On another site someone proposed a horrible trade between the Wings and Jets. The deal was Laine and Roslovic for Mantha, Zadina, Seider and Cholowski
- dcz28

Hard pass.

On another site someone proposed a horrible trade between the Wings and Jets. The deal was Laine and Roslovic for Mantha, Zadina, Seider and Cholowski
- dcz28

Man, that’s borderline going to a tree stump in deliverance

Man, that’s borderline going to a tree stump in deliverance
- Jeremy Laura

No kidding. Mantha isn't that far off the production Laine brings on his own. Then you add Zadina and i'm pretty sure they will out produce Laine for what would likely be cheaper for the next few years that Zadina is on a cheap contract. So you're basically giving them Seider and Cholowski for a 20 point player in Roslovic.

Not sure if that guy was a fan of the Jets or he just hates the Wings and want to see them suck for a few more years on top of what they will already. Big step backwards for the Wings in the rebuild in a one sided deal like this. Not to mention Laine could refuse to sign long term, file for arbitration next off-season, get a one year deal and then bolt as a UFA.

Man, that’s borderline going to a tree stump in deliverance
- Jeremy Laura

A trade like that could be termed "double-barreld ugly......ugly as home-grown sin". If ANY GM made a deal like that, stands wouldn't fill again until said GM was a distant, sad memory.

Hard NO. Full stop.

Good points, Ladd. So, here's a bit of a comparison, bear with me:
My great-grandmother died at 97, live thru Spanish Flu, the Depression, 2 World Wars, television, internet, cell phones, etc.... The last time I talked to her she said "Michael, think about all I've lived through. I've seen history made that you can't imagine..."
So, I contend that from a sports perspective, we're doing the same. No one's ever had to re-build under cap AND COVID, and flat-cap, etc....Further, NO ONE'S seen such amazing, Hall-of-Fame players do it as GMs. Not quite as historic as Great Grandmother's life, to be sure. But history's being written each day. When the dust settles, an entire new blue-print will have been laid down: How to Rebuild Under Caps, Pandemics, Flat-Caps, and NO Minor League Seasoning.

The GMs you mentioned will be pioneers...and we get to watch it happen and see the fruits of their labours. This is a COOL time to be a hockey fan, brothers!!!
- mcmastermike1968

She sounds like a wise, wise woman. Lucky you had someone with such perspective to learn from.

We are entering unknown territory in this league. The domino effects throughout hockey are similar to other industries, too. COVID is a systemic shock. I encourage everyone to read "The Black Swan" by Nassimm Taleb which gives good perspective on how to build and sustain systems that can survive these types of shocks.

A trade like that could be termed "double-barreld ugly......ugly as home-grown sin". If ANY GM made a deal like that, stands wouldn't fill again until said GM was a distant, sad memory.

Hard NO. Full stop.
- mcmastermike1968

It's a foolish trade which should get a GM fired. That Jets fan is living in Fantasy Land.

The thing LA has that most other teams don’t is Drew Doughty (and Kopitar). If it goes full rebuild you could get some nice assets for a defenseman like DD. some impressive pieces over there
- Jeremy Laura

Carter and Brown are off the books in 2 years. Quick is off in 3. Kopi is off in 4. The first 3 have a cap hit (combined) of ~17mm, but their actual salaries are about 9.5mm. So that's gotta be a dream for management in this environment. Because of Kopi's style, training, and IQ, I can see him playing into his late 30's after his current contract expires in '24 as a useful 3C/PK specialist at ~14 min/night.

The team is going to suck again this year so it should get a top 10 pick and a chance at one of the stud dmen.

I love Drew, but he's got a lot of miles on him and needs to refine his game a bit. He just can use his speed to make up for his cheating in the offensive zone anymore. It isn't there. I think he will be a useful player late into that mega contract, but I don't seem him as moveable unless the Kings retained quite a bit.

Carter and Brown are off the books in 2 years. Quick is off in 3. Kopi is off in 4. The first 3 have a cap hit (combined) of ~17mm, but their actual salaries are about 9.5mm. So that's gotta be a dream for management in this environment. Because of Kopi's style, training, and IQ, I can see him playing into his late 30's after his current contract expires in '24 as a useful 3C/PK specialist at ~14 min/night.

