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Forums :: Blog World :: Tyler Cameron: The trip that broke the camel's back
Author Message
Taylorst1
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 07.09.2018

Feb 17 @ 12:13 PM ET
Helps to build when you are so bad, that you draft #’s 1 and 3 in consecutive years. Didn’t builder Dale get overruled with the Hossa signing, he wanted to keep Havlat.

How has Dale done building the Panthers the past 10 years? He has sure gone through a lot of coaches including DeBoer, Gallant, and Boughner

- LAHawk


Talon wasn't the only person , I can't remember the other 2 or 3 people who has significant roles in drafting and acquiring Chicago's depth and talent.

Stan had so much young talent and Chicago overall was so deep that he had to simply tinker, but in the process he destroyed the depth allowed the team to age while handing out to many contracts that hurt this team.

Talon was the guy who brought hossa in and because of how he structured that contract and other contracts he was fired.

Stan did grab some young prospects, Tevo, etc but he wrote bad contracts and got played when trying to resolve a issue that he himself created
catrisc
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Elmhurst, IL
Joined: 12.12.2019

Feb 17 @ 12:18 PM ET
A quick note on Strome: If he doesn't raise his compete level you have to cut ties. I think he is still learning what it takes to be a pro. He looks timid, afraid, cautious out there. I question whether he wants to be a pro. He has a little of perlini syndrome.

The last 10 games have been a preview of playoff hockey...looks who is performing the best; Kane, Toews, Caggiula, Highmore, Kubalik, Saad, Dach. The ones who are struggling; Strome, Debrincat and Nylander.
jhawk59
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 02.15.2013

Feb 17 @ 12:20 PM ET
On April 5 the final standings will likely have the Hawks last in the Central Div. Arguably the team has received goaltending that is in the top 25% of the league, so that isn't the issue. So what is the problem and where does the blame lie - coaching staff, management or player personnel? Seems to me it's all of the above and it isn't getting fixed by just firing JC.

Veteran coaches Babcock, Boudreau, Gallant, Deboer, Laviolette, Hines have all been axed this year. Are their old teams really playing dramatically better under a new guy? Not many of them.

Where the Hawks are doesn't surprise me - dressing 19 year olds every night to play against men doesn't usually turn out well. Playing guys like Gus, Kampf, Smith, Carpenter every night demonstrates how far below contending status their roster is.
So when players like Debrincat, Nylander and Strome come up with disappointing seasons, forget the playoffs and don't blame it all on coaching.

What I don't like about this team is how poorly they play on home ice (coach and player blame) and the lack of size and grit on the roster (Bowman).

It isn't a quick fix that is accomplished by a couple of firings.

- RickJ


Rick,
I always appreciate your keen insight. I want y run a couple thoughts.indogar we to see if you agree. I believe I know how you feel we I get an idea from your post. I am just diving s bit deeper and appreciate your response.

1) DeBrincat and Strome. Together on a line when they were scoring or generating good opportunities last year, I grumbled about Strome. Teams do not need to be fast at each position, each player in line up. Fact is that you win more puck battles if you have speed. Yes desire and attitude also to get to puck. This last point is a shortcoming of Strome.mm......he too often doesn't get going or involved enough. Immediately. I want to move him from center but did he get best results with DeBrincat as a center

If a player is slow skating I sure as heck demand that he have something else to contribute. Not sure that Strome can be consistent but I realize when (if) DeBrincat is back in last season form, then Strome should be scoring and more involved in the play. Nonetheless if I could dump Strome, I would. Ideally his replacement is 50% at the dot. Ideally his replacement comes from the 2020 draft because i like best a Toews, Dach, 2020 draft center. The prospects like Kurashaev is the other center, eventually the #3 or #4 center

The problem with this outcome is the availability of a power center ptefernce over s skill set guy and to be able to draft him. A back up plan is at least one year down the road if the Penn State kid improved his skating. Then he is comparable to Strome in many ways, although I like him potentially more because he is a yapper. With him we hope his skating improves. With him we await the answer whether he is so good to be a point per game player. Upside higher than Strome? This is all.the thoughts that .just perculate in Bowman's mind

DeBrincat you keep and hope some time next season he is in shape to produce the skill and goals again. I am betting his problems are more due to weight training than other concerns brought up on this board

2). I like Doh poster want to give Colliton better players to succeed with as far as next season. But then after reading the post about dmen skating out of position, and even routinely lured out of position as game strategy......this is just too much to bear. We have a bumper crop of young dmen. They should not be set back in their development by Colliton's system

While I hope that Carlsson really does get opportunity and can become a solid #5/ third pair, I would like your impression on Special K. Has he leveled out or do you suggest that he might develop yet into a more consistent third pair?
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Feb 17 @ 12:21 PM ET
A quick note on Strome: If he doesn't raise his compete level you have to cut ties. I think he is still learning what it takes to be a pro. He looks timid, afraid, cautious out there. I question whether he wants to be a pro. He has a little of perlini syndrome.

