Most coaches seem to prefer the safer bet that they'll get net-neutral play from a guy like RJ than take the greater risk/reward gamble on a kid like Weal.
IMO, it's pretty stupid. - Tomahawk
Reminds me of the Akeson discussions from last season. Sometimes a coach just knows something about a player, and knows more than fans
You're incorrect that I have an infatuation with Umberger. We'll start there. Umberger does not bring nothing as a player, so that is also incorrect in my opinion.
It is your opinion that Weal, who has never been a regular player in the NHL, and MacDonald absolutely give the team a better shot. If that was that cut and dry, both would be in the lineup. For the record, I would have no problem with Weal and MacDonald in the lineup. - MJL
but you've seen him play, yes? you've seen the astronomical chances he's had without converting, or even contributing to scoring plays. you've seen the advanced stats, minus the only one that is in his favor GF/60, everything else has him as one of the worst players on the flyers even for the little time he does get. weal has never been a regular but then again the kid is only 23 and has played in 11 nhl games, the argument here could also be he has never been given a chance. umberger has been given infinite chances since he was acquired last year, and has produced scoring wise less than sam gagner, who you've been documented as saying brings nothing if he isnt scoring. yet, gagner has scored more in less games.
i guess we will agree to disagree on our opinions on the player, but can you really argue for umberger in that if we are to have any success in the second half, it will not be due to anything he contributes.
Location: Driver's Seat: Mitch Marner bandwagon. Grab 'em by the Corsi. Joined: 02.04.2009
Feb 2 @ 1:08 PM ET
Reminds me of the Akeson discussions from last season. - MJL
If they do decide to dress Weal, I would sure hope that Hak has enough brain not to use him like Chief used Akeson last season, that's for damned sure.
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Feb 2 @ 1:11 PM ET
I know, you've made that clear, but I don't know how many times I have to state that the Flyers are still trying to win games, and the coach is going to play who he thinks gives the team the best chance right now. Right now, the coach does not seem to think that includes Weal. I honestly don't see what the big deal is concerning Weal. It's Feb 2nd, and there is plenty of time to audition prospects if it comes to that. - MJL
and I don't agree with what the coach, who I actually like a lot so far, thinks is the best chance to win.
but you've seen him play, yes? you've seen the astronomical chances he's had without converting, or even contributing to scoring plays. you've seen the advanced stats, minus the only one that is in his favor GF/60, everything else has him as one of the worst players on the flyers even for the little time he does get. weal has never been a regular but then again the kid is only 23 and has played in 11 nhl games, the argument here could also be he has never been given a chance. umberger has been given infinite chances since he was acquired last year, and has produced scoring wise less than sam gagner, who you've been documented as saying brings nothing if he isnt scoring. yet, gagner has scored more in less games.
i guess we will agree to disagree on our opinions on the player, but can you really argue for umberger in that if we are to have any success in the second half, it will not be due to anything he contributes. - sjk540
Flyers are a solid team defensively at 5 on 5. Umberger contributes to that. Check out Umberger's GF/60 stat if you get a chance. That's just for kicks.
Coaches aren't in the business of giving players a chance just because a fan doesn't think a player has been given a chance. A coach is in the business of putting the bet lineup on the ice that he thinks gives the team the best chance to win. Umberger is scratched tonight, I have no issue with that, despite my "infatuation" with the player. In fact, I won't have a problem if Umberger doesn't play a game the rest of the season for the Flyers, or ever again.
and sometimes a coach doesn't. damn hitch - nastyflyergirl
Coaches aren't infallible, but most of the time, they know more than a fan does. I guess Hakstol just doesn't know what he's doing by not playing Weal. I have no problem if Weal plays, or if he doesn't play. Personally, I'd like to see him play, but I'm not going to get bent out of shape if he doesn't.
What do you think... Drouin a possibility? That's been kicked around a bit. Do you have those pieces to give? If they don't make the playoffs you probably get a new management team I think.
Your team can't be that bad losing one player.
Can it? - mayorofangrytown
I can't see Yzerman trading him inside the division. I'd be very surprised.
Bergevin would have to overpay. Not sure I'd want that as a fan.
Therrien has always had them working hard since he came back to coach here. It sometimes happens in hockey, it's not because the players loathe the coach...the message just doesn't get across anymore. Maybe they are at that point.
Price is a big part of the team, certainly helps that he's great outside of his crease and almost acts as a 3rd defenseman. Can't really expect that losing last year's league MVP wouldn't have any consequences... but he doesn't score goals.
The goaltenders that have been there while he was out (Tokarski-Scrivens-Condon)....well, can't really say they have great stats, but they mostly get zero offensive support.
If they do decide to dress Weal, I would sure hope that Hak has enough brain not to use him like Chief used Akeson last season, that's for damned sure. - Tomahawk
Cart before the horse. The player earns how he is used with his play.
but you've seen him play, yes? you've seen the astronomical chances he's had without converting, or even contributing to scoring plays. you've seen the advanced stats, minus the only one that is in his favor GF/60, everything else has him as one of the worst players on the flyers even for the little time he does get. weal has never been a regular but then again the kid is only 23 and has played in 11 nhl games, the argument here could also be he has never been given a chance. umberger has been given infinite chances since he was acquired last year, and has produced scoring wise less than sam gagner, who you've been documented as saying brings nothing if he isnt scoring. yet, gagner has scored more in less games.
i guess we will agree to disagree on our opinions on the player, but can you really argue for umberger in that if we are to have any success in the second half, it will not be due to anything he contributes. - sjk540
Not trying to defend Umberberger, just pointing out that you're spelling his name wrong.
But getting chances is half the battle in the NHL. sure he sucks and him not scoring in 50 games is laughable...but he is getting chances over the last handful of games
Flyers are a solid team defensively at 5 on 5. Umberger contributes to that. Check out Umberger's GF/60 stat if you get a chance. That's just for kicks.
Coaches aren't in the business of giving players a chance just because a fan doesn't think a player has been given a chance. A coach is in the business of putting the bet lineup on the ice that he thinks gives the team the best chance to win. Umberger is scratched tonight, I have no issue with that, despite my "infatuation" with the player. In fact, I won't have a problem if Umberger doesn't play a game the rest of the season for the Flyers, or ever again. - MJL
I don't think it's people saying they know more then the coach. I think it's they want to know a why. We were given a why with Vinny.(wasn't able to keep pace, no real spot to play).
But the reason of "providing structure' I believe left people questioning that. Especially for a team that is struggling to score and Umberger hasn't scored in 50 games.
We aren't there every minute of every day at every practice. So when they do get a player like Weal, who has done everything at the AHL pretty much, and is a skill player, you do ant to see him play.
If this team was in 2nd in the metro I don't think there would be much complaining to see an unknown player. But this is a team trying to just get to the playoff bubble.
I don't get bent out of shape because I know there is a lot to the lineup. I do believe a lot will be settled after the TDL. If guys can be moved you and the Flyers struggled in February then I do think you'll start to see a transition a little in the roster.
