Here is what else can happen. You trade some of those assets now to better the team. Down the road, other weaknesses develop. Let's say Patrick, Sanheim or Myers doesn't work. That along with prospects not developing has now weakened the prospect stable you have. You've also traded draft picks in an effort to won now. Right back to where they were under Holmgren.
- MJL

Why is every trade either prospects/picks for veterans to get better?

I love Lindbloms game but if there was a deal where I thought I was getting better I would look at it.

Simmonds could be moved to get better. Voracek could be moved to try and get better for now and future.


Teams can make deals like that where it shifts the roster without picks and prospects. Look at Galchenyuk for Domi.

The Hamilton and Hanifin deal.

It's like its this or that for most people. Why can't a smart GM come in hear and make a deal to help now without burning the bridges to the future

I don't recall Hextall putting a time period on it.
- MJL

I get that most people were losing patience. I understand that. the product has been overall bad. good some nights and embarrassing the next. not just bad but embarrassing. but all in all, I understood Hextall's plan and just wish the organization would have let him see it through without meddling. Obviously money is involved so that rarely will happen.

Maybe the organization should have blown this up when Hextall took over rather than the win while trying to rebuild

Here is what else can happen. You trade some of those assets now to better the team. Down the road, other weaknesses develop. Let's say Patrick, Sanheim or Myers doesn't work. That along with prospects not developing has now weakened the prospect stable you have. You've also traded draft picks in an effort to won now. Right back to where they were under Holmgren.
- MJL

No one has a patent on how to perfectly build a team. You look back and you'll see Cup winners with home grown and traded for assets. Jesus, the page has been turned. I'm now looking forward for things to happen to help make this team start to be competitive.

Which current players or prospects fit that description?
- MJL

None, really, though I was speaking about Patrick

I'm honestly not worried about any of the under-25s on this team

TBH, I'd be looking to move Simmonds and Voracek, a few others. Team just might be stale. Feels like it

Won't be able to move all of the older players, and you shouldn't. But it might be time to move a couple

Why is every trade either prospects/picks for veterans to get better?

I love Lindbloms game but if there was a deal where I thought I was getting better I would look at it.

Simmonds could be moved to get better. Voracek could be moved to try and get better for now and future.


Teams can make deals like that where it shifts the roster without picks and prospects. Look at Galchenyuk for Domi.

The Hamilton and Hanifin deal.

It's like its this or that for most people. Why can't a smart GM come in hear and make a deal to help now without burning the bridges to the future
- J35Bacher

Limdblom is a rookie. The first sentence I wrote used the term assets.

The team does look neutered don't they?

I miss Konecny and his chirping. Cousins used to be great at that. Simmonds used to look physically involved.

To me this team always seem to play better with a little controlled chaos on the ice.
- J35Bacher

Patrick was chirping Brady last night was funny. Brady tried to get puck through and Patrick blocked it and went to Sens bench and Patrick just stared him down and said you’re not getting poop on me and Brady and whoever else hopped on Patrick

Here is what else can happen. You trade some of those assets now to better the team. Down the road, other weaknesses develop. Let's say Patrick, Sanheim or Myers doesn't work. That along with prospects not developing has now weakened the prospect stable you have. You've also traded draft picks in an effort to won now. Right back to where they were under Holmgren.
- MJL

If you want to deal in extremes all the time fine. I deal in reality.

While this all makes sense and is what a normal person would do, I think Dave Scott wants to be a BUYER at the TDL and that kind of scares me
- bulet13

Not necessarily. Most TDL guys are on the back end of a contract. Some of these guys are talented. If we can trade and sign somebody for the long term - that would work. If were not going the playoffs, or a bubble team. It would be stupid to trade for a short term guy, with no hope of signing.

I watched the whole game last night and at the end I saw a young Ottawa team have fun. I remember just a couple of months ago people calling that team a Dumpster Fire. I wonder what team players outside of the Flyers organization would identify as being a Dumpster Fire?
- RustyPipes

I don't think you saw fun in the first 2 periods...they didn't like being hit..but what you did see is a team that knows they may not be that good and have all the pieces they need, but they play for each other and their young star led the way in not giving up...our team thinks it is better than it is and they don't play every shift for each other...I also did not see a Flyers team that played the first few minutes of that game very well...They spent the first couple of minutes hemmed in thier own zone and the Sens had a couple fo early chances...not what I expected from a Flyers team that should have hit the ice like they had been shot out of a cannon...the reality is that as constructed today and with the coaches they have today, this team is not competitive with the upper 2/3rds of the league and most nights does not compete for 60 minutes against any of the league...

The reason the puck went in for the Sens was they did not give up...They created their own puck luck...The Flyers by their effort do not on a consistent basis.

Patrick was chirping Brady last night was funny. Brady tried to get puck through and Patrick blocked it and went to Sens bench and Patrick just stared him down and said you’re not getting poop on me and Brady and whoever else hopped on Patrick
- arichardson22

Saw the stare down on TV, but didn't know what happened.

No one has a patent on how to perfectly build a team. You look back and you'll see Cup winners with home grown and traded for assets. Jesus, the page has been turned. I'm now looking forward for things to happen to help make this team start to be competitive.
- RustyPipes

Thats where Hextalls vision of building not only a Cup winner but a sustainable team capable of contending over a.significant period of time comes in. An important nuance.

