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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Quick Hits: Arbitration, DBL, Caravan, Barber and More
Author Message
Tomahawk
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner Bandwagon
Joined: 02.04.2009

Jul 11 @ 2:18 PM ET
Why are people upset? Everyone supposedly hated Holmgren and now he's out of the way people have an issue with it. Holmgren was a great GM, everyone has bad signings.
- ClaudeFather


Hockey ops needs to be insulated from corporate.

Take the Leafs as an example. Before Shanahan was brought on to act as a firewall, there was nobody to stop MLSE from constantly meddling in hockey decisions and it hurt them on the ice for decades.

As for Homer, it was more than a few bad signings... the guy was ill-equipped to be cap-era GM and it showed.
Tomahawk
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner Bandwagon
Joined: 02.04.2009

Jul 11 @ 2:23 PM ET
So he's not president but he is taking on an advisory role? So he's still with the team? Getting paid? Maybe I comprehend at a 5th grade level?
- Pelle31Forever


Basically he retired.
Dkos
Season Ticket Holder
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Gritty, PA
Joined: 01.15.2007

Jul 11 @ 2:26 PM ET
So he's not president but he is taking on an advisory role? So he's still with the team? Getting paid? Maybe I comprehend at a 5th grade level?
- Pelle31Forever


Well, Homer says that it was his idea to step down, but my guess is that he was given the "advisor" title and some $$$ to cushion the blow of being fired.
Pelle31Forever
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.20.2014

Jul 11 @ 2:27 PM ET
Basically he retired.
- Tomahawk


Good for him then.
ClaudeFather
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: west haven, CT
Joined: 08.14.2015

Jul 11 @ 2:29 PM ET
Hockey ops needs to be insulated from corporate.

Take the Leafs as an example. Before Shanahan was brought on to act as a firewall, there was nobody to stop MLSE from constantly meddling in hockey decisions and it hurt them on the ice for decades.

As for Homer, it was more than a few bad signings... the guy was ill-equipped to be cap-era GM and it showed.

- Tomahawk

Ahh the Corporate CEO in the GMs ear, what could go wrong. Hopefully Scott has trust in Fletcher and will let him go about his business.
SuperSchennBros
Location: Not protected by the Mods...I mean Mob. Take your best shot!
Joined: 09.01.2012

Jul 11 @ 2:32 PM ET
Bill Meltzer: Quick Hits: Arbitration, DBL, Caravan, Barber and More
- bmeltzer

Paul Holmgren.

Thank you for the 2008 Eastern Conference Final. Thank you for the 2010 Stanley Cup Final. Thank you for Peter Laviolette, Chris Pronger, Danny Briere, Kimmo Timonen, Scott Hartnell, Wayne Simmonds, Jake Voracek, Sean Couturier and Jaromir Jagr.

Thank for keeping us Competitive.
corduroy
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: NT
Joined: 12.09.2006

Jul 11 @ 2:33 PM ET
The bean counters are now in full control. The Philadelphia Flyers we have known our whole lives are now gone

RIP
Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

Jul 11 @ 2:35 PM ET
Adios. I'd present him with a framed copy of MacDonald's contract as a parting gift.
- PLindbergh31


Bike riding off into a glassy sunset
Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

Jul 11 @ 2:35 PM ET
So he's not president but he is taking on an advisory role? So he's still with the team? Getting paid? Maybe I comprehend at a 5th grade level?
- Pelle31Forever


This will still allow him to sign bryz’s paychecks
jmatchett383
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Mantua, NJ
Joined: 03.09.2010

Jul 11 @ 2:37 PM ET
So he's not president but he is taking on an advisory role? So he's still with the team? Getting paid? Maybe I comprehend at a 5th grade level?
- Pelle31Forever


Longtime Philadelphia Flyers senior executive Paul Holmgren will take on a new role as Senior Advisor to Dave Scott, @ComcstSpectacor Chairman and CEO and Governor of the Philadelphia Flyers, and #Flyers General Manager Chuck Fletcher.

I don't know what else needs to be said.
Tomahawk
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner Bandwagon
Joined: 02.04.2009

Jul 11 @ 2:39 PM ET
The bean counters are now in full control. The Philadelphia Flyers we have known our whole lives are now gone

RIP

- corduroy


Snider meddled, but he was more like that fuddyduddy from Jurassic Park who 'spared no expense' to make the park wonderful.

Scott's like the lawyer that got eaten by the TRex. He doesn't care about dinos, the science or the spectacle... he only cares about the brand and maximizing shareholder value.

opeth_pa
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: The Implication
Joined: 12.13.2011

Jul 11 @ 2:42 PM ET
Snider meddled, but he was more like that fuddyduddy from Jurassic Park who 'spared no expense' to make the park wonderful.

Scott's like the lawyer that got eaten by the TRex. He doesn't care about dinos, the science or the spectacle... he only cares about the brand and maximizing shareholder value.


- Tomahawk



As evidence by what so far or is this just preparatory doom and gloom.
peesinwind
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: columbia, MD
Joined: 06.27.2015

Jul 11 @ 2:58 PM ET
Well, Homer says that it was his idea to step down, but my guess is that he was given the "advisor" title and some $$$ to cushion the blow of being fired.
- Dkos


I thought he had been asking for a lesser role since last year. I think this is what he wants. There was talk about this a couple months ago but it was denied by Scott and Homer. Must have been some truth to it.
corduroy
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: NT
Joined: 12.09.2006

Jul 11 @ 2:58 PM ET
As evidence by what so far or is this just preparatory doom and gloom.
- opeth_pa


“bias for action”
Tomahawk
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner Bandwagon
Joined: 02.04.2009

Jul 11 @ 2:59 PM ET
As evidence by what so far or is this just preparatory doom and gloom.
- opeth_pa


You really need a recap?

