Bill Meltzer: Quick Hits: Raffl, Stewart, TIFH, and More

Bill Meltzer: Quick Hits: Raffl, Stewart, TIFH, and More
- bmeltzer

Thanks Bill

Bill Meltzer: Quick Hits: Raffl, Stewart, TIFH, and More
- bmeltzer

Bill,

I thought you have said in the past that Stewart was no longer with the Flyers. Was he let go and brought back? If so, why on both of those questions?

There was a link to an article on here the other day, where some jackwagon ranked Clarke as 3rd worst GM ever. Most of the trades they listed as bad ones were in this category - meh no real winners or losers. Except the Patrick Sharp trade.

There was a link to an article on here the other day, where some jackwagon ranked Clarke as 3rd worst GM ever. Most of the trades they listed as bad ones were in this category - meh no real winners or losers. Except the Patrick Sharp trade.
- backfire

Clarke acquired LeClair and Desjardins along with Gilbert Dionne for Mark Recchi ….got to give something to get something….LeClair would go on to score 50 plus goals 4 times and Desjardins would become their top d man for the next 5 plus years. To me that would rank as one of the great deals in Flyers history….but ya let’s not mention the Clarke wins or the fact that they were almost always relevant, something they really haven’t been very often over the last decade.
Clarke also always tried to maintain an identity which has really been lacking for the last decade.

That article was a complete joke.

Bill,

I thought you have said in the past that Stewart was no longer with the Flyers. Was he let go and brought back? If so, why on both of those questions?
- corduroy

He had a team ownership venture and took time away to do that.

One trade that immediately comes to mind was the Drew Callander & Kevin McCarthy move for Dennis Ververgaert.

We thought it was a steal for us after Dennis had several good scoring years with Vancouver. The next Reggie Leach? Ververgaert sorta flamed out here quickly, though. Callander didn't do much, but McCarthy went on thereafter to have a few surprisingly good years with the 'Nucks.

The Pat Falloon deal was another. We took a shot hoping the second overall pick would take off, and we all know how that ended up. The 1st rounder, the 4th rounder, and Martin Spanhel didn't help SJ at all. But the interesting thing about that deal was that 1st was moved to the Coyotes who drafted Briere.

Mike Comry was another move with high hopes. Those going back to Edmonton - Jeff Woywitka (former Flyers 1st rounder) a 1st round pick (Rob Schremp), and Danny Syvret - also did zip.

I remember there was a lot of excitement when the Flyers acquired Dennis Ververgaert who had some pretty good seasons in Vancouver, for young forward Drew Callender and Dman Kevin McCarthy. He never panned out to much here though and the Flyers let him walk in 1980.

Obviously there was a lot of buzz when the Flyers picked up an aging Paul Coffey for Kevin Haller. But after a mid ice collision with Eric Lindros early in his Flyers tenure, Coffey was never the same.

Those are the 2 that jump out at me.

One trade that immediately comes to mind was the Drew Callander & Kevin McCarthy move for Dennis Ververgaert.

We thought it was a steal for us after Dennis had several good scoring years with Vancouver. The next Reggie Leach? Ververgaert sorta flamed out here quickly, though. Callander didn't do much, but McCarthy went on thereafter to have a few surprisingly good years with the 'Nucks.

The Pat Falloon deal was another. We took a shot hoping the second overall pick would take off, and we all know how that ended up. The 1st rounder, the 4th rounder, and Martin Spanhel didn't help SJ at all. But the interesting thing about that deal was that 1st was moved to the Coyotes who drafted Briere.

Mike Comry was another move with high hopes. Those going back to Edmonton - Jeff Woywitka (former Flyers 1st rounder) a 1st round pick (Rob Schremp), and Danny Syvret - also did zip.
- 77rams

You beat me to it, what I get for not back reading, lol

You beat me to it, what I get for not back reading, lol
- BiggE

Great minds...

He had a team ownership venture and took time away to do that.
- bmeltzer

Bill, can you give us a rundown on what a "developmental" coach actually does?

Is it more on ice or off ice stuff?

The trade for Adam Oates

I backread, and no fire Chuck comments! 🥳

Bill, can you give us a rundown on what a "developmental" coach actually does?

