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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Wrap: Flyers Win Season Finale; Exit Day
Author Message
Glak18
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: "It's pretty big loogie on my face, so I was pretty psssted".", PA
Joined: 06.26.2007

May 11 @ 8:42 AM ET
Let’s hope Fletch is shrewd, smart, creative and a little lucky in the offseason.
As far as players I would look to move in no particular order.
Jake- most likely wishful thinking unless they eat some salary. Sure he gets points but he also makes far to many bad plays and decisions.
NAK- to many penalties and he doesn’t bring enough otherwise to make up for it.

Patrick- I wouldn’t open shop him yet but in exit interviews I would remind him he was a number two pick. His season was not acceptable. He has to earn a spot on the team next year. With that being said if the deal is right I would include him in a trade package if needed to close out a deal.it would have to be for an already youngish proven player.

- bird_dog_pa


I will never understand why a player's draft position is brought up so much. I understand in theory the higher the player selected the better they should be or maybe higher expectations, but the FLYERS picked Patrick at #2. Patrick has zero control over where he is picked. Patrick should remind the Flyers they selected HIM.

Now if Patrick signed a new deal worth tons of money then I would fully agree with you, but how they deal with him is 100% on the Flyers.

Again if your argument was "We pay you X amount of money and we expect more from you!" then that is completely logical.
ClaudeFather
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: west haven, CT
Joined: 08.14.2015

May 11 @ 8:49 AM ET
We didn't "waste years" under Hexy. We had no draft picks and were up against the cap ceiling. Ed Snyder was still alive and there was no way to go full tank. Hexy did the best he could with a real crappy hand. NoPa hasn't panned out yet...but the kid is 22. Maybe there is still hope he puts it together this off season and is a solid middle 6 guy. Heck it has taken like 7 years for Laughts to find his role.

There is still a lot of good on this team that happened on Hexy's watch. If he doesn't move Schenn there is no Farabee. Still lots of good prospects coming along too. The mix of vets doesn't quite work, but that is on the current management to get right. JVR is earning his money right now. Hayes, not so much this year. This really falls on Fletcher, because without Hexy, there really would not have been many moves to make. We have some young and tradeable talent, it is only there because of Hexy and the moves he made to get more picks, not trading them away on rentals.

- JW98FlyerFan

Those years did this organization no favors, we had no realistic shot of winning anything during the time frame and his draft picks have turned into a bunch of question marks.
hereticpride
New Jersey Devils
Location: HEY. Does this pole still work?, NJ
Joined: 01.14.2011

May 11 @ 8:51 AM ET
We didn't "waste years" under Hexy. We had no draft picks and were up against the cap ceiling. Ed Snyder was still alive and there was no way to go full tank. Hexy did the best he could with a real crappy hand. NoPa hasn't panned out yet...but the kid is 22. Maybe there is still hope he puts it together this off season and is a solid middle 6 guy. Heck it has taken like 7 years for Laughts to find his role.

There is still a lot of good on this team that happened on Hexy's watch. If he doesn't move Schenn there is no Farabee. Still lots of good prospects coming along too. The mix of vets doesn't quite work, but that is on the current management to get right. JVR is earning his money right now. Hayes, not so much this year. This really falls on Fletcher, because without Hexy, there really would not have been many moves to make. We have some young and tradeable talent, it is only there because of Hexy and the moves he made to get more picks, not trading them away on rentals.

- JW98FlyerFan

Hextall did nothing but draft decently and kick the can down the road wasting years of core players prime on subpar rosters. You gotta separate the player from the GM.
matman31
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: In Cognito
Joined: 12.14.2005

May 11 @ 8:59 AM ET
From Carchidi's column this morning:
I am in no mood for lies and excuses to be honest. If I am Scott and AV even utters the word Covid or Practice later this week to explain this season, I fire him on the spot. Every team in this league had to deal with Covid and tough schedules. There is much more going on here than this, and I sincerely hope he is as honest about it as he can be.

- jd250

Yes, this would piss me off to no end!
SuperSchennBros
Location: Not protected by the Mods...I mean Mob. Take your best shot!
Joined: 09.01.2012

May 11 @ 9:00 AM ET
We all know the reason this roster sucks is lack of talent. I really don’t expect AV to come out and say that publicly. I’m sure he and Chuck have had that conversation already.
- hereticpride

Oh wow, he said this?
StepfordSam
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 02.06.2017

May 11 @ 9:03 AM ET
Plenty of talent on this roster and plenty of promising young players. The player mix/core needs to be tweaked, not smashed.
cdearth23
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Wilkes-Barre, PA
Joined: 08.06.2015

May 11 @ 9:04 AM ET
On days like this and after seasons like this, I am reminded that BOTH Schenn brothers have won the Stanley Cup...

