Eichel is on pace for LESS shots on goal this season
Your entire premise is based on an incorrect assumption
- jdfitz77

And so is Skinner, because they're playing a more buttoned-down defensive system than under Wowie Housley

Skinner would absolutely take a share of Eichel's shots

You’ll have no trouble getting “wet” then sir
- jdfitz77

All you have to do is stand on the corner of Allen/Elmwood and catch a contact buzz, honestly.

If I beat you 54 to 27, I still win no matter how much I spent, right? You would think with your competitive nature, you would understand that very simple concept but I digress.
- BeadyEyedDouche

Sure, if you’re talking nominal returns. Ennis T his salary has produced a better return on investment though than Skinner has.

If Skinner is on Eichel's line, he's taking a lot of Eichel's shots and goals. Eichel would get more assists. The result would largely be the same. -10 goals for Eichel, +10 assists. +10 goals for Skinner

As for the Olofsson part, if you're disappointed with his 5-on-5 production with Eichel, it would be nonexistent with Mojo and Frolik
- jcragcrumple

You completely ignore the fact that Eichel would still be racking up the points on the Power Play - both assists and goals.

We are horrible at 5v5 scoring. Skinner is actually one of the better 5v5 scorers in the NHL.

What's to say Skinner and Eichel don't BOTH have 30+ goals this year, Olofsson performs BETTER in the middle-6 and the team's overall chemistry isn't better?

It was never tried, not even once this season.

All these fans sticking up for players who have been leading the team into the gutter for how many years? Skinner has been shooting blanks all year but he has his lovers; Reinhart is tough to figure. He would be fine for a 2nd maybe 3rd line winger on a good team but to be the team's top, most prominent winger helps lead them where they are today. People want them to win but want to pay a player who can't be found when he is needed the most a huge contract and doesn't even know if he could do it without an MVP type center. We have some idea because when Jack was hurt a few years ago for 6 weeks he didn't lead the way but stand by your man.

Anyhoo, loyalty is bliss.

You completely ignore the fact that Eichel would still be racking up the points on the Power Play - both assists and goals.

We are horrible at 5v5 scoring. Skinner is actually one of the better 5v5 scorers in the NHL.

What's to say Skinner and Eichel don't BOTH have 30+ goals this year, Olofsson performs BETTER in the middle-6 and the team's overall chemistry isn't better?

It was never tried, not even once this season.
- BeadyEyedDouche

Theres only one puck to go around. If Skinner is shooting then Eichel isn't. Eichel is probably getting more assists and Skinner is getting the goals. We'd be getting essentially the same production.

Get a 2nd line center so we dont depend on one guy for everyone else and you've solved a lot of the problems

And so is Skinner, because they're playing a more buttoned-down defensive system than under Wowie Housley

Skinner would absolutely take a share of Eichel's shots
- jcragcrumple

Why can't it be both of them shoot and score more? Jack has crazy-legs Reinhart 10 feet behind him and 125lbs soaking-wet Olofsson being smothered in the corner and you tell me a literal figure skater being out there in one of their places wouldn't create more chances and be more exciting...

I can't believe it's March and the only thing meaningful as a Sabres fan is the same exact conversations we've been having all year long because our incompetent coach and GM can't figure out how to motivate their players to actually give a crap, but when you're treating them like teenagers, why should they?

Sure, if you’re talking nominal returns. Ennis T his salary has produced a better return on investment though than Skinner has.
- Pegullaville

I would spend 8 million dollars more to score more goals than the other team if it means we get a Stanley Cup.

Ennis does absolutely nothing for any team at this stage in his career. You're seriously talking about replacing Skinner with Ennis because of salary?

Most people don't earn their wages. People who get paid less often do. It's not a coincidence.

Ennis is earning his league-minimum contract in a make it or break it year for him. I wouldn't be surprised if he's not even in the league next year.

Skinner is being punished, buried in the middle-6 playing 12 minutes a night, if he's lucky, getting swarmed by 3 opposing players the second he touches the puck and playing on one of the most infuriatingly mediocre teams I have ever seen play, is STILL 4th on thew team in goals having missed 10 games and finally got to play with Eichel a little bit recently and lo and behold! He's started scoring again!

Madness, I tell you.

Get a 2nd line center so we dont depend on one guy for everyone else and you've solved a lot of the problems
- jcragcrumple

I'm not going to argue something no one can actually know or prove, but at least we all agree and know our biggest issue is this.

Why can't it be both of them shoot and score more? Jack has crazy-legs Reinhart 10 feet behind him and 125lbs soaking-wet Olofsson being smothered in the corner and you tell me a literal figure skater being out there in one of their places wouldn't create more chances and be more exciting...

I can't believe it's March and the only thing meaningful as a Sabres fan is the same exact conversations we've been having all year long because our incompetent coach and GM can't figure out how to motivate their players to actually give a crap, but when you're treating them like teenagers, why should they?
- BeadyEyedDouche

My position is that you cant motivate Mojo or Lazar to be actual 2Cs because they just aren't that. If you want multi-line production, you have to solve the fundamental problem that has plagued the team for 2 years - lack of a 2C and 3C. Blaming the individual players is just window dressing for the underlying issues imo

My position is that you cant motivate Mojo or Lazar to be actual 2Cs because they just aren't that. If you want multi-line production, you have to solve the fundamental problem that has plagued the team for 2 years - lack of a 2C and 3C. Blaming the individual players is just window dressing for the underlying issues imo
- jcragcrumple

Yeah but you can motivate them to suck less.

