I think Marwood is becoming to powerful, it's very D!ck Cheney like.
- A_SteamingLombardi

And he has allies in his corner...

Love that analogy

I see what you're saying but there's a big difference to me. The unintentional tank will include less cap flexibility, potentially even more NTC's if Benning really dies want to make a UFA splash next year. The purposeful rebuild/tank would likely include more cap flexibility and more draft picks/prospects.

I know the Sedins aren't going anywhere so tanking hard for #1 isn't possible but just being smarter with cap/asset management alone will equal more opportunities to acquire additional draft picks and youth than what Benning has done so far.

It just seems like he's always buying high and selling low, part of that is the situation he walked into but he hasn't exactly given himself more trade leverage since then with what he's done. He still seems like he's in a desperate situation to me.


I have issues with Sutter, Sbisa, Miller/Lack, Prust and even Garrison/Vey/Dorsett to an extent.

The moves just don't make sense when I look at them as a whole. He hasn't created much cap space, or added plenty of picks or really improved the team much outside of Vrbata who's somewhat replacing Kesler's production(admittedly doing a better job than Kesler, but playing a lesser role in other facets).

It seems like Benning has one foot stuck in each door and putting too much faith in a not so deep pool of prospects.
- Nucker101

You are basing everything on 1 year. He hasnt done all these things you list and it's only been 1 year. It's one thing to talk about his contracts which for the most part are short term but you list all these improvements and such and judge on it... one year(less actually). I don't know why you are so offended by me pointing out how you have jumped to conclusions and are way too quick to judge so harshly... it's simple to see by reading the unreasonable positions you have taken. Adding a few pieces to a good team for a run is far easier than correcting several years worth of mistakes and loss of direction but you are only giving Benning one year...

I don't have faith that Benning has the skill to put together a cup contending team down the road but thats not why he is here now... you can stop panicking... most likely we will have a different GM for that *if* we build a team of young assets and they start coming into their prime... or maybe Benning learns his job quicker than you think. For some reason you are not even willing to give a rookie GM more than 1 season to show he has potential. You seem to know everything he will do in the years ahead already...



You seem to be annoyed by the Gillis taunting. You troll us with the Flames crap going all the way back to our series against them but take counter taunting personal. Really?

You are basing everything on 1 year. He hasnt done all these things you list and it's only been 1 year. It's one thing to talk about his contracts which for the most part are short term but you list all these improvements and such and judge on it... one year(less actually). I don't know why you are so offended by me pointing out how you have jumped to conclusions and are way too quick to judge so harshly... it's simple to see by reading the unreasonable positions you have taken. Adding a few pieces to a good team for a run is far easier than correcting several years worth of mistakes and loss of direction but you are only giving Benning one year...

I don't have faith that Benning has the skill to put together a cup contending team down the road but thats not why he is here now... you can stop panicking... most likely we will have a different GM for that *if* we build a team of young assets and they start coming into their prime... or maybe Benning learns his job quicker than you think. For some reason you are not even willing to give a rookie GM more than 1 season to show he has potential. You seem to know everything he will do in the years ahead already...



You seem to be annoyed by the Gillis taunting. You troll us with the Flames crap going all the way back to our series against them but take counter taunting personal. Really?
- boonerbuck

I've said this before, Benning is only here to begin the process and get us to the Sedins retirement, after that he'll have 2-3 years to prove he can make us contenders with the pieces he's put in place. If he fails to do so, he'll be canned quickly and replaced with someone more experienced. As long as he's not doling out longer than 2-3 year deals at market value to players not home grown (or else without the potential of being core players ala Miller/Vrbata/etc) he's not going to cripple the team going forwards if he fails.

And he has allies in his corner...
- Makita

Well here's Scooter Libby now

Any reports on the kind of shape Vey is in?

Any reports on the kind of shape Vey is in?
- VanHockeyGuy

Nucker on steroids I heard

One week to go

I've said this before, Benning is only here to begin the process and get us to the Sedins retirement, after that he'll have 2-3 years to prove he can make us contenders with the pieces he's put in place. If he fails to do so, he'll be canned quickly and replaced with someone more experienced. As long as he's not doling out longer than 2-3 year deals at market value to players not home grown (or else without the potential of being core players ala Miller/Vrbata/etc) he's not going to cripple the team going forwards if he fails.
- DariusKnight

Pretty good assessment. I do however feel that Benning will be given more leeway than we think to build a contender. Like you said alot will hinge on the Sedins transition out and who they get replaced with but considering how well he did in his first season here I can see extra time given to him. This year is big too. But really if we make the playoffs great and if we miss it would be nice to unload players like Edler Hamhuis Burrows and Higgins and utilize what could be a very good draft pick.