The team is going to suck again this year so it should get a top 10 pick and a chance at one of the stud dmen.

I love Drew, but he's got a lot of miles on him and needs to refine his game a bit. He just can use his speed to make up for his cheating in the offensive zone anymore. It isn't there. I think he will be a useful player late into that mega contract, but I don't seem him as moveable unless the Kings retained quite a bit.
- Only_A_Ladd

Retention, for sure. I really thought Toronto would work on a deal for him. Yeah, he’s slowed a bit, but he brings it. I love that dude. He’s a missing piece for teams that want to contend. It’s tough to see how quick the teams have to shift gears any more. Those cup runs reminded me a bit of the 97/98 Red Wings. Loved watching

Carter and Brown are off the books in 2 years. Quick is off in 3. Kopi is off in 4. The first 3 have a cap hit (combined) of ~17mm, but their actual salaries are about 9.5mm. So that's gotta be a dream for management in this environment. Because of Kopi's style, training, and IQ, I can see him playing into his late 30's after his current contract expires in '24 as a useful 3C/PK specialist at ~14 min/night.

The team is going to suck again this year so it should get a top 10 pick and a chance at one of the stud dmen.

I love Drew, but he's got a lot of miles on him and needs to refine his game a bit. He just can use his speed to make up for his cheating in the offensive zone anymore. It isn't there. I think he will be a useful player late into that mega contract, but I don't seem him as moveable unless the Kings retained quite a bit.
- Only_A_Ladd

Retention, for sure. I really thought Toronto would work on a deal for him. Yeah, he’s slowed a bit, but he brings it. I love that dude. He’s a missing piece for teams that want to contend. It’s tough to see how quick the teams have to shift gears any more. Those cup runs reminded me a bit of the 97/98 Red Wings. Loved watching

On a somber note: Doc Emrick has retired......I grew up listening to him call the Port Huron Flags games.....met him several times, a more gracious and genuine person you will never meet. This is the end of an era, for sure (I posted on the Devils guy's blog because I saw the write-up there...DON'T HATE ME, J!!!! YOU'RE STILL MY #1 ).

Random observation:

I know it's an especially tough market for middling-and-below UFAs, but I think it's notable (if not exactly unpredictable) that so far none of the players Yzerman cut loose have signed elsewhere yet. Abdelkader, Howard, Ericsson, Daley, Bowey, Perlini, Ehn are all still UFAs. I don't know that any of them have even been rumored to go anywhere -- just no buzz whatsoever.

I'm honestly curious if any of them will play even a single NHL game next season. You'd think Bowey might get a shot somewhere, maybe. (I think he's by far the best of the group, which is one of the most depressing sentences I've written in a while.) Perlini I think would be headed to the AHL in a normal year; if the NHL expands active rosters to accommodate for the lack of an AHL maybe he'll be a "black ace" somewhere. Ehn I think probably goes back to Europe. The rest might just be done, by choice or not.

It's pretty telling that we can flat out cut more than a third of the starting lineup and none of them get any interest whatsoever from any of the other 30 teams, flat cap or not.

Random observation:

I know it's an especially tough market for middling-and-below UFAs, but I think it's notable (if not exactly unpredictable) that so far none of the players Yzerman cut loose have signed elsewhere yet. Abdelkader, Howard, Ericsson, Daley, Bowey, Perlini, Ehn are all still UFAs. I don't know that any of them have even been rumored to go anywhere -- just no buzz whatsoever.

I'm honestly curious if any of them will play even a single NHL game next season. You'd think Bowey might get a shot somewhere, maybe. (I think he's by far the best of the group, which is one of the most depressing sentences I've written in a while.) Perlini I think would be headed to the AHL in a normal year; if the NHL expands active rosters to accommodate for the lack of an AHL maybe he'll be a "black ace" somewhere. Ehn I think probably goes back to Europe. The rest might just be done, by choice or not.

It's pretty telling that we can flat out cut more than a third of the starting lineup and none of them get any interest whatsoever from any of the other 30 teams, flat cap or not.
- Sven22

None of them are worth more than a PTO right now. I can see all of them getting one somewhere except for maybe Ericsson.