None, really, though I was speaking about Patrick

I'm honestly not worried about any of the under-25s on this team

TBH, I'd be looking to move Simmonds and Voracek, a few others. Team just might be stale. Feels like it

Won't be able to move all of the older players, and you shouldn't. But it might be time to move a couple
- AllInForFlyers

Does moving them make the team better now or worse?

It took a good 4 seasons just to (mostly) dig out of the salary cap and prospect holes.
- Tomahawk

and this is why i wanted to see hextall's plan to the end. I mean, this isn't the NBA or NFL where kids drafted jump right into the NHL and succeed. I mean, how many players a draft year do that? Its not realistic to have expected a lot of the kids Hextall drafted to be impact players at this point.

Limdblom is a rookie. The first sentence I wrote used the term assets.
- MJL

You said assets but only talked about 3 young players. Voracek, Simmonds, Lindblom. They are assets too.

Not every trade to get better needs to include your youth.

If you want to deal in extremes all the time fine. I deal in reality.
- MBFlyerfan

It's not an extreme. It's history. History is reality.

you're obviously being sarcastic and over the top but the pause i have isn't that they will start to trade "all of the prospects" as much as its they will trade the wrong prospects or make bad trades like Forsberg for Erat or a Patrick Sharp trade, etc. I get that sometimes young players or picks get traded. I just am not sure I have confidence the right decisions will be made
- nastyflyergirl

That's a valid concern. However, Forsberg for Erat is up there with the worst of the worst. Sharp for Ellison wasn't trading a pick for a fix, it was trading a C prospect for a LW prospect, and Sharp hadn't shown much at the NHL level when he was traded.

No team is going to "win" every trade. I'm hoping that the GM is good enough in his prospect and team evaluation to know what is and isn't good asset management. Hextall's "management" was to never trade any of them at all, and I don't think that was right, either.

Does moving them make the team better now or worse?
- MJL

You say this all the time but there is no answer unless you know the return.

Simmonds and 2rd rounder for Trouba? Does that make them better or worse?

You ask an unanswerable question.

You said assets but only talked about 3 young players. Voracek, Simmonds, Lindblom. They are assets too.

Not every trade to get better needs to include your youth.
- J35Bacher

Not every trade of a veteran makes you better. Most times a trade of a player like Voracek sets a team back.

I don't think you saw fun in the first 2 periods...they didn't like being hit..but what you did see is a team that knows they may not be that good and have all the pieces they need, but they play for each other and their young star led the way in not giving up...our team thinks it is better than it is and they don't play every shift for each other...I also did not see a Flyers team that played the first few minutes of that game very well...They spent the first couple of minutes hemmed in thier own zone and the Sens had a couple fo early chances...not what I expected from a Flyers team that should have hit the ice like they had been shot out of a cannon...the reality is that as constructed today and with the coaches they have today, this team is not competitive with the upper 2/3rds of the league and most nights does not compete for 60 minutes against any of the league...

The reason the puck went in for the Sens was they did not give up...They created their own puck luck...The Flyers by their effort do not on a consistent basis.
- JW98FlyerFan

I agree and I also throw Jake's admission into this and I see a team that has the talent, but are to lazy (or passive if you will) for a complete 60 minute game. The thing is, we as fans aren't the only ones who see this. The whole league knows this and so do all perspective GMs.

You say this all the time but there is no answer unless you know the return.

Simmonds and 2rd rounder for Trouba? Does that make them better or worse?

You ask an unanswerable question.
- J35Bacher

The design of the question was to provoke looking at both sides of the coin.

Does moving them make the team better now or worse?
- MJL

That can't be answered until you see what you get

Some deals would likely make them better, because they could add piece(s) that could help them tighten up a few areas

Obviously, the inverse could be true. No way to tell in hypotheticals, either way

No one has a patent on how to perfectly build a team. You look back and you'll see Cup winners with home grown and traded for assets. Jesus, the page has been turned. I'm now looking forward for things to happen to help make this team start to be competitive.
- RustyPipes

The players attitudes / team moral, and coaching have a big part of winning. Just look at a team like Vegas. IMO, this more than were the players came from... Vegas didn't home grow or trade (not much) to create a winning team. From all reports, Hextall style wasn't creating a winning attitude throughout the organization. I just can't figure out why Holmgren decided to fire him now, and not over last summer. There had to have been a final straw moment.

Saw the stare down on TV, but didn't know what happened.
- RustyPipes

Gave me a good laugh haha. First it was staredown and I was like please say something please and he just ripped right into him haha

If you want to deal in extremes all the time fine. I deal in reality.
- MBFlyerfan

Didn't you steal this quote from a StarWars movie? Obi Wan preaching to Anakin?

The players attitudes / team moral, and coaching have a big part of winning. Just look at a team like Vegas. IMO, this more than were the players came from... Vegas didn't home grow or trade (not much) to create a winning team. From all reports, Hextall style wasn't creating a winning attitude throughout the organization. I just can't figure out why Holmgren decided to fire him now, and not over last summer. There had to have been a final straw moment.
- leon neon

Great point on Vegas - McPhee and staff were able to choose their type of player that they wanted from each team and it worked well.

I also agree, there must have been a final straw about something.