Is it more on ice or off ice stuff?
- MBFlyerfan

More off ice than on but there can be a one-on-one on ice part at times. Mostly, though, it's about establishing a person rapport. Teaching them about the day to day of being a pro. Being a confidant. Observing their play and making suggestions.

I backread, and no fire Chuck comments! 🥳
- THE EVIL WITHIN

Most have given up hope...

There was a link to an article on here the other day, where some jackwagon ranked Clarke as 3rd worst GM ever. Most of the trades they listed as bad ones were in this category - meh no real winners or losers. Except the Patrick Sharp trade.
- backfire

That's just ridiculous.

The trade for Adam Oates
- Stanley Cup

That was a terrible waste of assets....

That was a terrible waste of assets....
- RajaAmpat

An INSANE trade when looked at in todays lens.

For Maxime Ouellet and a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick in the 2002 draft.

For a 39 year old center who granted, led the league in assists that season.

the Flyers ended up getting a 1st round pick from Tampa and drafted Pitkanen.


The Stars ended up using the original Flyers pick to take Martin Vagner at #26.
Washington chose Maxime Daigneault at 59 (2nd round) and Derek Krestanovich at 92 (3rd round)


All for 14 regular season games and 5 playoff games.

An INSANE trade when looked at in todays lens.

For Maxime Ouellet and a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick in the 2002 draft.

For a 39 year old center who granted, led the league in assists that season.

the Flyers ended up getting a 1st round pick from Tampa and drafted Pitkanen.


The Stars ended up using the original Flyers pick to take Martin Vagner at #26.
Washington chose Maxime Daigneault at 59 (2nd round) and Derek Krestanovich at 92 (3rd round)

All for 14 regular season games and 5 playoff games.
- MBFlyerfan

Ahh , the 1st from Tampa was for the Ukranian winger Ruslan Fedotenko

Ahh , the 1st from Tampa was for the Ukranian winger Ruslan Fedotenko
- RajaAmpat

yes!


I guess the only saving grace was that the 2002 draft was one of the weakest drafts I have ever seen.

Not one of the players drafted with those Flyers picks played one game in the NHL.

He had a team ownership venture and took time away to do that.
- bmeltzer

Thank you

As this discouraging off-season drags on, I still can’t help but start to feel excited for the season to begin. I’m ready to watch some flyers hockey, even though it may be painful at times.

More off ice than on but there can be a one-on-one on ice part at times. Mostly, though, it's about establishing a person rapport. Teaching them about the day to day of being a pro. Being a confidant. Observing their play and making suggestions.
- bmeltzer

Thanks Bill, almost sounds like a guidance counselor.

As this discouraging off-season drags on, I still can’t help but start to feel excited for the season to begin. I’m ready to watch some flyers hockey, even though it may be painful at times.
- funmaster18

With Torts at the helm it should at least be good theater.

The trade for Adam Oates
- Stanley Cup

Yeah, that was a pretty awful trade... he also had:

- Justin Williams for a few games of Danny Markov
- Dennis Seidenberg for gives-zero-(frank)s Petr Nedved
- Vinny Prospal for Alex Daigle
- Patrick Sharp for Matt Ellison
- Primeau gave us that 5OT goal, but trading Brindy away was so wrong (even if he had beef w/ 88)
- Wasting a truckload of top-90 picks on dudes like Denis Gauthier, Todd Fedoruk, Eric Chouinard, Jiri Dopita, Dean McAmmond, Dave Babych and Pat Falloon over the years
- Trading for Billy Tibbetts, gross


But he did make some really nice trades, like:

- Getting all 4 1st-rounders from the Gratton OS (Gagne, Williams) back for just Renberg + Dykhuis
- Somehow getting Tampa to give up the 4th-overall pick for Ruslan Fedotenko,
- Getting a top-pair puck-moving dman back for Lindros' rights (Kim Johnsson),
- Turning Daymond Langkow into two top-60 picks, one which turned into Jeff Carter
- And of course, the Mark Recchi for Rico and LeClair deal.



He was a good GM when the league was all about size and toughness and he could spend as much $ as he wanted to cover his ass on his constant missteps. There's zero chance he would succeed in the salary cap era tho. And he definitely missed the boat on the rule changes and transition to a more open/skill game. And he never really prioritized goaltending at the end of the day.