Random observation:

I know it's an especially tough market for middling-and-below UFAs, but I think it's notable (if not exactly unpredictable) that so far none of the players Yzerman cut loose have signed elsewhere yet. Abdelkader, Howard, Ericsson, Daley, Bowey, Perlini, Ehn are all still UFAs. I don't know that any of them have even been rumored to go anywhere -- just no buzz whatsoever.

I'm honestly curious if any of them will play even a single NHL game next season. You'd think Bowey might get a shot somewhere, maybe. (I think he's by far the best of the group, which is one of the most depressing sentences I've written in a while.) Perlini I think would be headed to the AHL in a normal year; if the NHL expands active rosters to accommodate for the lack of an AHL maybe he'll be a "black ace" somewhere. Ehn I think probably goes back to Europe. The rest might just be done, by choice or not.

It's pretty telling that we can flat out cut more than a third of the starting lineup and none of them get any interest whatsoever from any of the other 30 teams, flat cap or not.
- Sven22

Just shows you how bad at asset management Holland was and the huge mess Yzerman is still cleaning up. It's just depressing knowing that Holland should have started an actual, true rebuild about 5 years earlier and some of this mess could have been avoided. I won't even start on all those horrible contracts...

What's the status of AA at this point ?? I heard he did not get a qualifying offer from Holland.

I am bummed that there may not be an AHL season. I was going to renew my AHL Live account to stream the Griffins games so I could watch their prospects.

Just shows you how bad at asset management Holland was and the huge mess Yzerman is still cleaning up. It's just depressing knowing that Holland should have started an actual, true rebuild about 5 years earlier and some of this mess could have been avoided. I won't even start on all those horrible contracts...

What's the status of AA at this point ?? I heard he did not get a qualifying offer from Holland.

I am bummed that there may not be an AHL season. I was going to renew my AHL Live account to stream the Griffins games so I could watch their prospects.
- Vladdie_Kon1

AA is a UFA, still unsigned as well. I do still think he could be a useful player in the right situation, ideally a well-structured defensive team that needs a little more goal-scoring pop. (Duclair I think is a similar sort of player and is also unsigned.)

But between his horrible season, COVID, and so many teams in cap hell he's probably going to have to take a pretty steep pay cut wherever he ends up signing.

I honestly wouldn't mind him back in Detroit. Score some goals then flip him again. Obviously not happening though.

AA is a UFA, still unsigned as well. I do still think he could be a useful player in the right situation, ideally a well-structured defensive team that needs a little more goal-scoring pop. (Duclair I think is a similar sort of player and is also unsigned.)

But between his horrible season, COVID, and so many teams in cap hell he's probably going to have to take a pretty steep pay cut wherever he ends up signing.

I honestly wouldn't mind him back in Detroit. Score some goals then flip him again. Obviously not happening though.
- Sven22

I agree... I wouldn't mind him coming back at a discount & short term 1 year deal. Yeah... everyone complains he sucks defensively and not responsible in his own end... but he still adds an element of goal scoring / speed / finishing that can be useful. Especially on this roster which is starved for goals. If he could get his scoring touch back we could flip him again. His ship has already sailed with Detroit though... definitely a disappointment it didn't work out here.

I agree... I wouldn't mind him coming back at a discount & short term 1 year deal. Yeah... everyone complains he sucks defensively and not responsible in his own end... but he still adds an element of goal scoring / speed / finishing that can be useful. Especially on this roster which is starved for goals. If he could get his scoring touch back we could flip him again. His ship has already sailed with Detroit though... definitely a disappointment it didn't work out here.
- Vladdie_Kon1

There's no question he stinks defensively but yeah, he drives play on offense (5-on-5 and PP), cashes in on a lot of his chances, and also draws penalties at almost twice the rate of an average NHLer (an underrated benefit of speed) while taking fewer than average himself.

I still maintain that Detroit isn't the optimal setting for his talents (which is why I supported trading him) but he's definitely a better-than-average hockey player overall IMO. I don't think he'll ever hit 30 goals again but he can be decently deadly under the right circumstances.

