thing is, the flyers lack a bonafide puck mover who can stay healthy all year. Right now you're looking at Kimo coming off back surgery and then Coburn as your mainstays at puck movement. Then next year who knows what's gonna happen with Kimo. IF you add Jbo you can still find out what you have with the youngsters cause believe me when I tell you, someone on that blueline is going to be injured at some point. If you're willing to risk a losing season, then fine. If you want to solidify the blueline in hopes of having everything come together in a playoff run like what happened for LA, then maybe you make the move. Trading to fix a weakness from a position of strength is never a bad thing provided you get decent return. I think JBo would be a reasonable return just not happy with the cap-hit.
- JoeRussomanno

Just for the record.. JBo has played in 564 straight games and a total of 707 out of a possible 728 games in his career. He has played in all 82 games in 8 out of 9 seasons.

Here is the way I look at it.. How would I use them, and what could I realistically expect. Is it worth it?

When he was in Florida he played a more offensive game in a more offensive system, but with a team that had zero offensive stars and yet his stats were pretty good...

Look at the stat line from his last year in Florida and then compare it to his first in Cgy...

82g-15g-27a-42p--2- 182 shots on net.

82gm-3g-26a-29p--4- 150 shots on net

A 30 shot change in one season, and the lowest since his rookie year.. hmm

Look at that stat from this past season.. 107 shots... a career low.

Cgy is using him in a defensive system.

I think if he were to be used in a more offensive system, where he was the trigger man at the point.. his totals would jump right back to where they were..

However.. 6.8 mil for a damn who isnt exactly a Norris Candidate is a tough pill to swallow.
- jak521

It's possible that his numbers don't go up with the Flyers also. At 6.68M and two years left plus what its going to cost isn't worth the risk IMO but will see what Homer decides to do b/c he calls the shots.

I dont see it with Jay-Bo. The Flyers will have Gervais, Gus, Manning, and Bourdon who can all give you solid minutes. Jay-Bo is a fraud and not worth the price.
- stveshdy

We really don't what we have with the FLyer rookie dmen. Over the course of the season they could get exposed and if you bring in another proven player, it gives you time to bring them along. They'll have the opportunity to play even if you bring in another dman. Just this way you aren't rushing them. That way if they fall on their faces this season there's still someone their to lighten the load.

It's possible that his numbers don't go up with the Flyers also. At 6.68M and two years left plus what its going to cost isn't worth the risk IMO but will see what Homer decides to do b/c he calls the shots.
- stveshdy

It is possible... but thats where people have to use judgement. I personally think it would be highly unlikely that he would continue scoring at the same pace. I honestly believe he would put up very good numbers here. Even if he wasnt able to show a dramatic increase in his point totals, he would be a solid piece on the blue line at a very steep price.

I dont see him in OB though.. dont think it happens.

Just for the record.. JBo has played in 564 straight games and a total of 707 out of a possible 728 games in his career. He has played in all 82 games in 8 out of 9 seasons.
- jak521

He has durability and right now, the Flyers are brimming with injury prone players. When you get into the playoffs injuries are an Achilles heal especially this club. I'd rather be trotting out Coburn, Schenn, Jbo and Grossmann as my top four with Gervais, Gus, Bourdon as my bottom pair guys. Cause the way things are looking Kimo Timmonen will not be healthy again this playoffs. That is gonna be a real kick in the crotch.

It is possible... but thats where people have to use judgement. I personally think it would be highly unlikely that he would continue scoring at the same pace. I honestly believe he would put up very good numbers here. Even if he wasnt able to show a dramatic increase in his point totals, he would be a solid piece on the blue line at a very steep price.

I dont see him in OB though.. dont think it happens.
- jak521

People ripped Matt Carle I can only imagine what they would do to Bouwmeester at that price. I dont think he ends up here either.

