staying quiet regarding the Tampa stuff....Zito did a killer job adding...
- Eklund

But they have not stayed quiet. The league has had multiple teams complain and have said they will be scrutinizing all player activations for the playoffs.

If either of them are health at this moment and still on LTIR, then they are breaking the rules.
- r8edr

This. And the league IS investigating this. They want to be sure healthy players are added when healthy and not sitting for cap purposes.

This unfairly could punish legit injured players oreven push them to come back before healing. League should have an independent medical staff evaluation. If the say person good to play but team says no... they couldn’t towards the cap.
- ChrisMS

If what you mean is that if the independent doctor/medical team deems them healthy enough to play then they cannot be on LTIR then I agree ... and I would suggest regular examinations be mandatory once a player has been on LTIR for 15 games or 36 days ... and every 21 days thereafter ... in tha last 15 games/24 days of a season require an immediate independent examination to qualify for LTIR ...

BUT, to make the system more workable, do not require teams to reabsorb the entire cap hit, including that for the period on LTIR, if a player returns in the regular season ... just the cap hit for the games the player has played and for the remainder of the season ... assuming the LTIR is legit

If they are healthy and Tampa still has regular season games left then they should play in the last game or would that mess up their cap so miraculously will be fine for game 1 of the playoffs?

After asking around and doing some reading up, it seems pretty simple. The problem is contained in the CBA. The way LTIR and the cap rules are written, Tampa is not doing anything illegal. If we don't like the rules, then change them. The question should be : why aren't other GM's doing this? (spoiler alert : some are)

As for state income taxes, it's not an issue nor should it be. Taxes are paid based on where the income is earned. Since games are played in multiple states and two countries, it becomes a complicated mess. Depending on the locality and how the individual's contract is structured, the tax difference could be major or it could be a non-factor.

Nothing shady is going on with the doctors or Kuch. Kuch probably wants back on the ice ASAP. The doctors will clear him when they feel he is ready. He is obviously close to returning but is still in a no-contact skating phase.

Stamkos, well, he's a glass cannon. Nothing untoward going on there. He'll probably stumble on the way out of the weight room and injure himself.

After asking around and doing some reading up, it seems pretty simple. The problem is contained in the CBA. The way LTIR and the cap rules are written, Tampa is not doing anything illegal. If we don't like the rules, then change them. The question should be : why aren't other GM's doing this? (spoiler alert : some are)

As for state income taxes, it's not an issue nor should it be. Taxes are paid based on where the income is earned. Since games are played in multiple states and two countries, it becomes a complicated mess. Depending on the locality and how the individual's contract is structured, the tax difference could be major or it could be a non-factor.

Nothing shady is going on with the doctors or Kuch. Kuch probably wants back on the ice ASAP. The doctors will clear him when they feel he is ready. He is obviously close to returning but is still in a no-contact skating phase.

Stamkos, well, he's a glass cannon. Nothing untoward going on there. He'll probably stumble on the way out of the weight room and injure himself.
- GalacticStone

If players are healthy and not on the roster for cap purposes, then yes they are breaking the rules of the CBA.

bro, after the Rangers public statement debacle, you think GM's/front offices are gonna call out anyone?
- Eklblad

You dont play reg season you dont play playoffs. Should be as simple as that
- Shynes57

NO

Wholeheartedly agree. In fact, you should have to play a % (10?) of regular season games to make it more legit.
- mjones242

NO

Meanwhile, Toronto over here with Freddie Amderson all hunched up, whispering, "Nothing to see here. Look away..."
- GrimmdaGoalie

Shut up, he's playing in the AHL right now.

Point had hip surgery in May on his hips and returned 5 months later. Kuch had surgery end of December and is returning 5 months later. Please people stop letting Kuch live in your heads lol

I like this idea alot
- Eklund

No, SMH! Quit instigating.

After asking around and doing some reading up, it seems pretty simple. The problem is contained in the CBA. The way LTIR and the cap rules are written, Tampa is not doing anything illegal. If we don't like the rules, then change them. The question should be : why aren't other GM's doing this? (spoiler alert : some are)

As for state income taxes, it's not an issue nor should it be. Taxes are paid based on where the income is earned. Since games are played in multiple states and two countries, it becomes a complicated mess. Depending on the locality and how the individual's contract is structured, the tax difference could be major or it could be a non-factor.

Nothing shady is going on with the doctors or Kuch. Kuch probably wants back on the ice ASAP. The doctors will clear him when they feel he is ready. He is obviously close to returning but is still in a no-contact skating phase.

Stamkos, well, he's a glass cannon. Nothing untoward going on there. He'll probably stumble on the way out of the weight room and injure himself.
- GalacticStone

Nothing illegal? Healthy players on LTIR is illegal.

Vancouver played by the rules when they signed Luongo to a 12 year contract. The NHL approved the contract then years later decided it was unfair and they now have a 3 year re-capture penalty of ~3M/year. Unfortunately Luongo didn't have a career ending "mystery" injury like every other player with a similar contract...i.e. Hossa, Pronger, Seabrook, Zetterberg etc.