Honestly in terms of the results I don't think there's a whole lot of difference between AA and Fabbri. AA is a better skater and offensive play driver. Fabbri has a better shot. Both have a great penalty differential. Both stink defensively.

Ok so I was messing around cap Friendly and think I've solved Tampa's Cap hell and made Detroit and the Rangers better.

Tampa trades Tyler Johnson and Anthony Cirelli to Detroit for future considerations.

Detroit then trades Tyler Johnson with 50% retained to the Rangers for a 5th round pick.

Tampa likely trades Pacquette and Coburn for 6th and 7th round picks to become Cap compliant. They keep Killorn and their 1st round pick and don't lose a top prospect. Brisebois can then sign Sergachev and Cernak to bridge deals.

Tampa does lose 2C Cirelli but they can easily slide Stamkos back to 2C.

Rangers get a decent 3C in Johnson for the next 2 years. If his play falls off a cliff they can always buy him out. 2.5 mil AAV for a 3C is decent. TJ would definitely waive his NTC for the Rangers. Zibanajed, Strome, Johnson down the middle is good.

Yzerman essentially buys himself a 23 year deal old legit 2C for the next decade. Larkin finally gets some help at C. Stevie can pay 2.5 mil AAV of TJ's contract for 4 years. He has even more cap space coming off the books this trade deadline/summer.

By the time TJ's 2.5 mil AAV is up Detroit should be a playoff team if we draft well.

Yzerman can sign RFA Cirelli to a bridge deal or lock him up long term.

It's a win/win/win for all 3 teams. Thoughts?

Ok so I was messing around cap Friendly and think I've solved Tampa's Cap hell and made Detroit and the Rangers better.

Tampa trades Tyler Johnson and Anthony Cirelli to Detroit for future considerations.

Detroit then trades Tyler Johnson with 50% retained to the Rangers for a 5th round pick.

Tampa likely trades Pacquette and Coburn for 6th and 7th round picks to become Cap compliant. They keep Killorn and their 1st round pick and don't lose a top prospect. Brisebois can then sign Sergachev and Cernak to bridge deals.

Tampa does lose 2C Cirelli but they can easily slide Stamkos back to 2C.

Rangers get a decent 3C in Johnson for the next 2 years. If his play falls off a cliff they can always buy him out. 2.5 mil AAV for a 3C is decent. TJ would definitely waive his NTC for the Rangers. Zibanajed, Strome, Johnson down the middle is good.

Yzerman essentially buys himself a 23 year deal old legit 2C for the next decade. Larkin finally gets some help at C. Stevie can pay 2.5 mil AAV of TJ's contract for 4 years. He has even more cap space coming off the books this trade deadline/summer.

By the time TJ's 2.5 mil AAV is up Detroit should be a playoff team if we draft well.

Yzerman can sign RFA Cirelli to a bridge deal or lock him up long term.

It's a win/win/win for all 3 teams. Thoughts?


- gergeswillems

Couple of thoughts:

- One potential wrinkle is that if Johnson is bought out by the Rangers with Detroit retaining 50%, the Red Wings would be on the hook for half the buyout cost. Assuming Johnson gets bought out after two years that's ~$1.33m in 2023, ~$833k in 2024, and ~$700k in 2025 and 2026. I mean, that's probably manageable but it would suck to be in a situation where you ended up taking a couple more years of dead money onto your cap because somebody who doesn't even play for you got bought out by a different team entirely.

- I would love to get Cirelli but I feel like Tampa is going to do absolutely everything they can to avoid losing him. It's possible they end up with absolutely no other choice but I suspect that they'd be willing to wait until the last minute and pursue every possible avenue to move whatever combination of Johnson, Killorn, Palat, Gourde, Coburn, Pacquette, or maybe even McDonagh gets them under the ceiling.

- I'd seriously consider just straight up offer-sheeting either Cirelli or Sergachev. Big risk obviously since that 2021 first-rounder has a shot at being first overall.

