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Forums :: Blog World :: Roger Mussa: Devils Protection List is out with no surprise, who do we lose?
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vlongo4419
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 07.31.2013

Jul 20 @ 12:18 PM ET
Montreal might have a spot open with Weber maybe out long term if he has surgery. Montreal love PK, he's got history there.

PK CANT replace Weber, but thats their problem =)

- Leniwm1


Haha i can definitely see it. I think Arizona would be a good spot too. If they move out guys like Kuemper, OEL, and Kessel like the rumors indicate theyre trying to do, they will need a lot of money to hit the cap floor and PK is perfect for them. 9M cap hit but only 2M real dollars owed, so thats intriguing for owners who dont want to spend any money. Maybe we make a deal to acquire Conor Garland and PK is in the deal going the other way
Leniwm1
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Joined: 02.24.2015

Jul 20 @ 12:23 PM ET
Haha i can definitely see it. I think Arizona would be a good spot too. If they move out guys like Kuemper, OEL, and Kessel like the rumors indicate theyre trying to do, they will need a lot of money to hit the cap floor and PK is perfect for them. 9M cap hit but only 2M real dollars owed, so thats intriguing for owners who dont want to spend any money. Maybe we make a deal to acquire Conor Garland and PK is in the deal going the other way
- vlongo4419


I'd love another mobile, big body guy. Graves, Bahl and another punishing tower would be so sweet. Oleskiak could be cool.
Pomegrant
New Jersey Devils
Location: NJ
Joined: 01.18.2010

Jul 20 @ 12:48 PM ET
I'm surprised that we're trying to move PK only because who would want to take him even with 50% retained.
vlongo4419
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 07.31.2013

Jul 20 @ 12:51 PM ET
I'm surprised that we're trying to move PK only because who would want to take him even with 50% retained.
- Pomegrant


I'm sure theres some interest out there, a 4.5M PK on an expiring deal isnt too bad. I'd say its actually intriguing if you arent totally up against the cap. If hes playing on your 2nd or even 3rd pairing and not needed for the power play then hes a decent player. But you're in a lot of trouble if you have him playing 20+ minutes a night and trying to quarterback a PP, like we have been doing.
Leniwm1
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Joined: 02.24.2015

Jul 20 @ 12:55 PM ET
I'm surprised that we're trying to move PK only because who would want to take him even with 50% retained.
- Pomegrant



Seattle takes Butch, then gives us a third rounder for PK and his 50% retained. Then we sign Hall to 1yr 9 mil (for cap purposes)

He gets another MVP year, but if we are out of playoffs trade him for top prospect.

Then next year Hall realizes he plays best in Nj, so he signs very friendly 4 mil 5 yr deal. He plays on our second line. Our core all score 80+ pts.

We go far in the playoffs, but miss the finals in a 4-2 series defeat.

I can't look further out than that.
shvingter88
New Jersey Devils
Location: Puljujarvi makes draisitil and mcdavid better, CT
Joined: 10.12.2009

Jul 20 @ 1:02 PM ET
I'm surprised that we're trying to move PK only because who would want to take him even with 50% retained.
- Pomegrant

The coyotes?
Queenie_5_hole
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 05.01.2015

Jul 20 @ 1:07 PM ET
I'm sure theres some interest out there, a 4.5M PK on an expiring deal isnt too bad. I'd say its actually intriguing if you arent totally up against the cap. If hes playing on your 2nd or even 3rd pairing and not needed for the power play then hes a decent player. But you're in a lot of trouble if you have him playing 20+ minutes a night and trying to quarterback a PP, like we have been doing.
- vlongo4419


Not sure how this works, but PK is paid $6M in bonus this year and $2M in Salary for a total of $8 in real dollars. The Cap Hit is $9M. I think the Bonuses are already paid. So if we traded him would the new team only be on the hook for the $2M remaining salary? And if we retain 50% does it go down to $1M in salary and $4.5M in cap hit?