Very much like Gillis was in his first few seasons here Ownership is very high on Benning right now...we'll see where it goes.

Any reports on the kind of shape Vey is in?
- VanHockeyGuy

Press box shape if Eller gets here.

Nucker on steroids I heard
- VANTEL

That would be a nice change from Nucker on bath salts.

Pretty good assessment. I do however feel that Benning will be given more leeway than we think to build a contender. Like you said alot will hinge on the Sedins transition out and who they get replaced with but considering how well he did in his first season here I can see extra time given to him. This year is big too. But really if we make the playoffs great and if we miss it would be nice to unload players like Edler Hamhuis Burrows and Higgins and utilize what could be a very good draft pick.

Very much like Gillis was in his first few seasons here Ownership is very high on Benning right now...we'll see where it goes.
- LordHumungous

It's inevitable the team will have a downward cycle at some point, that's not an "unintentional tank" like Nucker calls it, it's just the natural cycle that all teams go thru.

Obviously they're trying to be as competitive as they can while they still have Henrik & Daniel. I mean, the team had a 101 point season last year with his moves, they finished in 8th overall place for Christ sakes???

Nucker whines on a daily basis about poop that's never happened, he whines about lack of value in return for very mediocre players, not real actual value, but rather "his" perception of value.

Benning IMO will be around here for awhile as he and Trevor put together another core of players to succeed the twins. If they have another 90+ point season with this group I'll consider it a success, but, I still think Benning is not going to stop transitioning out the older players.

It's inevitable the team with have a downward cycle at some point, that's not an "unintentional tank" like Nucker calls it, it's just the natural cycle that all teams go thru at some point.

Obviously they're trying to be as competitive as they can while they still have Henrik & Daniel. I mean, the team had a 101 point season last year with his moves, they finished in 8th overall place for Christ sakes???

Nucker whines on a daily basis about poop that's never happened, he whines about lack of value in return for very mediocre players, not real actual value, but rather "his" perception of value.

Benning IMO will be around here for awhile as he and Trevor put together another core of players to succeed the twins. If they have another 90+ point season with this group I'll consider it a success, but, I still think Benning is not going to stop transitioning out the older players.
- LeftCoaster

Well said, sir.

Well said, sir.
- Marwood

Very rarely do two star players (former star players) step out and you've got two fresh stars to step in, it's just such a rarity in the league.

I'll say this about Benning, I think he overpaid for Sutter, however, when he sees something (IMO) that he believes will improve the team and make the Canucks a harder team to play against....he goes for it.

Very rarely do two star players (former star players) step out and you've got two fresh stars to step in, it's just such a rarity in the league.

I'll say this about Benning, I think he overpaid for Sutter, however, when he sees something (IMO) that he believes will improve the team and make the Canucks a harder team to play against....he goes for it.
- LeftCoaster

Agree.
And agree.

Are you hosting the opening night BBQ? Should we bring a Tuscan blend?

Agree.
And agree.

Are you hosting the opening night BBQ? Should we bring a Tuscan blend?
- Marwood

Sound delicious - but I'll have to run that one by the boss

Sound delicious - but I'll have to run that one by the boss
- LeftCoaster

I think Vantel is hosting the one on the mainland but the wine selection will be poop.

Going back 30 years these are the franchises that've picked first overall, not top three, but first overall. Almost 2/3rds of the league has picked FIRST overall, I would hazard a guess that every team has picked top three in that span of time.

Edmonton
Colorado
Florida
NYI
Tampa
Chicago
Pittsburgh
St. Louis
Washington
Columbus
Atlanta/Winnipeg
Boston
Ottawa
Quebec/Colorado
Buffalo
Minnesota/Dallas
Detroit
Toronto

I think Vantel is hosting the one on the mainland but the wine selection will be poop.
- Marwood

BYOB

It's inevitable the team will have a downward cycle at some point, that's not an "unintentional tank" like Nucker calls it, it's just the natural cycle that all teams go thru.

Obviously they're trying to be as competitive as they can while they still have Henrik & Daniel. I mean, the team had a 101 point season last year with his moves, they finished in 8th overall place for Christ sakes???