Big off season. I hope this burns inside the players coming back and they work their asses off this summer. As for moves, I'm interested to see how it shakes out.

Happy golfing, boys!

Sucks!
MBFlyerfan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Be nice from now on, NJ
Joined: 03.17.2006

May 11 @ 9:04 AM ET
Here is what I would say to Nolan Patrick if I were Fletch and AV.....

Ok kid you got through the season, took a few shots to the head and it seems like we have your migraines under control. This off season we will be qualifying you to a one year deal.

We know you are a talented player. This offseason we need you to train hard and be ready to come in to training camp and be the player you are supposed to be. Its time to stop worrying about what may happen and start being Nolan (frank)ing Patrick, that player who was a consensus top pick from the time he was 15 years old. You have the size, you have the skill, and you have the ability to play in this league.

We will be behind you 100% in whatever you need from the organization to get your mindset correct. Next season we expect, we demand, that you start to make a concerted effort to have an impact on every single game. every single shift. We can not have a player of your talent being a perimeter player who expects the game to come to him. We will need a more physical, aggressive player from the opening whistle of game one to the final whistle of whatever game we play. We believe that with that mindset, your success will come.

See you in training camp.
aantny88
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Suck it Phaneuf, PA
Joined: 03.14.2008

May 11 @ 9:07 AM ET
Were the Flyers effected by Covid significantly more than other teams? In the Lake Tahoe game the Flyers for sure were impacted with 6 regular forwards out, but when else?
- jd250


I didn't state the Flyers were more or less effected than other teams by COVID. If you read what I wrote, I indicated some teams were more effected than others, such as Vancouver, and it is very difficult to measure/quantify the impact it may have had. I also mentioned it was NOT a legitimate excuse for how the Flyers performed after the first month of the season.
aantny88
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Suck it Phaneuf, PA
Joined: 03.14.2008

May 11 @ 9:09 AM ET
Plenty of talent on this roster and plenty of promising young players. The player mix/core needs to be tweaked, not smashed.
- StepfordSam


Not good enough for many posters on this board . They're blow it up, tank and pray we get a generational player, because that's worked so well for countless other organizations!
ClaudeFather
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: west haven, CT
Joined: 08.14.2015

May 11 @ 9:09 AM ET
I didn't state the Flyers were more or less effected than other teams by COVID. If you read what I wrote, I indicated some teams were more effected than others, such as Vancouver, and it is very difficult to measure/quantify the impact it may have had. I also mentioned it was NOT a legitimate excuse for how the Flyers performed after the first month of the season.
- aantny88

Then why even post this? It doesn’t matter, it’s not a valid excuse.
Tomahawk
Ottawa Senators
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner bandwagon. Grab 'em by the Corsi.
Joined: 02.04.2009

May 11 @ 9:14 AM ET
Every team in this league had to deal with Covid and tough schedules.

This isn't an accurate statement. Did every team have a condensed schedule due to playing 56 games in a short amount of time? Absolutely! Did every team have players infected with COVID, have to shut down and reschedule games/play extremely shorthanded? No, they didn't. Some had it significantly worse (Vancouver) than other teams. Is it an appropriate excuse for the way the Flyers played down the stretch? Not so much.

- aantny88



StepfordSam
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 02.06.2017

May 11 @ 9:15 AM ET
Not good enough for many posters on this board . They're blow it up, tank and pray we get a generational player, because that's worked so well for countless other organizations!

- aantny88


I understand the frustration. I'm on the record saying Hextall should've tweaked the core when he took over, but instead opted for a rebuild on the fly while competing approach that was most likely mandated by management. As management was keenly aware, this was going to take a TON of time. I was fully on board with how Hextall did things after that.

The question now becomes, when is the appropriate time to push the chips all in on competing? Dave Scott wants them to be a cap team, that's why Hextall was fired and Fletcher brought in. Has Fletcher made any moves that gives them the push needed to become playoff bubble team to legit Stanley Cup contender?