Queenie_5_hole
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 05.01.2015

Jul 20 @ 1:08 PM ET
The coyotes?
- shvingter88



Working on an OEL deal or trying to trade back for John Hayden to Nate Bastian's roster spot? God forbid..... both. OEL's contract s horrific.
vlongo4419
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 07.31.2013

Jul 20 @ 1:23 PM ET
Not sure how this works, but PK is paid $6M in bonus this year and $2M in Salary for a total of $8 in real dollars. The Cap Hit is $9M. I think the Bonuses are already paid. So if we traded him would the new team only be on the hook for the $2M remaining salary? And if we retain 50% does it go down to $1M in salary and $4.5M in cap hit?
- Queenie_5_hole


When salary is retained in a trade its apparently both the remaining salary and the cap hit that are split. So if Subban is traded before the season with 50% retention, the team acquiring him will take a 4.5M cap hit and owe him 1M of his remaining 2M salary
Queenie_5_hole
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 05.01.2015

Jul 20 @ 1:36 PM ET
When salary is retained in a trade its apparently both the remaining salary and the cap hit that are split. So if Subban is traded before the season with 50% retention, the team acquiring him will take a 4.5M cap hit and owe him 1M of his remaining 2M salary
- vlongo4419


That makes sense. So PK is cheap as far as real dollars but cap hit could be an issue to a team trading for him.

IF we already paid him $6M for this season, I don't see what the financial incentive is to trade him. The cap hit is more of a benefit then a problem to us. Not sure what the motive for this is.
vlongo4419
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 07.31.2013

Jul 20 @ 1:39 PM ET
That makes sense. So PK is cheap as far as real dollars but cap hit is an issue.

IF we already paid him $6M for this season, I don't see what the financial incentive is to trade him. The cap hit is more of a benefit then a problem to us.

- Queenie_5_hole


Yeah signing bonuses were already paid back on July 1, so its definitely not a financial decision to try to move him. So im not sure what Fitz has in mind. Obviously hes going to throw big money at Dougie to try to get him here, but even then the cap still wouldnt be an issue with both of them, so idk

Its been put out there how disappointed/unhappy the front office and Fitz were at the play of the defense last season. So maybe the rumors of him wanting to completely re-vamp the D are true, and we only return Ty and Sevo? (Not including Siegs because he only played 7 games or something after the acquisition)
MartysBetter88
New Jersey Devils
Location: 94Nevermore, NJ
Joined: 07.01.2010

Jul 20 @ 1:51 PM ET
That makes sense. So PK is cheap as far as real dollars but cap hit could be an issue to a team trading for him.

IF we already paid him $6M for this season, I don't see what the financial incentive is to trade him. The cap hit is more of a benefit then a problem to us. Not sure what the motive for this is.

- Queenie_5_hole
The motivation is to improve the roster. PK salary takes up space that could be better used on a better player. This gives us even more flexibility to add some nice free agents. PK isn’t a good player at all lol. He’s best used as a number six defenseman and that’s about it. I suppose he serves value as far as marketing purposes, so if we can get anything back for him that would be fantastic.
Queenie_5_hole
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 05.01.2015

Jul 20 @ 1:57 PM ET
Yeah signing bonuses were already paid back on July 1, so its definitely not a financial decision to try to move him. So im not sure what Fitz has in mind. Obviously hes going to throw big money at Dougie to try to get him here, but even then the cap still wouldnt be an issue with both of them, so idk

Its been put out there how disappointed/unhappy the front office and Fitz were at the play of the defense last season. So maybe the rumors of him wanting to completely re-vamp the D are true, and we only return Ty and Sevo? (Not including Siegs because he only played 7 games or something after the acquisition)

- vlongo4419


I thought when we had Subban, Severson, Kulikov, Murray, Vats and Smith we looked fairly respectable. I'm not saying good, but not the usual train wreck. At least before Covid. Then we had injuries and trades that sort of turned it into the usual mess. So I'm confused why getting rid of PK would seem like the solution. I guess we just need to wait and see what happens....

vlongo4419
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 07.31.2013

Jul 20 @ 2:12 PM ET
I thought when we had Subban, Severson, Kulikov, Murray, Vats and Smith we looked fairly respectable. I'm not saying good, but not the usual train wreck. At least before Covid. Then we had injuries and trades that sort of turned it into the usual mess. So I'm confused why getting rid of PK would seem like the solution. I guess we just need to wait and see what happens....
- Queenie_5_hole


Yeah we just gotta see, the next couple of weeks could be interesting. If we're able to add a top 4 RHD and have him/Sevo in the top 4 on the right, i have no issue keeping Subban on our 3rd pairing. I know hes not what he used to be, but he should be fine in a reduced role playing 3rd pairing minutes, and theres no denying hes a great guy in the locker room.

