I don't think that's a healthy mindset. Frankly, I don't ever want to see the Canucks end up like Edmonton, Calgary, Colorado etc etc. I want to see our team perpetually committed to icing a competitive, exciting team that wants to win at all costs. Is that an unreasonable expectation? well, at this point any sort of expectation seems to be unreasonable; however, that type of passive attitude and team philosophy will never get you to the top. And we've had plenty of time since the Canucks entered the league to reenforce the type of culture that makes a team/organization successful

As for your comments, I know we differ on several subjects (and that's what makes this board interesting), but *wait for it* I disagree with your thoughts on Burrows (and the Sedings of course , which is a given ) but I still feel we need more guys like Burrows, who inject energy, can play on both PP and PK, get under the skin of other teams, and are able to chip in some offense. You know a guy like Burrows is going to give it - especially in big games, and therefore precisely the type of player that we need more of.

Ok, seems I've written a mini-Russian novel so please bear with me

Edit: I feel the same about keeping Edler. Yes, he has his breakdowns and makes gaffs, but he is also a hit-machine, has a great shot, and is able to make offensive plays (of course we all want to see more from him, but I think you can say that about most players with prominent roles
- Zogg

We do need more guys like Burrows , only younger .

With minutes left at the TDL, Gillis called Nonis and said "ok, Ill do it for a 2nd" and Nonis passed. You are digging up where they were at earlier. This was confirmed by Nonis and others btw.

Agree about Nonis wanting to (frank) over Gillis. He had him bent over the table and all Gillis could do is pray for spit. Fail.
- boonerbuck

Btw, where u been. Nice to see you around the board? Good Xmas? New Years? Hows your pooch doing?

Not only yours words, there were a few posters saying a minor tweak is what we need. Everyone can have their opinion , that's what keeps these threads alive. I for one though think that it is more than a player or two move.

I to this day 43 games in don't know the players on any of the lines. That alone shows me this team is confused. We still haven't settled who our top paid D are .

I also think there is a country club atmosphere . I have no problem accepting we are middle of the pack as long as we improve over the summer.
- VANTEL

Of course you're welcome to your opinion.

Mine is that the level of negativity over a few SOL's against top teams recently is getting ridiculous.

Agreed.

The type of player the Canucks need don't become available often, and when they do it's usually for an overpayment.

Canucks don't really have the wealth of assets to make that kind of overpayment.
- Fosco

So without selling the farm how do you aquire this top 6 player and keep in mind we usually draft 15 to 30 th

Not accurate. It was 2 2nd ans Scrivens(whatever though) and no nut didn't refuse. He said he wanted gliis to eat salary, which killed the deal. IMO he never had any intention of trading for lu. Just wanted to lead Gilles on.
- Bieksa#3

I think nonis made a huge blunder considering that any risk that comes with Lu's contract still remained with the canucks. Toronto would only be responsible for Lu's salary (no problem with TO's deep pockets) and his cap hit (reasonable at $5.3 for his talent). Where's the risk for the leafs?

Of course you're welcome to your opinion.

Mine is that the level of negativity over a few SOL's against top teams recently is getting ridiculous.
- Fosco

This is a three year problem now ,not a few SOLs . Now that they realigned the weak division we played in , it unmasks our problems.

Btw, where u been. Nice to see you around the board? Good Xmas? New Years? Hows your pooch doing?
- Bieksa#3

Had to put my dog down and now my father is pissing blood clots and has been waiting 3 weeks just to make an appointment that may be a month later for an ultra sound. Its (frank)ed up.... and my house is trying to cave in.... truck is (frank)ed.... well, I could go on but hard to see the screen though the tears.


When was Xmas? ... I think I might have missed it.... yep. Was a couple of weeks ago apparently.

So without selling the farm how do you aquire this top 6 player and keep in mind we usually draft 15 to 30 th
- VANTEL

Assuming Botchford is correct, with a GM that passes on Brendan Smith, Tomas Tatar, and Riley Sheahan for Edler I don't think we'll ever see a trade made that requires some risk to help this team.

All I can say is the blow it up bullpoop is nauseating. How well have all those picks worked out for the Oilers, Islanders and Panthers.

This franchise has spent 25 years at the bottom of the league, do we really miss it that much that we want to get back there ASAP? I get that the team has not achieved it's ultimate goal but it's still in the top half of the league during a cap hell year with many key injuries.

People need to calm the (frank) down.
- golfingsince

I agree with you. That being said; moving Edler to DET (if such a deal is in the works) for Tatar, Smith, and Sheahan (still know very little about him) would help re-stock the cubbard a bit. It's not like we have exactly missed Edler while he has been gone.

I think if this deal were to go down, it would probably take place at the TDL or at the draft, and hopefully will have worked Nyguist into the deal instead of Sheahan.

I think nonis made a huge blunder considering that any risk that comes with Lu's contract still remained with the canucks. Toronto would only be responsible for Lu's salary (no problem with TO's deep pockets) and his cap hit (reasonable at $5.3 for his talent). Where's the risk for the leafs?
- bloatedmosquito

I think the recapture gets split between the teams if a guy gets traded

All I can say is the blow it up bullpoop is nauseating. How well have all those picks worked out for the Oilers, Islanders and Panthers.

This franchise has spent 25 years at the bottom of the league, do we really miss it that much that we want to get back there ASAP? I get that the team has not achieved it's ultimate goal but it's still in the top half of the league during a cap hell year with many key injuries.

