I think you see JVR and Ghost gone.
- wcorvette

Yes, I think both have trade value, if JVR is not selected by Seattle. If I were Fletcher I would sweeten the deal as much as I could to get Seattle to take Jake, and then trade JVR and Ghost, even if I have to cover some salary. Then I sign a few FAs and bring up some younger players to fill in the roster, and see how the season goes. I want to know what I have in Frost, Allison, York and even Foerster if he is physically ready for an NHL season. Let them play with some better veteran leadership and then evaluate next off season. That would be my approach.

Yes, I think both have trade value, if JVR is not selected by Seattle. If I were Fletcher I would sweeten the deal as much as I could to get Seattle to take Jake, and then trade JVR and Ghost, even if I have to cover some salary. Then I sign a few FAs and bring up some younger players to fill in the roster, and see how the season goes. I want to know what I have in Frost, Allison, York and even Foerster if he is physically ready for an NHL season. Let them play with some better veteran leadership and then evaluate next off season. That would be my approach.
- jd250

Thank god you have nothing to do with the team. Them both having trade value in your eyes says all we need to know.

I'm not concerned about the 30yo - 33/34 yo Couturier. I'm concerned about the 35yo-38yo version at possibly plus $10MM (which I do not believe is that far fetched). The cherry picked examples that were provided all had contracts ending at the player's 34-36 age year. Coututier's will end around 38. Plus you can only have so many mega contracts at a time. Plannng is critical in this area. I also do nt believe you sell your future for a run at a championship becasue Giroux is nearing the end of his career. He is a very good/great player that has also been extremely consistent as far as production goes, but he does not strike me as "winner"; he does not have the IT factor
- mr4tno

I'm pretty confident Couturier's new deal is going to be significantly lower than 10M

I think you see JVR and Ghost gone.
- wcorvette

capwise this would be ideal, so i don't think it's going to happen haha.

Yes, I think both have trade value, if JVR is not selected by Seattle. If I were Fletcher I would sweeten the deal as much as I could to get Seattle to take Jake, and then trade JVR and Ghost, even if I have to cover some salary. Then I sign a few FAs and bring up some younger players to fill in the roster, and see how the season goes. I want to know what I have in Frost, Allison, York and even Foerster if he is physically ready for an NHL season. Let them play with some better veteran leadership and then evaluate next off season. That would be my approach.
- jd250

I don't mind spending the assets to move either, as long as there is a plan to replace and improve. They should not waste assets unless they are sure they have the replacements. I would not sweeten on Jake, it would take to much. A 4th for JVR, should not have to but if your plan requires it, then do it. I dont see many teams taking on cap, maybe you can do a 3 way trade and have the Yotes or a Sens team hold some cap to make a deal work but it will be that difficult.

Its interesting to note Pittsburgh had Lemieux, Stevens, Recchi and Coffey but didn't have the ingredients necessary to win a cup until they traded Recchi for Tocchet and Samuelsson in 1992; then they won 2 cups. The Flyers had Lindros and Recchi but were not getting to the next level until they traded Recchi in 1995 and got Desjardin and LeClair., and then got to the finals in 1997. Unfortunately for the Flyers right now, there is no Lemieux or Lindros on their roster to build around. That is their number 1 issue IMO. I am not saying you need a generational talent, but you do need a strong core to build around, and that is what the Flyers lack. I agree the hope is they have to draft better than they did under Hextall and develop this core and build around it.
- jd250

Recchi won the Cup with Pittsburgh in 1991. Before he was traded to the Flyers.

Recchi won the Cup 3 times with 3 different teams.

Its interesting to note Pittsburgh had Lemieux, Stevens, Recchi and Coffey but didn't have the ingredients necessary to win a cup until they traded Recchi for Tocchet and Samuelsson in 1992; then they won 2 cups. The Flyers had Lindros and Recchi but were not getting to the next level until they traded Recchi in 1995 and got Desjardin and LeClair., and then got to the finals in 1997. Unfortunately for the Flyers right now, there is no Lemieux or Lindros on their roster to build around. That is their number 1 issue IMO. I am not saying you need a generational talent, but you do need a strong core to build around, and that is what the Flyers lack. I agree the hope is they have to draft better than they did under Hextall and develop this core and build around it.
- jd250

The Flyers have a strong future core to build around. However they do lack a skater with the potential to be a star player. Hart has the potential to be a top 5 NHL goalie. They drafted very well under Hextall. They just got very unlucky with Patrick.