The last 10 games have been a preview of playoff hockey...looks who is performing the best; Kane, Toews, Caggiula, Highmore, Kubalik, Saad, Dach. The ones who are struggling; Strome, Debrincat and Nylander.

- catrisc


Nylander did have two goals against Calgary.
powerenforcer
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Wheeling, IL
Joined: 09.24.2009

Feb 17 @ 12:24 PM ET
Talon wasn't the only person , I can't remember the other 2 or 3 people who has significant roles in drafting and acquiring Chicago's depth and talent.

Stan had so much young talent and Chicago overall was so deep that he had to simply tinker, but in the process he destroyed the depth allowed the team to age while handing out to many contracts that hurt this team.

Talon was the guy who brought hossa in and because of how he structured that contract and other contracts he was fired.

Stan did grab some young prospects, Tevo, etc but he wrote bad contracts and got played when trying to resolve a issue that he himself created

- Taylorst1


Marshall Johnson and Rick Dudley.
catrisc
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Elmhurst, IL
Joined: 12.12.2019

Feb 17 @ 12:25 PM ET
Nylander did have two goals against Calgary.
- mohel


He did and those two goals represent 25% of his total goals. I agree that he looks better the last few games. I need to see his compete level continue to rise. Not all players are lucky enough to play a skill game in the playoffs like Patty Kane can. I want to see him get to those dirty areas in the slot.
mohel
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 02.08.2013

Feb 17 @ 12:30 PM ET
He did and those two goals represent 25% of his total goals. I agree that he looks better the last few games. I need to see his compete level continue to rise. Not all players are lucky enough to play a skill game in the playoffs like Patty Kane can. I want to see him get to those dirty areas in the slot.
- catrisc


I don't disagree with your sentiment, but I'd give those guys a solid chance to develop. Why not, the Hawks aren't going anywhere and they're not blocking someone else?
BetweenTheDots
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 06.13.2015

Feb 17 @ 12:37 PM ET
7 days left. Tic toc Bowman
Ogilthorpe2
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: 37,000 FT
Joined: 07.09.2009

Feb 17 @ 12:39 PM ET
Marshall Johnson and Rick Dudley.
- powerenforcer

Mike Smith
BetweenTheDots
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: IL
Joined: 06.13.2015

Feb 17 @ 12:45 PM ET
I really don't get the hate for JC, the defense sucks, period

Things have gotten better on the PK but we have a young softish team in regards to if we are being held, interfered with, and so on and the refs decide not to call it, like on this losing streak, we fade away.

I wish, they would have the mentality to compound the issue by if interfered with, cross check, if being held slash the player, sure they will call penalties on us but the more you do it the less it'll happen or escalation will happen where you force the refs to make calls. Not going to the playoffs anyways
Theo Fox
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.18.2016

Feb 17 @ 12:52 PM ET
Highmore is a high value guy. Just like Caggiula. No these are not superstars or guys that will be game changers but we need them on the team. Highmore is a GREAT 4th line player. Caggiula is a GREAT third liner. Need both of them.

Furthermore, look how Highmore has been playing on the boards. The Hawks DO NOT have enough guys that can win board battles. He out maneuvered Tkachuk in the Calgary game to score a goal. You need him.

Not too mention, the learning curve for rookies is steep. Hawks can't afford to play as many rookies next year. Need guys like Dach and Highmore to be strong year 2 players.

- catrisc

Agree on your perspectives of Highmore and Caggiula.

On Highmore, he's got the making of an outstanding 4th liner with NHL staying power: relentless, fearless, fast as heck, nose for dirty areas, offensive skill. And as you pointed at, he actually wins his battles whether along the boards or other 50/50 situations. Even when he loses, he still competes hard.

I also agree with scottak that a future 4th line of Carpenter centering Highmore and Entwistle would be ideal. Entwistle plays a similar game as Highmore just much stronger and bigger but slower. Entwistle can battle against two opponents and still come away with the puck.