But i trust Fitz, i dont think he's made a bad move yet. So lets just see how everything unfolds through the end of this month
Queenie_5_hole
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 05.01.2015

Jul 20 @ 2:21 PM ET
The motivation is to improve the roster. PK salary takes up space that could be better used on a better player. This gives us even more flexibility to add some nice free agents. PK isn’t a good player at all lol. He’s best used as a number six defenseman and that’s about it. I suppose he serves value as far as marketing purposes, so if we can get anything back for him that would be fantastic.
- MartysBetter88


Not trying to argue, but I don't see how having PK under contract for this year really stops us from improving the roster now. We have the cap space and already paid him a majority of his salary. We have plenty of room having moved away from Kulikov, Murray, Carrick, and Sami Vats while only adding Siegenthaler and Graves. We literally have 6 guys under contract and one of them is Will Butcher. We could be down to 5 after the expansion draft.

Just saying.
Leniwm1
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Joined: 02.24.2015

Jul 20 @ 2:34 PM ET
Not trying to argue, but I don't see how having PK under contract for this year really stops us from improving the roster now. We have the cap space and already paid him a majority of his salary. We have plenty of room having moved away from Kulikov, Murray, Carrick, and Sami Vats while only adding Siegenthaler and Graves. We literally have 6 guys under contract and one of them is Will Butcher. We could be down to 5 after the expansion draft.

Just saying.

- Queenie_5_hole


If PK is out, not sure if outside help comes in. But Bahl, Walsh and others will need opportunities to show their stuff.

If PK stays, im cool with that too. 1 year left. He certainly isnt the worse defenseman and can still serve a purpose.
Pomegrant
New Jersey Devils
Location: NJ
Joined: 01.18.2010

Jul 20 @ 2:38 PM ET
I guess it makes sense to trade him to a team who wants to add cap space but not spend the real money on it. But right now we can still spend a lot of money without moving his contract anyway. It's not like having PK on the team makes it so we can't add Hamilton (although I don't think we are).

I honestly really like PK as a person and have really enjoyed him being on the team even if his on ice results have been mediocre to bad. He's helped make a couple of boring seasons more enjoyable and it's good to have somebody with personality as one of the faces of the team.
Queenie_5_hole
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 05.01.2015

Jul 20 @ 2:52 PM ET
If PK is out, not sure if outside help comes in. But Bahl, Walsh and others will need opportunities to show their stuff.

If PK stays, im cool with that too. 1 year left. He certainly isnt the worse defenseman and can still serve a purpose.

- Leniwm1


Bahl, Walsh and anyone need to earn their opportunities. They'll likely get them due to injury because that happens every year. This idea that we need to move people out to make room in the lineup for completely unproven prospects is just a horrific way to run a railroad.

The reality is you don't have anyone in the system at RHD who can outplay PK Subban despite all the complaints about his play. You could reunite PK with Lindsay Vonn and he'd still be a better option then just moving him off the team.

Outside help is another matter but we should land the fish we want before selling ours.
bikeguy99
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 09.05.2017

Jul 20 @ 3:16 PM ET
I think its between Butcher and Johnsson for me. Butcher is who i hope they select, but Johnsson is for sure their best option and is the one who can make us look the most foolish if they take.

I'm not sure they will take Subban's 9M hit, especially with the plethora of very good defenseman that are out there, but if they do we're gonna need to shell out a ton of money because we'll be almost 20M under the cap floor.

Maybe they take a tweener like Merkley or Bastian? I doubt it but you never know. In the end, im not too upset with losing anybody who is available

Either way, Seattle is going to be a very solid team with the players that are available

- vlongo4419



Devs certainly aren't making Ron Franchise salivate too much. In a dream world, Devs re-sign Murray allowing the LD to be locked up, with Smith jumping back to the right. My guess is Johnsson is taken however. He has a decent chance of a bounce back season with some decent trade value still. Butch has been de-valued heavily, and the amount of projected D taken in this draft leaves him on the outside of any consideration in my opinion.