Yes, I think both have trade value, if JVR is not selected by Seattle. If I were Fletcher I would sweeten the deal as much as I could to get Seattle to take Jake, and then trade JVR and Ghost, even if I have to cover some salary. Then I sign a few FAs and bring up some younger players to fill in the roster, and see how the season goes. I want to know what I have in Frost, Allison, York and even Foerster if he is physically ready for an NHL season. Let them play with some better veteran leadership and then evaluate next off season. That would be my approach.
- jd250

So you're willing to trade the 13th pick in the draft to get Seattle to take Voracek?

Ok, thanks for answering. I just wanted to get a clear answer from you.

I cant wait to see how the fanbase would react to this team trading Claude Giroux (at the deadline I would assume?) when they are in the playoff hunt.

That would truly be a remarkable thing to see. Especially if it was to another team in the playoff hunt.

Can you imagine Giroux waiving his NMC to do that? (I guess you could)



- MBFlyerfan

I was pretty clear when I said unless they are a cup contender. Cut and dry.

The fan base argument. This fan base has had it for the most part is my guess. Can't wait to see if attendance drops. They couldn't even sell out the 2500 this season.

No I cant imagine him waiving it. Will he if if they are meddling along? If he is the company guy he portrays then he should. I don't expect the flyers to even ask him. He will be given an extension before the dead line to make it a moot point is my take.

The Flyers have a strong future core to build around. However they do lack a skater with the potential to be a star player. Hart has the potential to be a top 5 NHL goalie. They drafted very well under Hextall. They just got very unlucky with Patrick.
- MJL

drafted very well is an extreme over statement. Out of all his 1st and 2nd round picks, which of those are performing better than where they were drafted, or on track to. Only using 1st and 2nd round pick because those have the biggest impacts.

The Flyers have a strong future core to build around. However they do lack a skater with the potential to be a star player. Hart has the potential to be a top 5 NHL goalie. They drafted very well under Hextall. They just got very unlucky with Patrick.
- MJL

How many other teams have a stronger future core? Do some research then report back with your rankings.

Lucky with this, unlucky with that. Hart also has the potential to flame out. Hope he found a new life coach.

How many other teams have a stronger future core? Do some research then report back with your rankings.

Lucky with this, unlucky with that. Hart also has the potential to flame out. Hope he found a new life coach.
- hello it's me 2050

this seems very objective.

Yes, I think both have trade value, if JVR is not selected by Seattle. If I were Fletcher I would sweeten the deal as much as I could to get Seattle to take Jake, and then trade JVR and Ghost, even if I have to cover some salary. Then I sign a few FAs and bring up some younger players to fill in the roster, and see how the season goes. I want to know what I have in Frost, Allison, York and even Foerster if he is physically ready for an NHL season. Let them play with some better veteran leadership and then evaluate next off season. That would be my approach.
- jd250

You think ex selke and the captain want to wait? Can the flyers afford to play them in the lineup to see what they have all while trying to win next season?

What is the plan? Will know in a few months.

I was pretty clear when I said unless they are a cup contender. Cut and dry.

The fan base argument. This fan base has had it for the most part is my guess. Can't wait to see if attendance drops. They couldn't even sell out the 2500 this season.

No I cant imagine him waiving it. Will he if if they are meddling along? If he is the company guy he portrays then he should. I don't expect the flyers to even ask him. He will be given an extension before the dead line to make it a moot point is my take.
- hello it's me 2050

Yeah you were. We both know they wont be a cup contender next season. But they could be in a strong playoff position. Trading Giroux in that position would be a PR nightmare.

Now, if they are out of it, I think the team should explore trade options. And as MJL said, that is the conundrum.

But, you and I absolutely know that there is no way they could or SHOULD trade him if they are going to make the playoffs.

Thank god you have nothing to do with the team. Them both having trade value in your eyes says all we need to know.
- ClaudeFather

What are you taking about? JVR has trade value, a PP specialist with only 2 years remaining on his deal. I think the Flyers can get something for him, presuming they are not already content with JVR being selected by Seattle. With Ghost, I think there is value for an offensive defenseman that can score 10+ goals in a season. Maybe not at his price with his defensive liabilities, which is why I would cover some salary if need be.