People need to calm the (frank) down.
- golfingsince

How well did it work for the Hawks and Pens, for the two you mentioned I mentioned two it did work for . Islanders with those picks have improved drastically and so have the Avs.


oilers problem is they keep drafting the same player, and Panthers are cheap bastards.

St.l and Minny are two other teams that have drafted well.

Had to put my dog down and now my father is pissing blood clots and has been waiting 3 weeks just to make an appointment that may be a month later for an ultra sound. Its (frank)ed up.... and my house is trying to cave in.... truck is (frank)ed.... well, I could go on but hard to see the screen though the tears.


When was Xmas? ... I think I might have missed it.... yep. Was a couple of weeks ago apparently.
- boonerbuck

I think nonis made a huge blunder considering that any risk that comes with Lu's contract still remained with the canucks. Toronto would only be responsible for Lu's salary (no problem with TO's deep pockets) and his cap hit (reasonable at $5.3 for his talent). Where's the risk for the leafs?
- bloatedmosquito

I disagree totally. He got a great young goalie at a great cap hit. If he added lu at 5.3 they would be up sh!ts creek with the cap. Do I think right now Lu is the better goalie. of course he is. But over the next 5 years who would I rather have. I would pick Bernier based on skill, Cap hit, Age.

So without selling the farm how do you aquire this top 6 player and keep in mind we usually draft 15 to 30 th
- VANTEL

You be patient.

Are you advocating "selling the farm"?

If you're asking if I'm opposed to moving roster players, prospects, or picks for players, I'm not, and I think I've been pretty vocal about that.

How well did it work for the Hawks and Pens, for the two you mentioned I mentioned two it did work for . Islanders with those picks have improved drastically and so have the Avs.


oilers problem is they keep drafting the same player, and Panthers are cheap bastards.

St.l and Minny are two other teams that have drafted well.
- VANTEL

The hawks much like the oilers where like 10-12 yrs between playoff appearances. Pens without the Crosby lottery probably lost their franchise

Assuming Botchford is correct, with a GM that passes on Brendan Smith, Tomas Tatar, and Riley Sheahan for Edler I don't think we'll ever see a trade made that requires some risk to help this team.
- AlexF

I personally don't see MG asking anyone with NTC to waive and I don't see him making a blockbuster either. I think he just goes on same ol same ol

How well did it work for the Hawks and Pens, for the two you mentioned I mentioned two it did work for . Islanders with those picks have improved drastically and so have the Avs.


oilers problem is they keep drafting the same player, and Panthers are cheap bastards.

St.l and Minny are two other teams that have drafted well.
- VANTEL

I agree with you Vantel. The worst case situation is mediocrity. When the team is middle of the pack for a few years and can never get that franchise type player in the draft unless they luck out with a late pick (datsuk, Zetter etc)

How well did it work for the Hawks and Pens, for the two you mentioned I mentioned two it did work for . Islanders with those picks have improved drastically and so have the Avs.


oilers problem is they keep drafting the same player, and Panthers are cheap bastards.

St.l and Minny are two other teams that have drafted well.
- VANTEL

It's also really dependent on the draft class available to you when you're sucking. Toews and Kane or Crosby and Malkin are all in a different league than Hall, RNH, and Yakupov.

This is a three year problem now ,not a few SOLs . Now that they realigned the weak division we played in , it unmasks our problems.
- VANTEL

Clearly the moves needed to fix the team aren't easy.

I'm not referring to the problems that the team has had even when they went to the SCF. I'm talking about the hyperbolic whining that occurs after a loss or two.

You be patient.

Are you advocating "selling the farm"?

If you're asking if I'm opposed to moving roster players, prospects, or picks for players, I'm not, and I think I've been pretty vocal about that.
- Fosco

My opinion is at TDL move Burrows and Edler for upgrades for the future. I would consider moving Bieksa also.

I disagree totally. He got a great young goalie at a great cap hit. If he added lu at 5.3 they would be up sh!ts creek with the cap. Do I think right now Lu is the better goalie. of course he is. But over the next 5 years who would I rather have. I would pick Bernier based on skill, Cap hit, Age.
- Bluechip23

Bernier is what? 27-28? Hes not good enough to be a starting goalie yet, how long do we wait. 3 mill for a guy playing like a back up isn't a great contract

My opinion is at TDL move Burrows and Edler for upgrades for the future. I would consider moving Bieksa also.
- VANTEL

I'm all for moving a D, if the trade makes sense.

I'm reluctant to move Burrows. And I don't think he returns much.

Hansen would be the better option.

I'm all for moving a D, if the trade makes sense.

I'm reluctant to move Burrows. And I don't think he returns much.

Hansen would be the better option.
- Fosco

Clearly the moves needed to fix the team aren't easy.

I'm not referring to the problems that the team has had even when they went to the SCF. I'm talking about the hyperbolic whining that occurs after a loss or two.
- Fosco

That whinnying has gone on for three years also. Don't you Remeber after our early exit again last year how twitter boards and hockey boards blew up asking for the heads of Gillis AV The coaching staff and trade the team.

The hyperbolic whining is just as bad as the posters that say everything is just fine in Canuckland when three years of the same show is being played

Bernier is what? 27-28? Hes not good enough to be a starting goalie yet, how long do we wait. 3 mill for a guy playing like a back up isn't a great contract
- Bieksa#3

Bernier is 25. How is he playing like a backup? He has arguably the worst team defense in front of him in the NHL and gets bombarded with shots. Seems like Lu back in Florida when he was 25.