Nucker whines on a daily basis about poop that's never happened, he whines about lack of value in return for very mediocre players, not real actual value, but rather "his" perception of value.

Benning IMO will be around here for awhile as he and Trevor put together another core of players to succeed the twins. If they have another 90+ point season with this group I'll consider it a success, but, I still think Benning is not going to stop transitioning out the older players.
- LeftCoaster

It's wait and see. You gotta hope that Benning knows what he's doing cause he's the one shaping our team, but I can't say he's going to be successful any more than I can say that he's running the Canucks into the ground.

As long as they play an entertaining game and they keep developing and injecting youth into the line up then it should be a pretty good ride.

It's inevitable the team will have a downward cycle at some point, that's not an "unintentional tank" like Nucker calls it, it's just the natural cycle that all teams go thru.

Obviously they're trying to be as competitive as they can while they still have Henrik & Daniel. I mean, the team had a 101 point season last year with his moves, they finished in 8th overall place for Christ sakes???

Nucker whines on a daily basis about poop that's never happened, he whines about lack of value in return for very mediocre players, not real actual value, but rather "his" perception of value.

Benning IMO will be around here for awhile as he and Trevor put together another core of players to succeed the twins. If they have another 90+ point season with this group I'll consider it a success, but, I still think Benning is not going to stop transitioning out the older players.
- LeftCoaster

He does whine everyday, but don't pretend like there is no basis for it. You yourself have admitted that you thought Benning has made poor decisions in asset management.
What is your definition between "real actual value" and "perception of value" ?

Are they not both perceived? Just one might be your opinion and the other is mine or whoever.

If I was to say Garrison got an underwhelming return in regards for the market value of a top 4 D in his prime, it is my perceived value that I am more than willing to back up with examples.

If you are going to say that is market value I would hope you can back that statement up.

Nucker gets flack, here and some of it rightly so but he absolutely defends his arguments.

Most of the pro-Benning crowd (not necessarily you because I know you disagree with some of his moves) defend his moves with one or a combination of.

He was forced to make a bad trade, because of Gillis,Player X, etc.
Salary cap doesn't matter when you are rebuilding
Getting fair value doesn't matter when you are rebuilding.
NTC's


As far as Benning goes (or stays), he will be here until ownership is no longer happy with the on ice product. I really doubt Aquaman had a plan to only have him here for a short while to rebuild. He will wait and see how the product is and judge him based upon his own definition of success.

I think Vantel is hosting the one on the mainland but the wine selection will be poop.
- Marwood

A nice Compton blend. Hopefully he's already started to let it breathe.

He does whine everyday, but don't pretend like there is no basis for it. You yourself have admitted that you thought Benning has made poor decisions in asset management.
What is your definition between "real actual value" and "perception of value" ?


- belcherbd

My daughter is turning 7 and even she is learning that whining about things doesn't change them. Having a discussion about something is all good, but the incessant criticism of something, especially something that he is pre-determining gets old.

It's wait and see. You gotta hope that Benning knows what he's doing cause he's the one shaping our team, but I can't say he's going to be successful any more than I can say that he's running the Canucks into the ground.

As long as they play an entertaining game and they keep developing and injecting youth into the line up then it should be a pretty good ride.
- CubanBuffet

People seem to forget the season they just had under him. As I just said, they had 101 points and finished 8th overall, so I'm wondering....what are people basing their assessment that this ship is sinking on?

Yes I've outwardly questioned some things he's done, however, I know for a fact that it's an extremely difficult environment to just wholesale change everything out, for any manager, it's just not realistic.

There's absolutely zero foundation to say he's running the team into the ground, there is however, factual information (101 pts) that indicates he knows what he's doing...for the most part.

My daughter is turning 7 and even she is learning that whining about things doesn't change them. Having a discussion about something is all good, but the incessant criticism of something, especially something that he is pre-determining gets old.
- golfingsince

No doubt, and I can get on board with that, but it is a two way street.

My daughter is turning 7 and even she is learning that whining about things doesn't change them. Having a discussion about something is all good, but the incessant criticism of something, especially something that he is pre-determining gets old.
- golfingsince

It's a hockey forum in the summer. We're all of us saying the same things over and over, Nucker's simply taken a pessimistic viewpoint. And not, as far as I can tell, because he's inherently pessimistic, but because that's how he views the team.

Personally, I'm willing to wait and see and hope for the best, but I'm not going to lie, I find the "Everything is Awesome" crowd just as tiring as the Benningadon one.