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Forums :: Blog World :: Tyler Cameron: Hawks finally look like a real hockey team
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Tyler Cameron
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 10.31.2017

Nov 8 @ 10:23 AM ET
Tyler Cameron: Hawks finally look like a real hockey team I had to take a time out this week from all things Blackhawks.

After that game on Tuesday against the San Jose Sharks, I wasn't sure what to write.

However, they finally looked like a real hockey team last night and I have thoughts.
EbonyRaptor
Joined: 03.28.2013

Nov 8 @ 10:34 AM ET
(re-post)

You never know which team will show up. Last night it was Dr. Jekyll. We need more of him and less of Mr. Hyde.
StLBravesFan
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 07.03.2011

Nov 8 @ 10:37 AM ET
First (if I can complete this in time).

Tyler noted: Well, either someone upstairs said something or Colliton realized the errors in his ways. Gone was the dump-and-chase/lose it strategy for the most part last night and the Hawks looked a lot better.

I respond: Was the “dump and chase” ever Colliton’s preferred system - or was it forced on him because the carry-and-enter schemes weren’t working - consistent inability to exit the dzone cleanly, losing space and pace in the neutral zone, no momentum entering the ozone. Forwards not being in good position to receive the first quick pass out and making the second and third quick passes to get into the the attack with speed and possession both led to the emphasis on dumping (which they had to do on most possessions) and failing at the chase.

I’m not sure many coaches would prefer a dump and chase offense to one entering the zone on the rush with speed and possession. I would guess Colliton would agree.

This is not to say that Colliton is at this point a quality NHL coach - my jury is still out on that....
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Nov 8 @ 10:43 AM ET
"Sure the Hawks were a little too loose and irresponsible last year, but they were on pace for 100+ points in the 2nd half of the season and they were actually fun to watch."

I read here all of last season plenty of posters saying that half a season is too small a sample size, and that 100 point pace was a mirage. Of course those same posters now think 10 games is a large enough sample to make big pronouncements. Anyway, the team seemed to agree with those on this board and tried to implement a more defensive system. Now, the board Illuminati think the team was stupid to listen to them! I love this place.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Nov 8 @ 10:46 AM ET
First (if I can complete this in time).

Tyler noted: Well, either someone upstairs said something or Colliton realized the errors in his ways. Gone was the dump-and-chase/lose it strategy for the most part last night and the Hawks looked a lot better.

I respond: Was the “dump and chase” ever Colliton’s preferred system - or was it forced on him because the carry-and-enter schemes weren’t working - consistent inability to exit the dzone cleanly, losing space and pace in the neutral zone, no momentum entering the ozone. Forwards not being in good position to receive the first quick pass out and making the second and third quick passes to get into the the attack with speed and possession both led to the emphasis on dumping (which they had to do on most possessions) and failing at the chase.

I’m not sure many coaches would prefer a dump and chase offense to one entering the zone on the rush with speed and possession. I would guess Colliton would agree.

This is not to say that Colliton is at this point a quality NHL coach - my jury is still out on that....

- StLBravesFan


Agreed, Sage. JC is a young coach, and the Hawks management is big and complex. Odds are that he doesn't take a dump without clearing his wiping strategy with the analytics department.
kwolf68
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Mt. Lebanon, PA
Joined: 12.18.2010

Nov 8 @ 10:49 AM ET

Tough road weekend in Pitt and Toronto. Will say a lot about if this team is starting to turn the corner.
Taylorst1
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 07.09.2018

Nov 8 @ 10:55 AM ET
Imo its way to early to celebrate or believe this team has changed .

Now I realize my comments might seem controversial, I'm just pointing out that going back to last year this team has been up and down win 2 games lose 7 .

I'd like to see Chicago make a trade that involves either 1 or 2 core players and a couple of prospects to maybe Montreal for their youth.

mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Nov 8 @ 10:55 AM ET
Tough road weekend in Pitt and Toronto. Will say a lot about if this team is starting to turn the corner.
- kwolf68


Good morning, Wolfie. There's likely to be some ups and downs in the future because they're still a team with a lot of new players trying to fit together.

Also, I gave you a shout out at the end of last blog. Hope you're well.
Chunk
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Orange, CA
Joined: 11.06.2015

Nov 8 @ 10:58 AM ET
If Gus and Keith prove to be a stable, responsible, shot generating duo for the next 4-5 games, what are the expected pairings when Murphy comes back. He was really good with Keith, but my sense is that Gus needs some stability so that he has the confidence to do what he does well.