You think ex selke and the captain want to wait? Can the flyers afford to play them in the lineup to see what they have all while trying to win next season?

What is the plan? Will know in a few months.
- hello it's me 2050

I think they will be open to it if they understand a plan that leads to the team seriously contending very soon. You have to give these players a look to see what they are. If they turn out to be good NHL players, they either become the makings of a new, younger core, or valuable trade assets to that get you players ready to win now. Either way, they need a chance to play. One of the many things I didn't like about the coaching last year was even when it was clear the Flyers were not going to make the playoffs, AV refused to change up his PP personnel and give other players a chance to showcase what they can do.

What are you taking about? JVR has trade value, a PP specialist with only 2 years remaining on his deal. I think the Flyers can get something for him, presuming they are not already content with JVR being selected by Seattle. With Ghost, I think there is value for an offensive defenseman that can score 10+ goals in a season. Maybe not at his price with his defensive liabilities, which is why I would cover some salary if need be.
- jd250

No one wants jvr for two years at $7M, ghost you would be getting a crap contract back, is that value?if you are eating salary how does he have value?

Yeah you were. We both know they wont be a cup contender next season. But they could be in a strong playoff position. Trading Giroux in that position would be a PR nightmare.

Now, if they are out of it, I think the team should explore trade options. And as MJL said, that is the conundrum.

But, you and I absolutely know that there is no way they could or SHOULD trade him if they are going to make the playoffs.
- MBFlyerfan

Define what your strong playoff positon is. Top 4 in conference?

We disagree. If they are just going to make the playoffs I move him. It is about the future. Or it should be. They won't so it is a moot point.

If they are out of it there isn't any conundrum. It is really simple. You ask for a list of teams. The GM probably doesn't have the balls to ask however.

I am not saying that Couturier is in the same class of players as all-time greats such as Crosby or Ovechkin. He may not even be quite on par, year-in and year-out, as Bergeron. The point here is that shying away from re-signing a key player on your team solely because he's now in his late 20s is a defeatist and, quite frankly, illogical framework. These decisions must be made on a case-by-case basis.
- bmeltzer

Bergeron's career was almost over due to concussions at one point. Not many people remember that. Like Coots, he's been in the league since 18... ton of miles on him. Yet he's still dominating in his 30's.

The question isn't should they sign Coots or not.... it's basically a no-brainer if he's willing. The real question is how they plan to structure the deal. 8-years + NMC carries some enormous risks.

I think they will be open to it if they understand a plan that leads to the team seriously contending very soon. You have to give these players a look to see what they are. If they turn out to be good NHL players, they either become the makings of a new, younger core, or valuable trade assets to that get you players ready to win now. Either way, they need a chance to play. One of the many things I didn't like about the coaching last year was even when it was clear the Flyers were not going to make the playoffs, AV refused to change up his PP personnel and give other players a chance to showcase what they can do.
- jd250

yeah the same fn plan for the last decade. All while another years is wasted for those 2.

Yes the do need to play. With a veteran core in place what's the plan?

So you're willing to trade the 13th pick in the draft to get Seattle to take Voracek?
- MJL

If I were Fletcher I would be willing to go up to a 2nd round pick and even eat some salary, but not a 1st round pick and Jake unless I was getting something back, like a 2022 2nd rounder or their 1st in 2023 or 2024.

Define what your strong playoff positon is. Top 4 in conference?

We disagree. If they are just going to make the playoffs I move him. It is about the future. Or it should be. They won't so it is a moot point.

If they are out of it there isn't any conundrum. It is really simple. You ask for a list of teams. The GM probably doesn't have the balls to ask however.
- hello it's me 2050

OK, agree to disagree on this.

If I were Fletcher I would be willing to go up to a 2nd round pick and even eat some salary, but not a 1st round pick and Jake unless I was getting something back, like a 2022 2nd rounder or their 1st in 2023 or 2024.
- jd250

Your idea of trades is so off base it’s insane

Personally, I don't think Couturier will want to continue his relationship with the Flyers when they continue to slide down the NHL standings in the coming years. I say that because of the core of elderly players who management seems to want to continue to compete with against other teams.

...but he does not strike me as "winner"; he does not have the IT factor
- mr4tno

That same BS was levied at Hasek, Modano, Yzerman, OV, Bourque, Selanne, on down the line. Takes a team and a tremendous amount of luck to win the Cup.