No, and this puts the Flyers in the worst position possible which is where they are now, no man's land. Not good enough to contend for several years while being up against the cap. Fletcher has his work cut out for him this summer and the bean counter will be over his shoulder, making sure all resources are maximized.

Get your popcorn ready.
Ftown19125
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 09.17.2013

May 11 @ 9:17 AM ET
Plenty of talent on this roster and plenty of promising young players. The player mix/core needs to be tweaked, not smashed.
- StepfordSam


I'm with this. They do have to add a top 2 D-man in my opinion. And if they lose JVR in the draft, that's going to hurt as well, especially the way he played this season. They'll need some of the younger guys to step up too, like Frost and Patrick.
Peter Richards
Season Ticket Holder
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 08.24.2019

May 11 @ 9:18 AM ET
I will never understand why a player's draft position is brought up so much. I understand in theory the higher the player selected the better they should be or maybe higher expectations, but the FLYERS picked Patrick at #2. Patrick has zero control over where he is picked. Patrick should remind the Flyers they selected HIM.

Now if Patrick signed a new deal worth tons of money then I would fully agree with you, but how they deal with him is 100% on the Flyers.

Again if your argument was "We pay you X amount of money and we expect more from you!" then that is completely logical.

- Glak18


Yeah. Different players develop at different rates. The couple in the issues he dealt with and time missed. No reason to throw him away yet.
ClaudeFather
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: west haven, CT
Joined: 08.14.2015

May 11 @ 9:19 AM ET
I'm with this. They do have to add a top 2 D-man in my opinion. And if they lose JVR in the draft, that's going to hurt as well, especially the way he played this season. They'll need some of the younger guys to step up too, like Frost and Patrick.
- Ftown19125

The young guys are the problem, outside of Farabee, not one of them had a good season.
Peter Richards
Season Ticket Holder
Philadelphia Flyers
Joined: 08.24.2019

May 11 @ 9:19 AM ET
Here is what I would say to Nolan Patrick if I were Fletch and AV.....

Ok kid you got through the season, took a few shots to the head and it seems like we have your migraines under control. This off season we will be qualifying you to a one year deal.

We know you are a talented player. This offseason we need you to train hard and be ready to come in to training camp and be the player you are supposed to be. Its time to stop worrying about what may happen and start being Nolan (frank)ing Patrick, that player who was a consensus top pick from the time he was 15 years old. You have the size, you have the skill, and you have the ability to play in this league.

We will be behind you 100% in whatever you need from the organization to get your mindset correct. Next season we expect, we demand, that you start to make a concerted effort to have an impact on every single game. every single shift. We can not have a player of your talent being a perimeter player who expects the game to come to him. We will need a more physical, aggressive player from the opening whistle of game one to the final whistle of whatever game we play. We believe that with that mindset, your success will come.

See you in training camp.

- MBFlyerfan


Yes.
CRUSH IT LIKE ME
Location: Give me 20 of Kunitz vs 20 girouxs
Joined: 04.25.2021

May 11 @ 9:19 AM ET
We didn't "waste years" under Hexy. We had no draft picks and were up against the cap ceiling. Ed Snyder was still alive and there was no way to go full tank. Hexy did the best he could with a real crappy hand. NoPa hasn't panned out yet...but the kid is 22. Maybe there is still hope he puts it together this off season and is a solid middle 6 guy. Heck it has taken like 7 years for Laughts to find his role.

There is still a lot of good on this team that happened on Hexy's watch. If he doesn't move Schenn there is no Farabee. Still lots of good prospects coming along too. The mix of vets doesn't quite work, but that is on the current management to get right. JVR is earning his money right now. Hayes, not so much this year. This really falls on Fletcher, because without Hexy, there really would not have been many moves to make. We have some young and tradeable talent, it is only there because of Hexy and the moves he made to get more picks, not trading them away on rentals.