I'm likely reading way too much into this, but just curious what more nuanced hockey minds think.
hawk35
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: NF
Joined: 08.26.2009

Nov 8 @ 11:00 AM ET
Oh...Please, please, please.....don't let the Leafs blow out the hawks. I will be hearing the Leafers crow for days if not weeks. They are not QUITE there yet, but getting almost as insufferable as those freakin' Habbers.

At least, if we gotta lose....make it a nice 6-5 or 5-4 game. Something to keep the buzzards at least a little in check!!!!!

gabriel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: West Lafayette, IN
Joined: 02.02.2013

Nov 8 @ 11:02 AM ET
One ugly analogy, after completing a plate of bacon and eggs, Mo! Next time, perhaps employ it in the middle of the afternoon? Lol.
LAHawk
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 11.02.2017

Nov 8 @ 11:03 AM ET
Of more interest to me, when Murphy comes back, do you send Bovquist down, or do you put KKKK on waivers?
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Nov 8 @ 11:03 AM ET
If Gus and Keith prove to be a stable, responsible, shot generating duo for the next 4-5 games, what are the expected pairings when Murphy comes back. He was really good with Keith, but my sense is that Gus needs some stability so that he has the confidence to do what he does well.

I'm likely reading way too much into this, but just curious what more nuanced hockey minds think.

- Chunk


And you came here for nuanced?
RedRevenge
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 04.18.2017

Nov 8 @ 11:03 AM ET
The Hawks have played well against PIT in the past, I'm expecting a good game.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Nov 8 @ 11:04 AM ET
One ugly analogy, after completing a plate of bacon and eggs, Mo! Next time, perhaps employ it in the middle of the afternoon? Lol.
- gabriel


Apologies, Gabe!
Chunk
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Orange, CA
Joined: 11.06.2015

Nov 8 @ 11:05 AM ET
Imo its way to early to celebrate or believe this team has changed .

Now I realize my comments might seem controversial, I'm just pointing out that going back to last year this team has been up and down win 2 games lose 7 .

I'd like to see Chicago make a trade that involves either 1 or 2 core players and a couple of prospects to maybe Montreal for their youth.

- Taylorst1


I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but you should really let this go. Every single one of the "core" have a NMC. They control almost every aspect of where and when they go. Not to mention, most of them have stated publicly that they have no desire to leave and want to help the Hawks get back to prominence. You cannot wave a magic wand (or bring in a new GM) and all of a sudden, POOF the vets say "OK I'm gone".

Also, no one here is celebrating anything more than the fact that they played better and won LAST NIGHT. Every comment has said "it was a good win, but".

Finally - and I'm not sure if this was just hyperbole on your part - but this team was not win two and lose 7 last year. They had a brutal start to the season (into Dec) and played much better the second half of the year before sputtering out the last 2 weeks.
JPBurke27
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 01.26.2012

Nov 8 @ 11:06 AM ET
I think the man-to-man d-zone dumpster fire affects the rest of their game. When we do finally gain possession in the defensive zone, no one is in position for an effective breakout. That causes confusion through the neutral zone and forces a lot of dump in's that the forwards aren't even in position to effectively chase down. If they would just go to a normal d-zone setup (zone coverage) then the breakouts become more instinctual, and that should continue through the neutral zone and into the offensive zone with carry-in entries as much as possible.
TheTrob
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Oak Park, IL
Joined: 04.14.2010

Nov 8 @ 11:07 AM ET
If Gus and Keith prove to be a stable, responsible, shot generating duo for the next 4-5 games, what are the expected pairings when Murphy comes back. He was really good with Keith, but my sense is that Gus needs some stability so that he has the confidence to do what he does well.

I'm likely reading way too much into this, but just curious what more nuanced hockey minds think.

- Chunk


Sorry, not buying it. Gus was better and more engaged last night, but the fact is that he remains a very bad defenseman. His gap control is atrocious, especially for someone who is a good skater. He constantly puts himself in positions where his back is to the puck carrier. He passing and puck decisions in his own zone are below average. When he is putting up 60pts you live with it when he is not, you suffer the circumstances.
-Doh-
Location: VA
Joined: 10.05.2015

Nov 8 @ 11:07 AM ET
There were times last year where the team was hard to watch. Everything on their side of the center line was a mess. I think Colliton has cleaned that up a quite a bit. Of course having two really good goalies is huge. Stan added Maatta and DeHaan and they have been solid. Stan added a 3rd and 4th lines of vets (Carpenter, Shaw, Smith) and they have been a huge improvement. Stan signed Kubalik who has played well. The inconsistency is frustrating, and this team could go either way.