Entwistle may need a little more time in Rockford but he's on a good trajectory for no later than 2021.
Elbows15
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: I was going to do the math on this but I don't think it will help., IL
Joined: 08.04.2013

Feb 17 @ 12:53 PM ET
He'll be the best player available at their position and he addresses a need. It's a no-brainer.
- DarthKane

the no brains part is all I agree with in that statement.
powerenforcer
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Wheeling, IL
Joined: 09.24.2009

Feb 17 @ 12:54 PM ET
Mike Smith
- Ogilthorpe2


The clock is correct twice in a day. The Mike Smith years were a waste. He was the one who brought in Alpo, drafted the Russian Wonder twins, and traded for Karpostev.
RickJ
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Burlington, ON
Joined: 01.12.2010

Feb 17 @ 12:56 PM ET
With all that - the Hawks have lost 33 games this season.

19 have been one-goal losses, two goal losses with an ENG (effectively one goal games), or games lost on OT or SO.

They are in most games, with a chance to win or get games to OT at the end.

Doesn’t mean they’re close to being a Cup contender. But - does that mean they are not far away from being a bubble team on top of the bubble - instead of being one at the bottom of the bubble?

- StLBravesFan

One question amid your win/loss numbers - when the Hawks have played a game this year that was extremely important to their moving up in the Central Div. or WC standings, how many have they actually won? I submit to you the answer is not many, home or away. That means they lose most games that really are 4 pointers.
Last night in Winnipeg was just another example.

And as it relates to being a bubble team, with the exception of NJ and Detroit, virtually every team sitting 15-31 in points is a bubble team. All it tells you is they aren't very good.
Ogilthorpe2
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: 37,000 FT
Joined: 07.09.2009

Feb 17 @ 1:00 PM ET
The clock is correct twice in a day. The Mike Smith years were a waste. He was the one who brought in Alpo, drafted the Russian Wonder twins, and traded for Karpostev.
- powerenforcer

And drafted Seabrook, Byfuglien, Burish...and a few others I’m probably forgetting. He had some big misses, but he also brought in some key pieces.
Elbows15
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: I was going to do the math on this but I don't think it will help., IL
Joined: 08.04.2013

Feb 17 @ 1:01 PM ET
Fun list. I think he's spot on about Kane.
- mohel

Way off on Joey Mullins, tho. I would have him higher. I can see Eichel and Matthews n the Tp 5 eventually but at this point in their careers? Top 20? sure.
boilermaker100
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.23.2015

Feb 17 @ 1:02 PM ET
With all that - the Hawks have lost 33 games this season.

19 have been one-goal losses, two goal losses with an ENG (effectively one goal games), or games lost on OT or SO.

They are in most games, with a chance to win or get games to OT at the end.

Doesn’t mean they’re close to being a Cup contender. But - does that mean they are not far away from being a bubble team on top of the bubble - instead of being one at the bottom of the bubble?

- StLBravesFan


Last time I checked the Hawks were something like 25 for 175 on the PP this season - 14%. If they were 35 for 175 they would be at 20%. 10 more goals here and there throughout the season would have probably resulted in several more victories and a quite a few more points. The PP is an important facet of the Hawks game which needs improvement.
Ogilthorpe2
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: 37,000 FT
Joined: 07.09.2009

Feb 17 @ 1:02 PM ET
Highmore is a high value guy. Just like Caggiula. No these are not superstars or guys that will be game changers but we need them on the team. Highmore is a GREAT 4th line player. Caggiula is a GREAT third liner. Need both of them.

Furthermore, look how Highmore has been playing on the boards. The Hawks DO NOT have enough guys that can win board battles. He out maneuvered Tkachuk in the Calgary game to score a goal. You need him.

Not too mention, the learning curve for rookies is steep. Hawks can't afford to play as many rookies next year. Need guys like Dach and Highmore to be strong year 2 players.

- catrisc

Couldn’t agree more.

And I’m not saying that in an Eddie Haskell kind of way.
TheTrob
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Oak Park, IL
Joined: 04.14.2010

Feb 17 @ 1:06 PM ET
I would be in the "keep Bowman" camp. (I think McD and Rocky are too.) I am neutral on Colliton. He has not had the horses to compete so it is hard to judge. Bowman has improved the roster since Q was axed. (If you do not think so look at the roster the game before he was fired.) I would not mind seeing him being replaced by Gallant. But I would be ok with letting him at least start next season. It should be interesting to see how Bowman retools the roster at the TD, the draft and in the summer.
- -Doh-


Hawks don't have the players to play how Gallant likes to play. He likes to play a fast, aggressive forecheck, all out type of game. The Hawks aging core are not really made for that type of play. It worked in Vegas for a few seasons because you had a bunch of middle 6 players trying to show their worth and hustling their asses off. Worked less in subsequent seasons as players realized they couldn't play balls to the wall for 82 plus the playoffs without emptying the gas tank before reaching the final destination.
pdx2ord
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Portland, OR
Joined: 09.02.2015

Feb 17 @ 1:06 PM ET
A quick note on Strome: If he doesn't raise his compete level you have to cut ties. I think he is still learning what it takes to be a pro. He looks timid, afraid, cautious out there. I question whether he wants to be a pro. He has a little of perlini syndrome.

