I feel like you're complaining about one individual rather than several of us.
- PhillySportsGuy

Just voicing an opinion. No more, no less

yeah. i mean if were just throwing out ideas, ill take jordan eberle from the oil for despres, and matt read from you guys for a pair of second rounders. (frank). they dont have any you say?
- stayinthefnnet

2018-19 second round picks

In light of NHL news let's talk draft prospects.

2 D who right now are mid round grades I think could be solid picks

Olivier LeBlanc - Saint John Seadogs
Dysin Mayo - Edmonton Oil Kings

2018-19 second round picks
- PhillySportsGuy

deal!!! come on over matty. your consideration for swapping sides in the rivalry? how would you like to be on the other side of crosby and kunitz?

It's an exaggeration, but so is the non stop complaining about context and failings of stats every single time somebody uses them to serve as an example or to better define an opinion.
- Jsaquella

Ok, am I right in saying the whole crux of this discussion is that Grossmann's corsi is an accurate descripton of his play this year? I happen to disagree with that insofar that I think except for January, Grossmann has been what he has always been and to me has been hung out to dry an inordinate amount of times this season.

I personally like Corsi stats in that they can be used as a descriptor to explain certain trends in a players game, but they also fall short in that they don't (and cant) take in to consideration the circumstances of each play/goal. It is what it is. I never gave them much thought until this week. Now I do.

They have their place, but I take issue with any article that uses Corsi as a definitive description of a players success or lack of success. That's all I'm saying.

Personally I think the discussion in here regarding it has been lively and interesting. And it doesn't seem to be one guy against everybody else has it has been portrayed by some. Both sides make good points, and in this case, both sides CAN be right. IE:Corsi is a good measure of a player when used in concert with other stats and "eye" tests.

In light of NHL news let's talk draft prospects.
- ob18

its too depressing to think that this time of year. neither of us have imploded yet!

its too depressing to think that this time of year. neither of us have imploded yet!
- stayinthefnnet

Never too depressing looking to see who could be that hidden gem. What might hurt is that your team could not only pass on them but do it multiple times.

Ok, am I right in saying the whole crux of this discussion is that Grossmann's corsi is an accurate descripton of his play this year? I happen to disagree with that insofar that I think except for January, Grossmann has been what he has always been and to me has been hung out to dry an inordinate amount of times this season.

I personally like Corsi stats in that they can be used as a descriptor to explain certain trends in a players game, but they also fall short in that they don't (and cant) take in to consideration the circumstances of each play/goal. It is what it is. I never gave them much thought until this week. Now I do.

They have their place, but I take issue with any article that uses Corsi as a definitive description of a players success or lack of success. That's all I'm saying.

Personally I think the discussion in here regarding it has been lively and interesting. And it doesn't seem to be one guy against everybody else has it has been portrayed by some. Both sides make good points, and in this case, both sides CAN be right. IE:Corsi is a good measure of a player when used in concert with other stats and "eye" tests.
- MBFlyerfan

and thats what its all about!

In the example given today, Tomahawk used data that was taken from a sample size that included 30 teams each playing between 57 or 60 games. That's not some strange context, it's a large sample size that shows trends over a 5 month period.
- Jsaquella

... and that graphic showed results for all 30-teams over a period of 6-seasons... that's over 13500 games worth of data... showing something that we all seem to agree on around here: having the puck more improves chances of winning.

Yet the minute you say something like "well, the historical record shows that the Flyers might have a tough time making the PO's", people literally throw tantrums.

Never too depressing looking to see who could be that hidden gem. What might hurt is that your team could not only pass on them but do it multiple times.
- ob18

true. ill be the first to admit my knowledge of juniors isnt nearly up there with some of you guys. i usually dont get too familiar unless its WJC stuff or closer to the draft when more content is readily available.

A guy posts a table that covers trends over 2/3rd of a season and you come back with a one game example...and you're going to accuse others of using stats out of context.
- Jsaquella

true. ill be the first to admit my knowledge of juniors isnt nearly up there with some of you guys. i usually dont get too familiar unless its WJC stuff or closer to the draft when more content is readily available.
- stayinthefnnet

Got more into it with the lockout & stuck with it for at least this season. Don't know them all because some leagues are on too early when I'm at work or too late like the WHL which I can watch some of on weekends

Ok, am I right in saying the whole crux of this discussion is that Grossmann's corsi is an accurate descripton of his play this year? I happen to disagree with that insofar that I think except for January, Grossmann has been what he has always been and to me has been hung out to dry an inordinate amount of times this season.

I personally like Corsi stats in that they can be used as a descriptor to explain certain trends in a players game, but they also fall short in that they don't (and cant) take in to consideration the circumstances of each play/goal. It is what it is. I never gave them much thought until this week. Now I do.

They have their place, but I take issue with any article that uses Corsi as a definitive description of a players success or lack of success. That's all I'm saying.

Personally I think the discussion in here regarding it has been lively and interesting. And it doesn't seem to be one guy against everybody else has it has been portrayed by some. Both sides make good points, and in this case, both sides CAN be right. IE:Corsi is a good measure of a player when used in concert with other stats and "eye" tests.
- MBFlyerfan

Nope. I used some Corsi-based stats to show year long trends when Grossmann was on the ice. They were merely used as a supporting argument.

My main issue with Grossmann was his on ice play, which led to me to look at the numbers, which led me to delve deeper into the numbers to see how it impacted his team mates' performance.

The numbers were not presented in a vacuum or in some out of context manner. I stated plainly that the player in question didn't pass the eyeball test, and the numbers backed that assessment.

They never were the primary basis for any post, yet they became the primary focus of some who disagreed with the post, who attacked the numbers as out of context or faulty, and ignored both the context they were used in and the underlying message they were providing.

From that we've had a week plus of anyone using stats as an example get buried under arguments of context & the validity of the numbers. That's my issue with the discussion & the path it has taken.

Ok, am I right in saying the whole crux of this discussion is that Grossmann's corsi is an accurate descripton of his play this year?
- MBFlyerfan

No, somebody was asking about the correlation between shot-event differential and points in the standings. For once, Grossmann wasn't the match that set the blaze.

Never too depressing looking to see who could be that hidden gem. What might hurt is that your team could not only pass on them but do it multiple times.
- ob18

Tyrell Ghoulborne

Got more into it with the lockout & stuck with it for at least this season. Don't know them all because some leagues are on too early when I'm at work or too late like the WHL which I can watch some of on weekends
- ob18

the more hockey the better.

Tyrell Ghoulborne
- Jsaquella

Tyrell Ghoulborne
- Jsaquella

I can always count on you to bring up the sore spots

What's worse... arguing about the merits of fancy stats during an Olympic break... or arguing about CBA particulars during a lockout? Hmmmm.

- stayinthefnnet

He's Zeke Rimdadlidio 2.0

I can always count on you to bring up the sore spots
- ob18

You didn;t buy his jersey, too, did you?

What's worse... arguing about the merits of fancy stats during an Olympic break... or arguing about CBA particulars during a lockout? Hmmmm.
- Tomahawk

I'd rather discuss what those stats tell us, rather than debate the context ad nauseum.

He's Zeke Rimdadlidio 2.0
- Jsaquella

He did have a 3 point game yesterday & was 1st star, I guess that some sort of positive.

Also had 19 minutes in penalties

You didn;t buy his jersey, too, did you?
- Jsaquella

Just Laughton's Oshawa jersey.

In light of NHL news let's talk draft prospects.

2 D who right now are mid round grades I think could be solid picks

Olivier LeBlanc - Saint John Seadogs
Dysin Mayo - Edmonton Oil Kings
- ob18

we need some wing talent