Only 5 of the 13 forwards, only 3 of the 7 defenders, only 1 of the 2 goalies were on last years opening day roster. They also have 4 rookies are on the roster. Plus the Head Coach was not on last years opening day roster. I am not saying that is the reason for their uneven play, but I have seen enough good that I am willing to see this play out a little, before axing Colliton or blowing up the core.

They are definitely not the train wreck they were for a good part of last year, though their inconsistency is maddening sometimes. (Nashville, San Jose in particular)
Chunk
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Orange, CA
Joined: 11.06.2015

Nov 8 @ 11:08 AM ET
Of more interest to me, when Murphy comes back, do you send Bovquist down, or do you put KKKK on waivers?
- LAHawk


I would send Boqvist down. He would get more time in all situations and continue to grow. That is just my perspective though.
Chunk
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Orange, CA
Joined: 11.06.2015

Nov 8 @ 11:09 AM ET
And you came here for nuanced?
- mohel


Well... not from you per se…
Chunk
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Orange, CA
Joined: 11.06.2015

Nov 8 @ 11:11 AM ET
Sorry, not buying it. Gus was better and more engaged last night, but the fact is that he remains a very bad defenseman. His gap control is atrocious, especially for someone who is a good skater. He constantly puts himself in positions where his back is to the puck carrier. He passing and puck decisions in his own zone are below average. When he is putting up 60pts you live with it when he is not, you suffer the circumstances.
- TheTrob


I said IF.

I completely get what you are saying. I just thought that if we had Gus playing well (and ideally generating points) then I would be hesitant in splitting him up from a comfort zone.
-Doh-
Location: VA
Joined: 10.05.2015

Nov 8 @ 11:11 AM ET
Imo its way to early to celebrate or believe this team has changed .

Now I realize my comments might seem controversial, I'm just pointing out that going back to last year this team has been up and down win 2 games lose 7 .

I'd like to see Chicago make a trade that involves either 1 or 2 core players and a couple of prospects to maybe Montreal for their youth.

- Taylorst1


I have to say. I find it hard to agree with virtually any of your posts, including this one.
bhawks2241
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Chicago, IL
Joined: 09.17.2013

Nov 8 @ 11:12 AM ET
The Hawks seemed to abandon the heavy dump and chase strategy last night. Is this something the Crawford has implored Colliton to use?

Colliton didn't use this offensive strategy last year. It is puzzling why he would use it this year.

If it is Colliton's choice then that is alarming. If he has realized his mistake and adjusted back to last years system then that is a good thing. Still zero logic for why anyone on the coaching staff or front office would think deploying a heavy dump and chase style would work with the current roster.

Lot of questions marks about the front office/coaching staff and what their strategy is since someone had to sign off on or know about deploying the dump and chase style of play....but the Hawks looked solid last night.

Toews coming around a bit too.

Boqvist looks like a real keeper. He seems to have matured physically from what I saw last year. Still has a ways to go but he seems to have the hockey IQ to go with the skills. He doesn't have that Nick Leddy vibe to him.
TheTrob
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Oak Park, IL
Joined: 04.14.2010

Nov 8 @ 11:13 AM ET
I think the man-to-man d-zone dumpster fire affects the rest of their game. When we do finally gain possession in the defensive zone, no one is in position for an effective breakout. That causes confusion through the neutral zone and forces a lot of dump in's that the forwards aren't even in position to effectively chase down. If they would just go to a normal d-zone setup (zone coverage) then the breakouts become more instinctual, and that should continue through the neutral zone and into the offensive zone with carry-in entries as much as possible.
- JPBurke27



Spot on JP!! Last night I continually watched defenseman chasing guys up by the blue line and see forwards not knowing where to be. In reality the Hawks D overall are not strong enough skaters to implement a true man to man, as you have too many slow a foot D-men to be able to keep up. Seabrook and Maata can’t keep up with anyone, how are they gonna cover someone 1-on-1. Both of them need to rely on positioning and smarts to be effective, not in their skating.
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