Couple of thoughts:

- One potential wrinkle is that if Johnson is bought out by the Rangers with Detroit retaining 50%, the Red Wings would be on the hook for half the buyout cost. Assuming Johnson gets bought out after two years that's ~$1.33m in 2023, ~$833k in 2024, and ~$700k in 2025 and 2026. I mean, that's probably manageable but it would suck to be in a situation where you ended up taking a couple more years of dead money onto your cap because somebody who doesn't even play for you got bought out by a different team entirely.

- I would love to get Cirelli but I feel like Tampa is going to do absolutely everything they can to avoid losing him. It's possible they end up with absolutely no other choice but I suspect that they'd be willing to wait until the last minute and pursue every possible avenue to move whatever combination of Johnson, Killorn, Palat, Gourde, Coburn, Pacquette, or maybe even McDonagh gets them under the ceiling.

- I'd seriously consider just straight up offer-sheeting either Cirelli or Sergachev. Big risk obviously since that 2021 first-rounder has a shot at being first overall.
- Sven22

Time is running out for Tampa. Cap space will be eaten up by remaining free agents. Teams have internal caps where they don't even spend to the ceiling. Which teams can take Tyler Johnson's 5 mil AAV for the next 4 years?

Where is this magical salary cap fairy coming from to help Tampa out? I'd like to know. Teams likely have presented offer sheets to Sergachev, Cirelli and Cernak. But the player still has to sign it. None of these players want to leave Tampa.

Does Brisebois trade for a zombie contract like Zetterberg to LTIR his way out? Like the Leafs did when they traded for Horton and Clarkson so they could re-sign (overpay) Marner?

Do they LTIR Stamkos? He'll be healthy eventually. Johnson, Killorn, Palat, Gourde, McDonagh all have NTC's. I don't see how Brisebois weasels his way out of this without eating a warm sandwich. Something has to give here.

I wouldn't want to give up next year's first. That's why I don't want Stevie to offer sheet Sergachev or Cirelli.

Time is running out for Tampa. Cap space will be eaten up by remaining free agents. Teams have internal caps where they don't even spend to the ceiling. Which teams can take Tyler Johnson's 5 mil AAV for the next 4 years?

Where is this magical salary cap fairy coming from to help Tampa out? I'd like to know. Teams likely have presented offer sheets to Sergachev, Cirelli and Cernak. But the player still has to sign it. None of these players want to leave Tampa.

Does Brisebois trade for a zombie contract like Zetterberg to LTIR his way out? Like the Leafs did when they traded for Horton and Clarkson so they could re-sign (overpay) Marner?

Do they LTIR Stamkos? He'll be healthy eventually. Johnson, Killorn, Palat, Gourde, McDonagh all have NTC's. I don't see how Brisebois weasels his way out of this without eating a warm sandwich. Something has to give here.

I wouldn't want to give up next year's first. That's why I don't want Stevie to offer sheet Sergachev or Cirelli.
- gergeswillems

Good points for sure. Tampa is definitely eating at least two, maybe three warm sandwiches to get out of this mess, and the fact that most of the guys they'd ideally prefer to move have full NTCs definitely doesn't help them.

It's a mess, but Tampa maybe still has a few small points in their favor:

- Neither Sergachev nor Cirelli had arbitration rights so their only leverage is either signing an offer sheet (which other teams are shy about) or holding out. They also just won a Stanley Cup, and there's no state income tax in Florida. I could see both taking hometown discounts.

- Besides Johnson, Tampa doesn't really have any contracts that flat out suck IMO. Their problem isn't that they signed a lot of bad contracts; their problem is that they just have too many good players. So while I agree that there is no magical salary cap fairy coming to save them (nor should there be), I do feel that there's still potentially a market for some of these other $4m-$6m vets, especially if they have to give up almost nothing to get them. But yeah, those NTCs are definitely a problem.

In your original scenario, Tampa loses Johnson, Cirelli, Coburn, and Pacquette while getting essentially nothing in return (two late-round picks and "future considerations."). If "essentially nothing" is the best Tampa can hope for (and it probably is), I think I would still pursue every possible avenue to eject, say, Killorn and one of Gourde, Palat, or Johnson without giving up Cirelli, even if they have to pay, say, a late first-rounder or something to grease the skids. Maybe even put, say, Palat on waivers and see if you get a bite.

