Any deal where the players accept less than 57% of HRR is a win for Bettman.

All Fehr is doing is pushing back enough to make sure the players keep as much as possible.
- cracka

I think you'd find the battle line is 50/50 and nothing less. If Bettman didn't get 50/50 it would be a lose for him. earlier negotiations flirted with the idea of a soft landing at 50/50 over a few years, and that was summarily rejected.

So far ahead he sacrifices seasons.

Depends on your definition of it. If losing seasons is the goal, hes a legend.
- systemtool

Does he have a choice seeing he has to negociate with half witts and delusional players

Does he have a choice seeing he has to negociate with half witts and delusional players
- Alexzanki

Mental health, or lack thereof, is not a choice or an option. He is what he is.

Mental health, or lack thereof, is not a choice or an option. He is what he is.
- systemtool

Lol. Conversation going downhill fast. The players aren't half-wits, they're uneducated young men. And bettman isn't a half-wit, he's a figurehead.

Nobody has been able to build any kind of relationship with Bettman. Its only been Goodenow and Fehr that have been in CBA negotiations as leaders. Saskin came and went quickly and never had to negotiate with Bettman.

You cant blame one side, when the other side has done nothing but lose games.
- systemtool

It's never all one sides fault but the majority of the blame is the union not the league. We won't be ale to convince you of that, and that's fine...this just seems like and endless conversation.

An NHL player, who requested anonymity, says the NHL made a new offer to the NHLPA on Thursday, one which moved on contract term limits, buyouts and variance, according to TSN Hockey Insider Pierre LeBrun. NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly would not confirm what the player said when reached for comment.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=412368

NHL caving
- Feeling_Glucky

Are the owners giving up any more money, if the buyouts go against the players share then no. They gave up nothing of value in this proposal if that is the case.

Most owners are losing money because they have teams in markets they shouldnt be in.
- systemtool

Yet another bonus for about 250 players in 10 crappy markets, they should be kissing Bettman's arse for that.

Yet another bonus for about 250 players in 10 crappy markets, they should be kissing Bettman's arse for that.
- BigStew

Relocation, not contraction. Ala Atlanta to Winnipeg. A more healthy league.

60m seems a little low for a salary cap, I think they should bump it up to 63ish.

Do your homework. After the player/owners meetings when Fehr got back involved and said they could "get more", EVERY media sourse from Ek to the TSN panel, to the Sportsnet panel, to ESPN were reporting that their player sources were all calling for a players vote on the offer. There are even reports of guys like Iginla and St. Louis wanting in on the player meetings, and was refused by Fehr, because they were moderates. Fehr only wants lemmings and hard line players involved so that he can control them, and put his spin on it.

Second, the DOI is a completely different issue, the player vote was not needed to file a DOI, it was a sham vote that means nothing, and everyone knows its a negotiating tactic. An overwhelming vote on DOI does not mean hat the players overwhelmingly reject any offer, it means that they agree that Fehr should use the sham vote as a negotiating tactic, thats all.

Let`s see where the rubber meets the road on Jan. 2, does the NHLPA file with the courts or no?
- gstrandberg

I think you need to do your homework. There were never legitimate reports that the players as a whole wanted to take the Owners offer from the meeting to a vote. There was only speculation from poor sources such as Cloutier. And that is also where the farce of Fehr keeping players out of meetings and involvement in the process.
Absolutely true that a vote on DOI was not needed. It was done so to show that there was solidarity and the players firmly back Fehr and the negotiating committee. And it shows that this thought that the players wanted to vote on any Owners offer was completely untrue.

Relocation, not contraction. Ala Atlanta to Winnipeg. A more healthy league.
- systemtool

I wonder though how NBC feels about it. Would they rather have 27,000 tv viewers in Atl with the potential of 4 million or 0 tv viewers from Wpg with the potential of 0? I honestly don't know.

I'm with you, I'm a big Briere fan.
- BulliesPhan87

You guys would miss him come playoff time. Over paid? Yeah but he's still a great player

Relocation, not contraction. Ala Atlanta to Winnipeg. A more healthy league.
- systemtool

Where are you going to find 10 other markets, one in TO and one in Quebec City (and that went well the first time). No one else wants one.

Lol. Conversation going downhill fast. The players aren't half-wits, they're uneducated young men. And bettman isn't a half-wit, he's a figurehead.
- Thesource

Pretty much ( from the non sarcastic point of view) , but I do agree both sides are to blame for this, if it's all about saving face then the players should of accepted the leagues offert in early december and come out of the room hand in hand with the owners.

PR wise the owners just seem like the greater man in these negociations.

60m seems a little low for a salary cap, I think they should bump it up to 63ish.
- Ranger71

They way things went last time, I wouldn't sweat it. It'll go up.

Are the owners giving up any more money, if the buyouts go against the players share then no. They gave up nothing of value in this proposal if that is the case.
- BigStew

Huh ? You have lots of catching up.

There was no discussion for weeks because the owners were waiting for the PA to make a proposal. What happened? The owners made a few more concessions.

You need to remember that this is a new collective bargaining agreement, what was in place before doesn't exist anymore.
- PatC80

And more people need to realize that in Concession Bargaining, the past is a reference point in the negotiations.

Huh ? You have lots of catching up.
- Thesource

Then tell me what the owners have given up, that is actual value, from their last offer.

I see no more money from their last offer, it they are giving more up, enlighten me.

@DarrenDreger: Hard to imagine the NHL's latest proposal doesn't result in potentially season-saving meetings. Players wanted flexibility and they got it.



Can't wait to see Fehr go around saying they can get more.
- Alexzanki

Very good chance of it happening, would destroy the game to a level it's never been before.

Where are you going to find 10 other markets, one in TO and one in Quebec City (and that went well the first time). No one else wants one.
- BigStew

Why are you throwing 10 out there?

I think only 3-4 teams need to be relocated at this point. As for Quebec and their first time around, Canadian teams couldnt compete with the American dollar. Now that its on par for the most part, Canadian teams are all profitable and in good health.

Why should I "ignore" the past CBA results of Bettman when looking at this one? You'd have to bury your head in the sand to not see the trend he has set.
- systemtool

A lockout is not only a trend with Bettman. It is also a trend with the Legal firm the NHL is using. Proskauer Rose.

They way things went last time, I wouldn't sweat it. It'll go up.
- Buffalo--Sabres

I think the big issue is getting under it initially.

Why? Because the owners own the league and can basically do whatever they want. The players are not their business partners which is how they act, they are simply employees. Most owners are losing money, all players make money. The players need to make a little less to make the the league as a whole viable.
- Homer

Ding! Ding! Ding! THIS is what people forget about.

Why are you throwing 10 out there?

I think only 3-4 teams need to be relocated at this point. As for Quebec and their first time around, Canadian teams couldnt compete with the American dollar. Now that its on par for the most part, Canadian teams are all profitable and in good health.
- systemtool

Because at least 10 lost loads of money that is why, 3 or 4 teams moving does nothing to the other 5 to 10 that will never make money under the current system.

And what other markets that TO and QC do you know of that want a team.

Hamilton would have to pay the Sabres a load of money going into their territory and hurt the Sabres.

I think you'd find the battle line is 50/50 and nothing less. If Bettman didn't get 50/50 it would be a lose for him. earlier negotiations flirted with the idea of a soft landing at 50/50 over a few years, and that was summarily rejected.
- gstrandberg

What do you think the Make Whole money is going to do when applied to the actual revenue percentage the players will get? It will give that soft landing.