Snider dies, Flyers miss the PO's, Scott proclaims "The Flyers are going to go for it every year. That's our heritage", then shortly pulls the plug on Hexy's process because he "didn’t want to lose two seasons" (translation: didn't want to miss those PO bucks, risk further brand tarnishing), and then you have all the 'bias for action' from summer 2019.
daryl stanley
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 02.12.2019

Jul 11 @ 3:09 PM ET
wait so Clarke and Holmgren are no longer telling Fletcher what to do? must be fake news
corduroy
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: NT
Joined: 12.09.2006

Jul 11 @ 3:11 PM ET
Bike riding off into a glassy sunset
- Just5



Harsh 🙃
Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

Jul 11 @ 3:12 PM ET
You really need a recap?

Snider dies, Flyers miss the PO's, Scott proclaims "The Flyers are going to go for it every year. That's our heritage", then shortly pulls the plug on Hexy's process because he "didn’t want to lose two seasons" (translation: didn't want to miss those PO bucks, risk further brand tarnishing), and then you have all the 'bias for action' from summer 2019.

- Tomahawk


How does the story go if sniders still alive? Snider patiently waits while hexy keeps extending the grand master plan? Patiently awaiting the arrival of the treasure trove of prospects?
BroadStParade
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Aston, PA
Joined: 06.30.2016

Jul 11 @ 3:12 PM ET
You really need a recap?

Snider dies, Flyers miss the PO's, Scott proclaims "The Flyers are going to go for it every year. That's our heritage", then shortly pulls the plug on Hexy's process because he "didn’t want to lose two seasons" (translation: didn't want to miss those PO bucks, risk further brand tarnishing), and then you have all the 'bias for action' from summer 2019.

- Tomahawk


See also, home opener in Europe in conjunction with elevated ticket prices after a down season.
PLindbergh31
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Company Stogeville, NJ
Joined: 02.01.2008

Jul 11 @ 3:24 PM ET
You really need a recap?

Snider dies, Flyers miss the PO's, Scott proclaims "The Flyers are going to go for it every year. That's our heritage", then shortly pulls the plug on Hexy's process because he "didn’t want to lose two seasons" (translation: didn't want to miss those PO bucks, risk further brand tarnishing), and then you have all the 'bias for action' from summer 2019.

- Tomahawk


Needs a few edits. Not enough "Team Negative" elements to it.

Tomahawk
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner Bandwagon
Joined: 02.04.2009

Jul 11 @ 3:25 PM ET
How does the story go if sniders still alive? Snider patiently waits while hexy keeps extending the grand master plan? Patiently awaiting the arrival of the treasure trove of prospects?
- Just5


Snider had given full approval to Hexy's plan.

In the absence of results, I'm sure he would have pulled the plug eventually, but probably not before the forward crop of kids came up to join the kids on D.

He's also pretty loyal to former Flyers luminaries, so that would have bought Hexy some extra time, too.
Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

Jul 11 @ 3:31 PM ET
Snider had given full approval to Hexy's plan.

In the absence of results, I'm sure he would have pulled the plug eventually, but probably not before the forward crop of kids came up to join the kids on D.

He's also pretty loyal to former Flyers luminaries, so that would have bought Hexy some extra time, too.

- Tomahawk


I think his patience would have been severely tested at around the same time as well....no matter what he initially signed off on
opeth_pa
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: The Implication
Joined: 12.13.2011

Jul 11 @ 3:37 PM ET
You really need a recap?

Snider dies, Flyers miss the PO's, Scott proclaims "The Flyers are going to go for it every year. That's our heritage", then shortly pulls the plug on Hexy's process because he "didn’t want to lose two seasons" (translation: didn't want to miss those PO bucks, risk further brand tarnishing), and then you have all the 'bias for action' from summer 2019.

- Tomahawk



Some people have no issues with the approach that has been taken so far..
Some people have issues with approach that has been taken so far.

As long as one of those approaches leads to a cup that is all I care about.. Dont care if they win the Cap Cup in July..Dont care if they make Flyersbuzz GM's happy..I just want a damn cup.
Tomahawk
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner Bandwagon
Joined: 02.04.2009

Jul 11 @ 3:46 PM ET
I think his patience would have been severely tested at around the same time as well....no matter what he initially signed off on
- Just5


He wanted to see the team win a Cup before he died. He understood (after years of 'going for it' under Clarke and Homer) that Hexy's way would lead to the widest possible window, given the cap.
Bill Meltzer
Editor
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 07.13.2006

Jul 11 @ 3:51 PM ET
You really need a recap?

Snider dies, Flyers miss the PO's, Scott proclaims "The Flyers are going to go for it every year. That's our heritage", then shortly pulls the plug on Hexy's process because he "didn’t want to lose two seasons" (translation: didn't want to miss those PO bucks, risk further brand tarnishing), and then you have all the 'bias for action' from summer 2019.

- Tomahawk



It has been explained both by Jay Greenberg and by me why Hexy was fired. It boiled down to this: If you are winning, you can get away with tightening the circle around you and not knowing the nuances of managing up or realizing that some unpopular internal decisions can cause collateral damage: strains in relationships, a snowballing whisper-down-the-lane effect, etc. If you aren't winning but you know how to manage up and outwardly to other channels within the organization, you can buy yourself more time.

If you aren't winning AND your managing style has undesired effects -- even accidentally, as was the case with Hexy -- your job is in severe jeopardy. That is why he was fired. The farm system rebuild part and cap space management were his biggest strengths as well as his main focus.

Next time around as a GM -- and I think Ron deserves another shot somewhere -- I think he will do better at the managing up/around aspects.
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