And even if they do end up having to trade Cirelli, trade him straight up instead of packaged alongside Tyler Johnson's carcass so you can actually get a good pick and maybe a top prospect back.

But yeah, who knows. Tampa is in all kinds of pain right now so they might not have a choice. I definitely don't hate your trade scenario and Tampa may not have many better choices depending on how things shake out.

Time is running out for Tampa. Cap space will be eaten up by remaining free agents. Teams have internal caps where they don't even spend to the ceiling. Which teams can take Tyler Johnson's 5 mil AAV for the next 4 years?

Where is this magical salary cap fairy coming from to help Tampa out? I'd like to know. Teams likely have presented offer sheets to Sergachev, Cirelli and Cernak. But the player still has to sign it. None of these players want to leave Tampa.

Does Brisebois trade for a zombie contract like Zetterberg to LTIR his way out? Like the Leafs did when they traded for Horton and Clarkson so they could re-sign (overpay) Marner?

Do they LTIR Stamkos? He'll be healthy eventually. Johnson, Killorn, Palat, Gourde, McDonagh all have NTC's. I don't see how Brisebois weasels his way out of this without eating a warm sandwich. Something has to give here.

I wouldn't want to give up next year's first. That's why I don't want Stevie to offer sheet Sergachev or Cirelli.
- gergeswillems

Well the Wings could offer sheet Cirelli to a contract of $4,363,095 or under and it would only cost a 2nd round pick. Tampa would likely match but then would be over the cap. If the Wings weren't a lottery team they could then offer sheet Sergachev to a 6 or 7 mil a year contract and unless they moved money out, Tampa wouldn't be allowed to match i don't think since that would put them over the 10% of cap over in the off-season.

Well the Wings could offer sheet Cirelli to a contract of $4,363,095 or under and it would only cost a 2nd round pick. Tampa would likely match but then would be over the cap. If the Wings weren't a lottery team they could then offer sheet Sergachev to a 6 or 7 mil a year contract and unless they moved money out, Tampa wouldn't be allowed to match i don't think since that would put them over the 10% of cap over in the off-season.
- dcz28

Good idea in theory, but I don't think Cirelli would sign an offer sheet with Detroit at that price.

Good idea in theory, but I don't think Cirelli would sign an offer sheet with Detroit at that price.
- Sven22

I have no idea what kind of salary he wants. I just wouldn't want the Wings to offer anything that costs them their 1st really. A team like the Avs (before they spent a bunch of cap space and traded for Toews) would have been in perfect position to offer sheet Sergachev. Their picks would have been late picks and they had the cap space and need for a good young left handed dman.

I will be doing the write up for Detroit soon for the Seattle bloggers expansion draft. Not that there’s any hard decisions to make but just want to crowd source some protection lists. Who would you guys protect?

Ok so I was messing around cap Friendly and think I've solved Tampa's Cap hell and made Detroit and the Rangers better.

Tampa trades Tyler Johnson and Anthony Cirelli to Detroit for future considerations.

Detroit then trades Tyler Johnson with 50% retained to the Rangers for a 5th round pick.

Tampa likely trades Pacquette and Coburn for 6th and 7th round picks to become Cap compliant. They keep Killorn and their 1st round pick and don't lose a top prospect. Brisebois can then sign Sergachev and Cernak to bridge deals.

Tampa does lose 2C Cirelli but they can easily slide Stamkos back to 2C.

Rangers get a decent 3C in Johnson for the next 2 years. If his play falls off a cliff they can always buy him out. 2.5 mil AAV for a 3C is decent. TJ would definitely waive his NTC for the Rangers. Zibanajed, Strome, Johnson down the middle is good.

Yzerman essentially buys himself a 23 year deal old legit 2C for the next decade. Larkin finally gets some help at C. Stevie can pay 2.5 mil AAV of TJ's contract for 4 years. He has even more cap space coming off the books this trade deadline/summer.

By the time TJ's 2.5 mil AAV is up Detroit should be a playoff team if we draft well.

Yzerman can sign RFA Cirelli to a bridge deal or lock him up long term.

It's a win/win/win for all 3 teams. Thoughts?
- gergeswillems

I like this scenario. Let's do it!