Here’s the serious question… do you see coots is the 1c for life of contract? If so with the cap ramifications taken into account fine.

If you don’t see coots as the 1c for the life of the contract or many reasons age skill decline etc then you can’t sign the deal for cap ramifications.
- Stayin alive

what if couts signs a 5 year deal, then wants to go year to year. All this speculation on his contracts is .....speculation. Lets argue after he signs it.

my hope is victor soderstrom. But then we'll hear that provy needs a vet beside him because he cant carry a line
- bradster

I like it. Plays the long game. Plus we can then afford a vet for the second pairing if need be. (I think needs be.)

Lots of options are great so long as a decision is made and the Provy pairing partner is acquired.

Here’s the serious question… do you see coots is the 1c for life of contract? If so with the cap ramifications taken into account fine.

If you don’t see coots as the 1c for the life of the contract or many reasons age skill decline etc then you can’t sign the deal for cap ramifications.
- Stayin alive

I see Couts as a top 6 forward for the life of his next deal. I don't think its valuable to look at it based on 1C versus 2C, since both play tons of minutes of are invaluable to team success.

I have repeatedly stated that I don't blame Hextall with the information he had at the time for the selection of Patrick. One poster repeatedly claims in a bout of fantasy that I stated in the past that a pre draft history of migraines report existed concerning Patrick. If that was true, then wouldn't I find fault in Hextall's selection of Patrick? Also as a long time member of HB, anyone who knows and reads my posts is that I don't get involved in talking about prospects and their potential before they are drafted. I don't invest any time nor have any knowledge whatsoever on junior level players. I could not tell you who the projected top picks are in the upcoming draft. So for the final time, we can put this fantasy claim from a poster who is repeatedly inaccurate to bed. No further comment will be made.
- MJL

You can talk your sh$t all you want. We both know you claimed there were reports pre draft as you were defending flyers brass. I would go back and research yo copy and paste the many times you said they existed because the flyers brass claimed they were there. Although again no one could find not 1 pre draft article. But it would be a waste of time because you you’d try your normal twist that you do with everything. I get much enjoyment because I know you know.

I ask because he thinks Marchand is one.

Both the same age, drafted the same year. Both every productive. Giroux 858 points in 943 games, Marchand 715 points in 804 games.
- MBFlyerfan

what does that mean? that if you think Marchand is a HOFer then G has to be also?

what does that mean? that if you think Marchand is a HOFer then G has to be also?
- bradster

No, I think neither is. But it seems kind of arbitrary to anoint one and say the other isn't.

What do the odds and probabilities say?
- MJL

One of the many funny things about you, is that you use these terms to be irrelevant and esoteric for the world (when they are actually quite humdrum and commonplace) because you project from yourself.

😃

This coming from the same guy, who just a few weeks ago, asked why fans continue to use emotional metaphors for team loyalty when the nature of sports as a business has changed so much. Schizo much, amigo?
- PT21

I don't think the Flyers are quite married to me the same way they're married to their 1C lol. And from my end, I've never owned a pair of underoos in my life, much less Flyers underoos.

More to the point, here is the problem with your analogy. In the wife example, is there an ultimate goal you are failing to reach with that steadfast, loyal, devotion?

If so, frankly, it is time for a change, ruthless though it may sound.

If not, the comparison is not relevant.
- PT21

Yikes.

Fine, look at the odds of ALL the players who played his style of game and how it changed over the years. Don't cherry pick.

You dont know how things will turn out with Couts. When you dont know anything, what do you do? You look at comparables to gain an understanding of odds.

You will see the same trend.
- PT21

Totally agree. And sorry I gotta add 2 76 point seasons 3-4 years ago is it even worth the risk? If coots wasn’t on flyers would anyone be clamoring after this season he’s a guy we gotta get and give max term big $ too? Absolutely not because of the reason people are saying to trade him now age cap ramifications etc

Unreal and laughable the flyers fan are

i'm just here to say that you give Coots whatever it takes to make him stay

as for Giroux, I think he has one more multi-year contract in him, and then i think he'll go the route that Thornton took with SJ, re-upping for 1 year at a time at a cheap price to stay with a good team where he and his family are happy

Or it's more like staying with the wife you love and who loves you, makes your life livable, sticks with you thru thick and thin, instead of casting her aside because you think you may have a chance at bagging some younger/hotter tart off Tinder.

Hey, nothing ventured, nothing gained, maybe you'll end up with your perfect gal in the end.

Or you could spend the rest of your life waking up next to Nolan Patricks.

Who knows?
- Tomahawk

You obviously haven't been married for that long. Ha ha ha. Come talk to me after 30 years.

i'm just here to say that you give Coots whatever it takes to make him stay

as for Giroux, I think he has one more multi-year contract in him, and then i think he'll go the route that Thornton took with SJ, re-upping for 1 year at a time at a cheap price to stay with a good team where he and his family are happy
- Coburns_Nose

it doesn't need to be with a good team because "winning isn't a top priority for him."

