I agree 100% with Rutherford. I said it the other day and I still believe it to be true; this team is stale. They need personnel changes to pump some lifeblood into this lineup.

This lineup has all the things they need to succeed, but this isn't just a bad start to the season. The Pens played like this for the second half of the year last year and on. I think JR hit the nail on the head.

Outside of maybe one ore two players, there aren't any I dislike, but I think they just need new bodies who are hungrier and ready. I don't know what those moves look like, but I'm pretty much open to moving anyone not named Geno, Phil, Sid and Letang.

I'm not talking about moves that bring in picks and prospects, I'm talking about all hockey trades. This team is simply stale and have been since last year.

I agree 100% with Rutherford. I said it the other day and I still believe it to be true; this team is stale. They need personnel changes to pump some lifeblood into this lineup.

This lineup has all the things they need to succeed, but this isn't just a bad start to the season. The Pens played like this for the second half of the year last year and on. I think JR hit the nail on the head.

Outside of maybe one ore two players, there aren't any I don't like, but I think they just need new bodies who are hungrier and ready. I don't know what those moves look like, but I'm pretty much open to moving anyone not named Geno, Phil, Sid and Letang.

I'm not talking about moves that bring in picks and prospects, I'm talking about all hockey trades. This team is simply stale and have been since last year.
- Rinosaur

They didnt look stale at all last night. Really fresh and inspired, actually.

They didnt look stale at all last night. Really fresh and inspired, actually.
- MattStrat

Yeah, great. They did it for one game. They've done it for about three games this year. It's not enough. They did it for small stretches last year, too, but overall they were stale as (frank).

This team can't take the ball and run with it when it comes to playing that type of game.

Let me be clear, I'm not for making trades for the sake of making trades. If the right trades aren't out there you stand pat.

We miss Botterill. He was the real genius behind our cups, not old man Rutherford.

I thought you were joking at first as I assumed Voracek would go for far more. However I can't find any hints of sarcasm so... I'd make that deal, but DeSmith would be the one to go. We already traded Gustavson to Ottawa so I'd like to keep Jarry. I love Rust and he's a playoff performer so I'm a little weary but Voraceck is fantastic. I highly doubt the deal happens due to rivalry though.
- Thrill81

Voracek is highly skilled, but he makes Kessel look like a Selke nominee. Too many high-risk plays.

I agree 100% with Rutherford. I said it the other day and I still believe it to be true; this team is stale. They need personnel changes to pump some lifeblood into this lineup.

This lineup has all the things they need to succeed, but this isn't just a bad start to the season. The Pens played like this for the second half of the year last year and on. I think JR hit the nail on the head.

Outside of maybe one ore two players, there aren't any I dislike, but I think they just need new bodies who are hungrier and ready. I don't know what those moves look like, but I'm pretty much open to moving anyone not named Geno, Phil, Sid and Letang.

I'm not talking about moves that bring in picks and prospects, I'm talking about all hockey trades. This team is simply stale and have been since last year.
- Rinosaur

Please be consistent in your use of first or last names. You're better than this.

If I could, the only players I'd be looking to build around right now would be Sid, Geno, Phil, Letang, Dumo, Schultz, Simon, Brassard, Hagelin and Jake.

Everyone else? I'd be trying to swap them out.

Please be consistent in your use of first or last names. You're better than this.
- jmatchett383

REPORTED! lol

Hey Ryan, you missed this one badly. This is just the GM sending his team a message and challenging them.

They didnt look stale at all last night. Really fresh and inspired, actually.
- MattStrat

Last night they played really well. Same old story though, no one else can score outside of the big guys. I think the team must have played posts all summer. They sure know how to ding em

Hey Ryan, you missed this one badly. This is just the GM sending his team a message and challenging them.
- MJL

One thing about Rutherford is in his tenure with the Pens he hasn't sent messages. He's been super transparent about everything.

If I could, the only players I'd be looking to build around right now would be Sid, Geno, Phil, Letang, Dumo, Schultz, Simon, Brassard, Hagelin and Jake.

