tv audiences for many games during the playoffs.

lots of transplants from the mid-west and north-east.
- Tumbleweed

All well and good but has it come together the past 20 years??? No. All of a sudden it's gonna turn around I guess

Too many teams as it is in NHL

All well and good but has it come together the past 20 years??? No. All of a sudden it's gonna turn around I guess
- rrentz

people will come if they are a winning team.

people aren't driving across town to spend a bunch of money on a bad team.

people will come if they are a winning team.

people aren't driving across town to spend a bunch of money on a bad team.
- Tumbleweed

Ok

All well and good but has it come together the past 20 years??? No. All of a sudden it's gonna turn around I guess

Too many teams as it is in NHL
- rrentz

Population of said metro area has more than doubled in the last 20 years.

I used to be on the Coyotes must relocate bandwagon when I lived in Alberta, now living in the east valley I feel a little differently. The biggest thing plaguing this team is the product on the ice. Find another team that hasn't made the playoffs in this number of years and look at their attendance. Lots of fair weather fans here. You're going to see it with the Cardinals now that they suck, and the Diamondbacks are a playoff contender again.

The second is the arena location in Glendale, especially for weekday games. In traffic it can be two hours pretty easily from Scottsdale, Mesa, Chandler, Tempe, Gilbert, or even north Phoenix. These are the more affluent and middle class areas. The West valley is more industrial. Glendale is a dump. Sure, it has nice areas, but it's also bottom 5 in almost everything in the state.

people will come if they are a winning team.

people aren't driving across town to spend a bunch of money on a bad team.
- Tumbleweed

I don't disagree, however the majority of the NHL fan fare as you pointed out are indeed transplants and most likely tune in or go to games to see "their" favorite teams.

I'm not going to say the Coyotes don't have a lot of fans in Arizona, but speculatively speaking and based on the attendance history in Arizona, it's likely pretty paltry compared to all other hockey markets, traditional or otherwise.

I don't care how good the team is or becomes. Arizona will never be a big/traditional hockey market.

I don't disagree, however the majority of the NHL fan fare as you pointed out are indeed transplants and most likely tune in or go to games to see "their" favorite teams.

I'm not going to say the Coyotes don't have a lot of fans in Arizona, but speculatively speaking and based on the attendance history in Arizona, it's likely pretty paltry compared to all other hockey markets, traditional or otherwise.

I don't care how good the team is or becomes. Arizona will never be a big/traditional hockey market.
- MnGump

if you lived here, you'd understand why they are hanging on.

youth hockey is finally taken hold. and the yotes are investing hundreds of thousand a year back into infrastructure (outdoor rinks, renovating existing rinks) to keep the momentum going. things are changing.

no team goes without injuries. it's the gm's job to make sure there is enough depth to overcome them.

yotes need 1, maybe 2 forwards yet before they can be a playoff team. and that's assuming keller gets better, galchenyuk works out and strome finds his game. if any of those guys underachieve, it becomes harder.
- Tumbleweed

That just isn't how the NHL works. There is near full parity and any team that loses their starting goalie and two of their three top D for over 100 games is done, no exceptions. Injuries are part of the game is BS. Yes, they exist, but the teams that win are almost always the healthiest, without exception.

if you lived here, you'd understand why they are hanging on.

youth hockey is finally taken hold. and the yotes are investing hundreds of thousand a year back into infrastructure (outdoor rinks, renovating existing rinks) to keep the momentum going. things are changing.
- Tumbleweed

if you lived here, you'd understand why they are hanging on.

youth hockey is finally taken hold. and the yotes are investing hundreds of thousand a year back into infrastructure (outdoor rinks, renovating existing rinks) to keep the momentum going. things are changing.
- Tumbleweed

Exactly. The owner, new CEO and GM have said that they are changing the culture of this team. The 5-7 years of relocation talk and BK talk killed a big portion of the fan base and drove away corporate sponsors.

The east side 101 corridor is where the arena needs to be. As someone (leafs fan I believe) stated, that's where a majority of the money is and that's where most of the youth hockey rinks are going up. Plus, that's where most of the fans were coming from when they played at the Suns arena downtown. I live on the west side (Glendale) and it's no where near the east side in terms of money. I work in Scottsdale and would be able to easily get to games on a week night and not have it take but 20-30 minutes to get home. Barroway is paying for the ineptitude of the Gretzky ownership fiasco from back in the early 2000's

That's why I feel this owner gets it. He's not the blow hard Ice AZ and LeBlanc was, and there a lot of things moving in the right direction for this team.

- BestRapperAlive

http://tucsonroadrunners....index.html?article_id=869


Putting them as far away as tucson.

http://tucsonroadrunners.com/news/index.html?article_id=869


Putting them as far away as tucson.
- Tumbleweed

I'm still unsure how this works. It looks like tucson average low in the winter is 4 degrees, meaning the ice would melt. Do they have equipment to keep it frozen?

That just isn't how the NHL works. There is near full parity and any team that loses their starting goalie and two of their three top D for over 100 games is done, no exceptions. Injuries are part of the game is BS. Yes, they exist, but the teams that win are almost always the healthiest, without exception.
- james_tanner1

yeah, but if pitts has a bunch of injuries, they finish with 91 points and just miss the playoffs.

the yotes were a lot further away than a few injury excuses.

I'm still unsure how this works. It looks like tucson average low in the winter is 4 degrees, meaning the ice would melt. Do they have equipment to keep it frozen?
- BestRapperAlive

plastic flooring.

can roller blade on them, not skate. but mainly used for kids gym glasses and after school activites for ball hockey. they've also started a ball hockey league, now that they have a place to play.

"With Panarin, the Coyotes are a contender. "

Hilarious. You are the best Tanner

plastic flooring.

can roller blade on them, not skate. but mainly used for kids gym glasses and after school activites for ball hockey. they've also started a ball hockey league, now that they have a place to play.
- Tumbleweed

Not all of us played on ice all the time. There was lots of road hockey in a cul de sac during my childhood.

last year the coyotes lost their first twenty games (pretty much) and in the NHL, while hitting the cap floor, you should still win almost 40% of your games, even if you try to lose. There is just nothing but horrible luck about going 0-18-2 to kick off the season.

Add in the fact that Raanta Chychrun and Hjallmarsson missed half a season each and that Max Domi completely checked out, the team had no chance. However that aside, this roster, if healthy, will compete for the playoffs.
- james_tanner1

well you blame din the head coach and how bad he was, now its a different story?

are you now a tocchet fan?