Do you think Giroux is a Hall Of Famer?
- MBFlyerfan

Boarderline but no. I think case can be made he was a great player over a stretch but lacking cup or major awards I don’t think he gets in. Now if he were traded and won a cup maybe? Or maybe wins some type award lady byng? Just not a lot on resume for hall

The point us, they traded their best player, and lowered the odds of success in the near future while raising it in the longer future.

The fact that we are not bottom feeders is frankly unfortunate. Because it obscures the fact that the distance between bubble teams and cup is on average as large as distance between bottom feeders and cup
- PT21

The point is which seems to be going over your head is tanking doesnt work anymore..... You cant just finish last anymore. Pittsburgh picked Crosby, Malkin and Fleury with their 1st round pick in 3 straight years.

2003 - Fleury 1st overall
2004 - Malkin 2nd Overall
2005 - Crosby 1st Overall

Their 1st round Picks since:

J.Staal
A.Esposito
J.Morrow
Simon Depres
B.Bennett
D.Pouliot
O.Maatta
Kapanen

Not much to gloat about there. The best pick Was Kapanen and they traded him away before re acquiring him.


Again we have had the 1st overall pick in 2007 and we lost it. If the rules were the same as when PIT sucked, we would have had P.Kane. We dont because Tanking doesnt work anymore.

Boarderline but no. I think case can be made he was a great player over a stretch but lacking cup or major awards I don’t think he gets in. Now if he were traded and won a cup maybe? Or maybe wins some type award lady byng? Just not a lot on resume for hall
- Stayin alive

I agree. If he reaches 1000 points maybe it gooses up the possibility, but otherwise I agree.

Ok, lets take a look at the defending Stanley Cup champions Lightning, who will most likely be back there again, and look at where their top playoff performers were drafted:
Kucherov - 58th
Point - 79th
Stamkos - 1st
Killorn - 77th
Hedman - 2nd
Palat - 208th
Cernak - 43th
Cirelli - 72th
Coleman - 75th
Gourde - undrafted
Colton - 118th
McDonagh - 12th
Johnson - undrafted
Maroon - 161st
Sergachev - 9th
Vasilevskiy - 19th

So here you see only 2 players from the top 5 and 5 in the top 20. Please show me an example of a recent cup winner that has a different distribution that proves your case that in order for you to contend you must have a collection of top 5 or top 10 picks.
- jd250

To be fair. Gotta add vasy in that as he was top goalie projected that year and teams don’t generally even take goalies in round 1

So hedman..d
Vague…. G
Stamkos…1c(although maybe not 1c currently but a hall of famer)

3 absolute key positions that generally need elite talent at all were picked on top 5.

Kinda the point. Generally you need to pick there to up the chances

Do you think Marchand is a Hall of Famer?
- MBFlyerfan

Absolutely. Cups awards and stats the trifecta

I ask because he thinks Marchand is one.

Both the same age, drafted the same year. Both every productive. Giroux 858 points in 943 games, Marchand 715 points in 804 games.
- MBFlyerfan

Knew that was where you were going. G also played a more promo Nate role early in career. Who do you think retires with more points? What about points per game?


More importantly cup winner with major awards

what if couts signs a 5 year deal, then wants to go year to year. All this speculation on his contracts is .....speculation. Lets argue after he signs it.
- bradster

Hey I’m totally in for 5 year deal!!! Please. I’d love it. I’d even go 8.5-9mil

Unfortunately coming off his under pay contract he’s going for max term. Can’t blame him

You obviously haven't been married for that long. Ha ha ha. Come talk to me after 30 years.
- Dkos

Thankfully most NHL careers don't last that long

I see Couts as a top 6 forward for the life of his next deal. I don't think its valuable to look at it based on 1C versus 2C, since both play tons of minutes of are invaluable to team success.
- jd250

That’s fair enough. Assuming coots signs max term contract and assuming he’s be 2c around 34-35 do to probable skill decline I will do some research and see what that age group got in salary. So I’ll check for
2c
Age 34-35 and above
Salary
Point production

It will be interesting to see

Knew that was where you were going. G also played a more promo Nate role early in career. Who do you think retires with more points? What about points per game?


More importantly cup winner with major awards
- Stayin alive

Besides the one cup, which admittedly is pretty major, what major awards has Marchand won?

At the moment, Giroux has .91 p/pg, Marchand .89 p/pg

I think Giroux retires with more points. They are both the same age, so It is reasonable to assume they both have about the same amount of time left. Giroux has 143 more points than Marchand.

Besides the one cup, which admittedly is pretty major, what major awards has Marchand won?

At the moment, Giroux has .91 p/pg, Marchand .89 p/pg

I think Giroux retires with more points. They are both the same age, so It is reasonable to assume they both have about the same amount of time left. Giroux has 143 more points than Marchand.
- MBFlyerfan

just the cup i'm pretty sure. i don't see him as a HOFer. maybe if they win another cup and he keeps putting up points like he is.. i don't even know if that's enough though.

People dont want to move those assets however for the most part.
- hello it's me 2050

All I care is Fletcher is willing too.

so there is a probability some of the players bounce back or get better?
- wcorvette

For sure….how much ? Can’t answer that….no one can. I don’t even think the Flyers brass knows, or they would have done more to avoid last season.