Everyone else? I'd be trying to swap them out.
- Rinosaur

Odd that you put Simon on there. I mean, he's been good, but I don't think he's a guy to build a team around, either.

Odd that you put Simon on there. I mean, he's been good, but I don't think he's a guy to build a team around, either.
- jmatchett383

I just like his game and he's cheap. He's not a MUST, but I think he's useful and brings something nobody out of the big guys brings.

Lets sign Rick Nash for league minimum. Definitely improves bottom 6 and PK.

Lets sign Rick Nash for league minimum. Definitely improves bottom 6 and PK.
- MattStrat

While you're at it, may as well trade Matt Cullen for Connor McDavid, too.

I just like his game and he's cheap. He's not a MUST, but I think he's useful and brings something nobody out of the big guys brings.
- Rinosaur

Personally, I think Rust should be in that group. He's signed fairly cheap for what he brings, he's locked up for 4 years with an ever-rising cap, and he gets it done in the playoffs. Kinda reminds me of a younger Tyler Kennedy, or Matt Cooke without all of the BS.

While you're at it, may as well trade Matt Cullen for Connor McDavid, too.
- jmatchett383

That analogy is a bit of a stretch to say the least.

That analogy is a bit of a stretch to say the least.
- MattStrat

Well, yes. But I don't think that Rick Nash will come out of semi-retirement to play for league minimum, either. Especially not when the GM has just called out the team.

Personally, I think Rust should be in that group. He's signed fairly cheap for what he brings, he's locked up for 4 years with an ever-rising cap, and he gets it done in the playoffs. Kinda reminds me of a younger Tyler Kennedy, or Matt Cooke without all of the BS.
- jmatchett383

I'm a fan of Rust, but I'm just not completely against exploring options for him or even Jake for that matter. I brought up Jake before and got flak. I DON'T WANT TO TRADE JAKE! But I'm open to exploring what the Pens could get back in a HOCKEY TRADE, not selling him off.

I'm also not against moving Simon, but:
A) I don't think you'll get much. I'd rather hold on to him than getting a mid-rounder in return.
B) He brings a certain type of skill that's lacking outside of the big guys
C) He's super cheap. No harm no foul by keeping him.

I'm a fan of Rust, but I'm just not completely against exploring options for him or even Jake for that matter. I brought up Jake before and got flak. I DON'T WANT TO TRADE JAKE! But I'm open to exploring what the Pens could get back in a HOCKEY TRADE, not selling him off.

I'm also not against moving Simon, but:
A) I don't think you'll get much. I'd rather hold on to him than getting a mid-rounder in return.
B) He brings a certain type of skill that's lacking outside of the big guys
C) He's super cheap. No harm no foul by keeping him.
- Rinosaur

That description reminds me of Michael Raffl. What he brings on the ice and what he would bring back in a trade aren't close.

I was thinking about this the other day. Voynov could be a low risk high reward player. I think he will excel coming back to the league. What do you guys think of packaging Hagelin in a trade (not for Voynov). I feel he has become less of a threat to teams. Idk what happened he still looks fast, but it looks like he has lost a step (or defense know how to stop him from getting to the puck first). I thought about this last night how Namestnikov, Zuccarello, Iafallo, Pearson, or another skilled player would fit in Hagelin's spot on a line. Of course it would take more than just Hagelin in a trade it would take a package with picks, but think of the impact having another scorer with Kessel and Malkin would have.
- 123Kid

Voynov was never that good.

Let me be clear, I'm not for making trades for the sake of making trades. If the right trades aren't out there you stand pat.
- Rinosaur

DET is open for business.

Voynov was never that good.
- Blackstrom2

Agreed. He was a pretty meh 2nd pair guy and that was in his prime.

is it more a combination of bad drafting and moving picks for rentals, or bad chemistry?


http://www.hockeydb.com/i...aft/teams/dr00007475.html

looking at the last 10 draft classes for the pens, not much contribution for the big club