It's possible that his numbers don't go up with the Flyers also. At 6.68M and two years left plus what its going to cost isn't worth the risk IMO but will see what Homer decides to do b/c he calls the shots.
- stveshdy

I'm not banking on his numbers improving, I'm banking on him being healthy through a season and playoffs, so he can help share the load, furthermore ensure we can get the puck out of the zone. Goals and assists would be secondary.

I agree, but what if we did trade for him and he was putting up better numbers.. say:

80gp- 11 goals-35 assists- 46 points- +24 - 23:00 toi

would you think about it then?
- jak521

Depending on what we give up for him I'm actually pro doing this. Taking into account the current Market for Defensmen, his cap hit is high, but there is really a serious dirth of options and we have the cap space. As long as we don't lose a roster player, I'm fine with it.

My description of "Soft" comes from the Complaints of Calgary fans. Knowing that Philly fans will not be any less harsh, it's worth noting that he does not take advantage of his size. I don't mean that he gets pushed around but much like JVR did he often plays much smaller with poorer results. At least he did in Calgary.

Again, depending on who or what we give up, I think he could fit in very well into Lavy's system and has a good possibility of reaching his Florida Numbers again. Even with the cap hit, with our current defense woes and the market for D right now, I'd make the move. However I do not think he would be truly worth his paycheck until he can replace what Kimmo brings.

That all being said, I don't mind the overpaying in salary, but I'd be upset if it cost us say... Matt Read.

People ripped Matt Carle I can only imagine what they would do to Bouwmeester at that price. I dont think he ends up here either.
- stveshdy

Bouwmeester would be here no doubt but Matt Carle is still alive and well after the 5 years of Crucifixion he endured here.

I'm not banking on his numbers improving, I'm banking on him being healthy through a season and playoffs, so he can help share the load, furthermore ensure we can get the puck out of the zone. Goals and assists would be secondary.
- JoeRussomanno

We are all assuming the Flyers cant move the puck out of the zone. They haven't even started camp yet. Homer will work the phones and upgrade when needed. I'm not concerned about Jay-Bo b/c I think he goes elsewhere but the asking price is ridiculous on a player with a cap hit at 6.68M.

It's possible that his numbers don't go up with the Flyers also. At 6.68M and two years left plus what its going to cost isn't worth the risk IMO but will see what Homer decides to do b/c he calls the shots.
- stveshdy

In my opinion, and I'm not stating that I want to get him. But playing for the Flyers, and on the PP with Giroux. I think his offensive numbers go up. Enough to make it worth the Cap hit? Doubtful. There is no doubt that Bouwmeester makes the Flyers a better team. But at what cost? That's what I struggle with.

We are all assuming the Flyers cant move the puck out of the zone. They haven't even started camp yet. Homer will work the phones and upgrade when needed. I'm not concerned about Jay-Bo b/c I think he goes elsewhere but the asking price is ridiculous on a player with a cap hit at 6.68M.
- stveshdy

we don't know what the asking price is. Incarcerated slob etc. don't know either, the only people who know are the GMS and their immediate assistants, oh yea and probably the player and his agent, maybe.

Bouwmeester would be here no doubt but Matt Carle is still alive and well after the 5 years of Crucifixion he endured here.
- JoeRussomanno

Carle made half the money as Bouwmeester. Bouwmeester will get crushed here at that price.

People ripped Matt Carle I can only imagine what they would do to Bouwmeester at that price. I dont think he ends up here either.
- stveshdy

I said it the other day to Jsaq.. ppl ripped Mike Schmidt... they woulda ripped Weber too...

I dont look at price (unless its totally baffling) but what they would do for the team.. JBo would make our defense much much better.

In my opinion, and I'm stating that I want to get him. But playing for the Flyers, and on the PP with Giroux. I think his offensive numbers go up. Enough to make it worth the Cap hit? Doubtful. There is no doubt that Bouwmeester makes the Flyers a better team. But at what cost? That's what I struggle with.
- MJL

I'm right there with you, because if homer sends to calgary what he sent to anaheim for Pronger then I might be in a market for a new lap top after i send it on a one way trip to the moon.