- JW98FlyerFan



ty....post more often
Just5
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 05.22.2008

May 11 @ 9:20 AM ET
Im tired of this group but you just know they’re going to contend for a division title next year
Big_E_88
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Wilmington, DE
Joined: 01.17.2014

May 11 @ 9:21 AM ET
Plenty of talent on this roster and plenty of promising young players. The player mix/core needs to be tweaked, not smashed.
- StepfordSam


Is there enough talent to be much better than they showed this year? Yes, I think so. Is there enough talent to be a legit contender? No, I don't think so. But that's not going to be fixed in one offseason.
I mostly agree with your second sentence. Thing is, tweaking is nearly impossible without cap space. So although the roster may not need to be smashed, a couple of major moves are in order. At least one of the big contracts must go if any material moves are going to be made. I think most of us agree that a solid, right side, top pairing Dman is desperately needed, and they are expensive. I don't see how they can trade for or sign one of those without a major move or two.
matman31
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: In Cognito
Joined: 12.14.2005

May 11 @ 9:21 AM ET
Not good enough for many posters on this board . They're blow it up, tank and pray we get a generational player, because that's worked so well for countless other organizations!

- aantny88

TBH...I'm blow it up because this team has a seriously engrained culture that allows for not showing up and giving their best effort. That is a serious DNA flaw and it needs to be excised from this organization to allow any of these young players to reach their potential
Tomahawk
Ottawa Senators
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner bandwagon. Grab 'em by the Corsi.
Joined: 02.04.2009

May 11 @ 9:21 AM ET
We didn't "waste years" under Hexy. We had no draft picks and were up against the cap ceiling. Ed Snyder was still alive and there was no way to go full tank. Hexy did the best he could with a real crappy hand. NoPa hasn't panned out yet...but the kid is 22. Maybe there is still hope he puts it together this off season and is a solid middle 6 guy. Heck it has taken like 7 years for Laughts to find his role.

There is still a lot of good on this team that happened on Hexy's watch. If he doesn't move Schenn there is no Farabee. Still lots of good prospects coming along too. The mix of vets doesn't quite work, but that is on the current management to get right. JVR is earning his money right now. Hayes, not so much this year. This really falls on Fletcher, because without Hexy, there really would not have been many moves to make. We have some young and tradeable talent, it is only there because of Hexy and the moves he made to get more picks, not trading them away on rentals.

- JW98FlyerFan


StepfordSam
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 02.06.2017

May 11 @ 9:23 AM ET
Is there enough talent to be much better than they showed this year? Yes, I think so. Is there enough talent to be a legit contender? No, I don't think so. But that's not going to be fixed in one offseason.
I mostly agree with your second sentence. Thing is, tweaking is nearly impossible without cap space. So although the roster may not need to be smashed, a couple of major moves are in order. At least one of the big contracts must go if any material moves are going to be made. I think most of us agree that a solid, right side, top pairing Dman is desperately needed, and they are expensive. I don't see how they can trade for or sign one of those without a major move or two.

- Big_E_88


Yeah, this is the problem with being a cap team and not a legit contender.
ClaudeFather
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: west haven, CT
Joined: 08.14.2015

May 11 @ 9:25 AM ET

- Tomahawk

The fact that people are all over that post is ridiculous, the guy drafted middling talent and we are stuck in no mans land. His best pick was Provorov, who in his fifth season has regressed which is very troubling. The top 10 of Provys draft was can’t miss as well outside of Zacha and a ton of talent after the top 10. I’ll give him the TK pick.
aantny88
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Suck it Phaneuf, PA
Joined: 03.14.2008

May 11 @ 9:26 AM ET
I understand the frustration. I'm on the record saying Hextall should've tweaked the core when he took over, but instead opted for a rebuild on the fly while competing approach that was most likely mandated by management. As management was keenly aware, this was going to take a TON of time. I was fully on board with how Hextall did things after that.

The question now becomes, when is the appropriate time to push the chips all in on competing? Dave Scott wants them to be a cap team, that's why Hextall was fired and Fletcher brought in. Has Fletcher made any moves that gives them the push needed to become playoff bubble team to legit Stanley Cup contender?

No, and this puts the Flyers in the worst position possible which is where they are now, no man's land. Not good enough to contend for several years while being up against the cap. Fletcher has his work cut out for him this summer and the bean counter will be over his shoulder, making sure all resources are maximized.

Get your popcorn ready.

- StepfordSam


Last season, it seemed like Fletcher was pushing all the right buttons. Losing Niskanen to retirement and sandpaper players like Pitlick in the offseason didn't help and he didn't address those needs. I don't believe anyone would have guessed so many players would have regressed this season, especially Hart. It's definitely going to be interesting this offseason with the expansion draft, the draft and free agency to see what they do. There's a lot of talent, but I would agree with CF assessment that the mix is wrong. I'll even go so far as to state that I don't believe Provorov is a true #1 defenseman.
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