Graves Smith
Murray Sevo
Seig P.K
vlongo4419
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 07.31.2013

Jul 20 @ 3:20 PM ET
Devs certainly aren't making Ron Franchise salivate too much. In a dream world, Devs re-sign Murray allowing the LD to be locked up, with Smith jumping back to the right. My guess is Johnsson is taken however. He has a decent chance of a bounce back season with some decent trade value still. Butch has been de-valued heavily, and the amount of projected D taken in this draft leaves him on the outside of any consideration in my opinion.

Graves Smith
Murray Sevo
Seig P.K

- bikeguy99


I'm assuming Murray is gone, it sounded like he had zero interest in re-signing and coming back in his exit interview. And bringing in Graves essentially replaces him, and is an upgrade
bikeguy99
New Jersey Devils
Joined: 09.05.2017

Jul 20 @ 3:25 PM ET
Bahl, Walsh and anyone need to earn their opportunities. They'll likely get them due to injury because that happens every year. This idea that we need to move people out to make room in the lineup for completely unproven prospects is just a horrific way to run a railroad.

The reality is you don't have anyone in the system at RHD who can outplay PK Subban despite all the complaints about his play. You could reunite PK with Lindsay Vonn and he'd still be a better option then just moving him off the team.

Outside help is another matter but we should land the fish we want before selling ours.

- Queenie_5_hole



I think Bahl, Walsh, Shak should start off with large roles in Bing and see how their season progresses. Smith had clearly hit his ceiling in the WHL, winning defenceman of the year twice, and CHL defencsman of the year once. He desperately needed more of a challange. Walsh still needs to learn the insanely compressed schedule that catches so many NCAA players off guard, and Shak needs to acclimate to the NHL size ice, and he is coming off a long injury stint.

P.K.... you aren't wrong. It's not like we currently have a long lineup of RD's competing for top 4 minutes, but I would prefer we lock up Murray once again, and move Smith to the right where he and Sevo can be offensive drivers with Murray and Graves bringing that defensive and physical balance to the mix.
MartysBetter88
New Jersey Devils
Location: 94Nevermore, NJ
Joined: 07.01.2010

Jul 20 @ 5:09 PM ET
I thought when we had Subban, Severson, Kulikov, Murray, Vats and Smith we looked fairly respectable. I'm not saying good, but not the usual train wreck. At least before Covid. Then we had injuries and trades that sort of turned it into the usual mess. So I'm confused why getting rid of PK would seem like the solution. I guess we just need to wait and see what happens....
- Queenie_5_hole


I really don’t think PK is of much use to us, at any capacity. Being relegated to 3rd pair with sheltered minutes is kind of a wasted spot for a veteran. That’s where I’d rather a kid play. I think 85% of dmen in the league are better than him. He doesn’t have foot speed, nor does he have size. His positioning is OK, doesn’t have much offense anymore.. so if we can get something for him that’d be great. I think it’s more about improving the roster than it is cap situation. We won’t be against the cap this year and he’s off the books next year.
I do like the guy and what he brings to the organization. Hamilton really would be a dream, but Larsson could also come in. Landing both would be spectacular. .. we’d have a legitimate NHL level defense, with Smith and Seig still developing- which is normal- unlike what we’ve become used to, with half the roster being rookie kids with no idea how to NHL.
Pomegrant
New Jersey Devils
Location: NJ
Joined: 01.18.2010

Jul 20 @ 5:11 PM ET
It's not about us being at the cap, it's about how we are getting to the floor. If you trade PK you need a huge contract coming from somewhere.
MartysBetter88
New Jersey Devils
Location: 94Nevermore, NJ
Joined: 07.01.2010

Jul 20 @ 5:16 PM ET
It's not about us being at the cap, it's about how we are getting to the floor. If you trade PK you need a huge contract coming from somewhere.
- Pomegrant

Which is why I said this isn’t about cap situation.
I think it’s exciting they’re looking to move him- because it means they’re definitely looking to bring someone in (that will bring us to the floor). I don’t think they can do much worse than “3rd pair dman with sheltered minutes”.
dmarsden2988
New Jersey Devils
Location: stafford is about equal to rya, NJ
Joined: 03.07.2011

Jul 20 @ 6:26 PM ET
Buttons mock draft has the devil's selecting mactavish
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