The last 10 games have been a preview of playoff hockey...looks who is performing the best; Kane, Toews, Caggiula, Highmore, Kubalik, Saad, Dach. The ones who are struggling; Strome, Debrincat and Nylander.

- catrisc


In professional sports, have always believed that during playoffs and other do-or-die situations, raw skill + character cannot be beat, but if you've only got one, character wins out in those situations. Golden Knights year 1 is a prime example.
Theo Fox
Chicago Blackhawks
Joined: 06.18.2016

Feb 17 @ 1:07 PM ET
Highmore is a high value guy. Just like Caggiula. No these are not superstars or guys that will be game changers but we need them on the team. Highmore is a GREAT 4th line player. Caggiula is a GREAT third liner. Need both of them.

Furthermore, look how Highmore has been playing on the boards. The Hawks DO NOT have enough guys that can win board battles. He out maneuvered Tkachuk in the Calgary game to score a goal. You need him.

Not too mention, the learning curve for rookies is steep. Hawks can't afford to play as many rookies next year. Need guys like Dach and Highmore to be strong year 2 players.

- catrisc

On Caggiula, although he's not a standard top 6 winger, he can play that role when called upon and do it quite effectively. Very similar to Shaw when Mutt is healthy and on his game. Creates space and goes hard to the net.

If the Hawks had the forward depth to consistently slot 6 on the 1st and 2nd lines, Caggiula would still be valuable as a 3rd liner. Again, similar to Shaw. Rugged, all terrain, all out every shift, skilled utility player.

Barratt could be in this mold as well. A recent article on him discussed his need for skating improvement yet comlimented his ability to process the game fast and display high skill in tight areas.

Soderlund has speed to burn and could be complimented the same. Sikura as well even though many would big to differ.
pdx2ord
Season Ticket Holder
Chicago Blackhawks
Location: Portland, OR
Joined: 09.02.2015

Feb 17 @ 1:10 PM ET
Speaking of 70s Rock & Rollers - WOAH

https://twitter.com/Jesus.../1229004802908196865?s=20
rpeters01
Season Ticket Holder
Joined: 07.09.2016

Feb 17 @ 1:12 PM ET
I would be in the "keep Bowman" camp. (I think McD and Rocky are too.) I am neutral on Colliton. He has not had the horses to compete so it is hard to judge. Bowman has improved the roster since Q was axed. (If you do not think so look at the roster the game before he was fired.) I would not mind seeing him being replaced by Gallant. But I would be ok with letting him at least start next season. It should be interesting to see how Bowman retools the roster at the TD, the draft and in the summer.
- -Doh-

Gallant appears to have a two year shelf life.
67hawks
Joined: 08.30.2012

Feb 17 @ 1:12 PM ET
Highmore is a high value guy. Just like Caggiula. No these are not superstars or guys that will be game changers but we need them on the team. Highmore is a GREAT 4th line player. Caggiula is a GREAT third liner. Need both of them.

Furthermore, look how Highmore has been playing on the boards. The Hawks DO NOT have enough guys that can win board battles. He out maneuvered Tkachuk in the Calgary game to score a goal. You need him.

Not too mention, the learning curve for rookies is steep. Hawks can't afford to play as many rookies next year. Need guys like Dach and Highmore to be strong year 2 players.

- catrisc


I am glad that others are starting to see the value in Highmore. I have been high on him since I first saw him play for us. These are the kind of players you go to battle with when the going gets tough as in playoff hockey.
rpeters01
Season Ticket Holder
Joined: 07.09.2016

Feb 17 @ 1:15 PM ET
He did and those two goals represent 25% of his total goals. I agree that he looks better the last few games. I need to see his compete level continue to rise. Not all players are lucky enough to play a skill game in the playoffs like Patty Kane can. I want to see him get to those dirty areas in the slot.
- catrisc

Would love to see him win a battle behind the net and center the puck for a goal like Highmore did for him.
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