I said it the other day to Jsaq.. ppl ripped Mike Schmidt... they woulda ripped Weber too...

I dont look at price (unless its totally baffling) but what they would do for the team.. JBo would make our defense much much better.
- jak521

I'm not changing anyone's minds but I rather stay away from Jay-Bo.

In my opinion, and I'm not stating that I want to get him. But playing for the Flyers, and on the PP with Giroux. I think his offensive numbers go up. Enough to make it worth the Cap hit? Doubtful. There is no doubt that Bouwmeester makes the Flyers a better team. But at what cost? That's what I struggle with.
- MJL

Exactly!

The more I think about the better I am with it... however, what do we need to shell out?

His cap hit wouldnt be nearly as atrocious as ppl are making it out to be... hell Timonen is making 6.3 a year (not a knock on Kimmo, I think he is fantastic). Its not as if he is a guy who is a 3-4-5 d-man.

I'm not changing anyone's minds but I rather stay away from Jay-Bo.
- stveshdy

Im up in the air. I dont wanna pay to have him, but I wouldnt mind to have him on my team.. if that makes sense

Carle made half the money as Bouwmeester. Bouwmeester will get crushed here at that price.
- stveshdy

just think what they'll do if the Flyers miss the playoffs. Yes, there's a risk of that with this blueline. YOu mentioned Bobby Ryan and look at the ducks, a weak blueline yet good goaltending and pretty good forwards yet they missed the postseason. If Mezaros didn't go down I wouldn't be entertaining this notion, but losing him and Carle is going to sting, especially if these rookies don't make a significant improvement.

I think j-bo and schenn could be a nice tandem.

Exactly!

The more I think about the better I am with it... however, what do we need to shell out?

His cap hit wouldnt be nearly as atrocious as ppl are making it out to be... hell Timonen is making 6.3 a year (not a knock on Kimmo, I think he is fantastic). Its not as if he is a guy who is a 3-4-5 d-man.
- jak521

I would take Kimmo anyday over Jay-Bo even at his age. Bouwmeester is overpaid bigtime.

Exactly!

The more I think about the better I am with it... however, what do we need to shell out?

His cap hit wouldnt be nearly as atrocious as ppl are making it out to be... hell Timonen is making 6.3 a year (not a knock on Kimmo, I think he is fantastic). Its not as if he is a guy who is a 3-4-5 d-man.
- jak521

See that's the problem I have. His Cap hit is outrageous in my opinion.

just think what they'll do if the Flyers miss the playoffs. Yes, there's a risk of that with this blueline. YOu mentioned Bobby Ryan and look at the ducks, a weak blueline yet good goaltending and pretty good forwards yet they missed the postseason. If Mezaros didn't go down I wouldn't be entertaining this notion, but losing him and Carle is going to sting, especially if these rookies don't make a significant improvement.
- JoeRussomanno

Hard to jump to conclusions when this team hasnt even started camp. Lets see what Grevais, Bourdon, Gus, and Manning have to offer. Jay-Bo won't be the only option available. They could sign CC to help the defense as well.

See that's the problem I have. His Cap hit is outrageous in my opinion.
- MJL

I think under the present circumstances tho, it might be worth shouldering in order to avoid disaster. God forbid we lose Kimo or Coby and the Flyers are going to be in trouble. IF you're willing to risk that then by all means stay away. I'm on the fence but I gotta admit a summer of lousiness from the Phillies doesn't have me looking forward to one from the Flyers.

Hard to jump to conclusions when this team hasnt even started camp. Lets see what Grevais, Bourdon, Gus, and Manning have to offer. Jay-Bo won't be the only option available. They could sign CC to help the defense as well.
- stveshdy

I'd rather they do that but that's not what we are talking about, we're talking about the logic behind bringing in JBo. Also there's no guarantee that Homer can pick up a phone and make a transaction happen, we should all know this by now.