Tampa flaunting the rules could be "fixed" retroactively just like the NHL did against Vancouver.
- smkuchta

Vancouver was screwed, agree completely.

Point had hip surgery in May on his hips and returned 5 months later. Kuch had surgery end of December and is returning 5 months later. Please people stop letting Kuch live in your heads lol
- Justbecause

He had hip surgery on his hips? It’s a good thing he didn’t have hip surgery on his shoulder. That would have been awkward.

I think an investigation needs to be done. Pretty sure it's not legal to have someone that isn't injured on the LTIR. If they find that Tampa did something wrong they should punish them accordingly. using this type of "tricky tactic" a team could simply put a player on the LTIR rather than buy them out.
- eagleputter

Somewhere on Robidas island Lupul is quietly counting his millions with Hossa. This isn't even the first, second, tenth (?) time we've seen LTIR used in a way that frankly, stinks. Just like inconsistent suspensions and make up calls, there's nothing to see here though?

He had hip surgery on his hips? It’s a good thing he didn’t have hip surgery on his shoulder. That would have been awkward.
- bloatedmosquito

Nice lol. No answer for what I’m saying though. So I guess Kuch is livin in your head. There is no story here. Move on people lmfao 🤪

If what you mean is that if the independent doctor/medical team deems them healthy enough to play then they cannot be on LTIR then I agree ... and I would suggest regular examinations be mandatory once a player has been on LTIR for 15 games or 36 days ... and every 21 days thereafter ... in tha last 15 games/24 days of a season require an immediate independent examination to qualify for LTIR ...
- ght120

The PA does not and will never allow the league to independently examine players. However, the insurance providers have occasionally denied questionable claims. This is where the door opens for the league to investigate. The Hossa and Lupul incidents in 2017 were fine examples.

Each year almost every team manipulates the duration of player's injuries to circumvent the cap. This is why players rarely are on injury leave for 8 or 9 games. Injuries of this length are almost always extended to 10 games (or 24 days), which is the minimum for LTIR.

Additionally, a number of teams do what Tampa is doing, extending injuries until the end of the season to allow for deadline acquisitions. A few teams do this every year. There is little the league can do. The teams do not care and the PA won't accept any of the proposed changes I've seen posted elsewhere in this thread.

Yeah good luck. I’m still waiting to hear what rules the Devils broke when they fined them for the Kovalchuck debacle.

This is all just another example of why the league is a joke...
- Queenie_5_hole

Hey, beat me to it. All these people saying “they didn’t break any rules” as if that’s a necessary part of it. League comes down hard on teams when they want, frequently based off of optics. Holding out Kuch for the entire season honestly seems far more brazen to me than Kovy’s front-loaded contract, but it seems more likely that Kuch gets applauded by the league for his impressive recovery than that the team is held accountable.

All the clickbait for no reason. There is no story here

After asking around and doing some reading up, it seems pretty simple. The problem is contained in the CBA. The way LTIR and the cap rules are written, Tampa is not doing anything illegal. If we don't like the rules, then change them. The question should be : why aren't other GM's doing this? (spoiler alert : some are)

As for state income taxes, it's not an issue nor should it be. Taxes are paid based on where the income is earned. Since games are played in multiple states and two countries, it becomes a complicated mess. Depending on the locality and how the individual's contract is structured, the tax difference could be major or it could be a non-factor.

Nothing shady is going on with the doctors or Kuch. Kuch probably wants back on the ice ASAP. The doctors will clear him when they feel he is ready. He is obviously close to returning but is still in a no-contact skating phase.

Stamkos, well, he's a glass cannon. Nothing untoward going on there. He'll probably stumble on the way out of the weight room and injure himself.
- GalacticStone

The CBA purposely includes a catch-all phrase that says any attempt to circumvent the cap isn’t allowed.

What the Bolts are doing clearly is cap circumvention.

Fair? Sure, but it’s just another example of how bush-league the NHL is.
- bloatedmosquito

This.

Between the DoPS, the refereeing, the ridiculous cap circumvention, and inequitable salary cap (taxes), the league is a joke.

Point had hip surgery in May on his hips and returned 5 months later. Kuch had surgery end of December and is returning 5 months later. Please people stop letting Kuch live in your heads lol
- Justbecause

So he returned in October.

Yeah, I think Kucherov has been skating for what, 2 months now.

Meanwhile, Toronto over here with Freddie Amderson all hunched up, whispering, "Nothing to see here. Look away..."
- GrimmdaGoalie

Yeah, uh, the guy was playing horribly and having problems with lateral movement. The problem was their backup was injured also. When Campbell was healthy, Andersen was taken out of the lineup.

So you are saying an injured goalie part way through a season is put on LTIR is the same thing as doing nothing to address your cap problems and then as soon as the schedule is announced, you schedule minor hip surgery to take 10 million off your cap then you let him condition for weeks to get ready for the playoffs when he magically returns all healthy and rested.

You are equating those scenarios?

He had hip surgery on his hips? It’s a good thing he didn’t have hip surgery on his shoulder. That would have been awkward.
- bloatedmosquito

I am not sure it would have been successful.