I would spend 8 million dollars more to score more goals than the other team if it means we get a Stanley Cup.

Ennis does absolutely nothing for any team at this stage in his career. You're seriously talking about replacing Skinner with Ennis because of salary?

Most people don't earn their wages. People who get paid less often do. It's not a coincidence.

Ennis is earning his league-minimum contract in a make it or break it year for him. I wouldn't be surprised if he's not even in the league next year.

Skinner is being punished, buried in the middle-6 playing 12 minutes a night, if he's lucky, getting swarmed by 3 opposing players the second he touches the puck and playing on one of the most infuriatingly mediocre teams I have ever seen play, is STILL 4th on thew team in goals having missed 10 games and finally got to play with Eichel a little bit recently and lo and behold! He's started scoring again!

Madness, I tell you.
- BeadyEyedDouche

"punished" that's is He seems to come out and play when he wants to, but it sounds like you want to have a protest for the poor little guy.

Yeah but you can motivate them to suck less.
- BeadyEyedDouche

Expecting Mojo to be more than a .5 PPG player at center was wishful thinking. 27/56 is reasonable considering he is not a center

BYFIELD BYFIELD BYFIELD Lundell Lundell Lundell

Theres only one puck to go around. If Skinner is shooting then Eichel isn't. Eichel is probably getting more assists and Skinner is getting the goals. We'd be getting essentially the same production.

Get a 2nd line center so we dont depend on one guy for everyone else and you've solved a lot of the problems
- jcragcrumple

Brilliant!!!

Pray tell, what second line you are referring to? We have a 2/3rds of a 1st line and a 4th line and a blob of Jello in the middle-6.

Trading a defensemen who requested a trade and Reinhart for Laine instantly makes us a better team and I absolutely throw in this year's 1st to get it done.

We still need to address the 2C position, still have Olofsson, still have Mittelstadt, have Cozens coming up, multiple contracts coming off the books this summer...

If we can land Laine for those pieces, I would be 100% on-board with re-signing Girgensons and Larsson for our 4th line, letting Frolik, Sobotka go, sign Lazar for that 13th forward position and attacking the offseason like a bat out of Hell.
- BeadyEyedDouche

Presuming Risto could be moved for a 2nd liner,
+ Sam, + pick10
Those 3 assets could easily make up a great 2nd line
I was just trying to say that you’re giving up a lot

But to play along, your lineup leaves us thin
Looks something like:
Skinner-Eichel-Laine
Olofsson- 2C - RW2
Kahun-Cozens-Mitts
Girgs-Larsson-Okposo

*and what pieces are left to get that 2C & RW2 ?

OR

Skinner-Jack-Sam
Olofsson- 2C - RW2
Kahun-Cozens-Mitts
LOG/Lazar

*still need that 2C & RW2,
but we have Risto & pick10 to use in this case to help fill those holes

It's not his fault there's only one competent offensive center option.

Had he switched to skinner on the top line, there would have been more goals for Skinner, fewer for Eichel and none for Olofsson. Shuffling pieces around isn't that effective when the talent pool is as deep as a puddle
- jcragcrumple

This we can agree on

And so is Skinner, because they're playing a more buttoned-down defensive system than under Wowie Housley

Skinner would absolutely take a share of Eichel's shots
- jcragcrumple

Eichel is scoring MORE goals while shooting LESS
There is absolutely ZERO correlation as to whether or not Skinner is on his line & less shots for Eichel equaling less goals

All you have to do is stand on the corner of Allen/Elmwood and catch a contact buzz, honestly.
- BeadyEyedDouche

Lol. You’re not wrong

Sure, if you’re talking nominal returns. Ennis T his salary has produced a better return on investment though than Skinner has.
- Pegullaville

U can say that about pretty much every winger in the league that makes over $2mil

It’s a horrible comparison

I would spend 8 million dollars more to score more goals than the other team if it means we get a Stanley Cup.

Ennis does absolutely nothing for any team at this stage in his career. You're seriously talking about replacing Skinner with Ennis because of salary?

Most people don't earn their wages. People who get paid less often do. It's not a coincidence.

Ennis is earning his league-minimum contract in a make it or break it year for him. I wouldn't be surprised if he's not even in the league next year.

Skinner is being punished, buried in the middle-6 playing 12 minutes a night, if he's lucky, getting swarmed by 3 opposing players the second he touches the puck and playing on one of the most infuriatingly mediocre teams I have ever seen play, is STILL 4th on thew team in goals having missed 10 games and finally got to play with Eichel a little bit recently and lo and behold! He's started scoring again!

Madness, I tell you.
- BeadyEyedDouche

How many more points do we have in this years standings due to having Skinner ?

Switch Ennis and skinner and you still don’t have a functioning middle 6.

Add a 2C and a 1A/1B goaltender and whether you have Skinner or “take your pick of any winger option that will be available this year” both players will produce. Is the $8M more you are paying Skinner worth the additional production ? I say not. We could have gotten both Haula and Burakovsky for $9M and been a much better team then Skinner rotting away at our cap.

Eichel is scoring MORE goals while shooting LESS
There is absolutely ZERO correlation as to whether or not Skinner is on his line & less shots for Eichel equaling less goals
- jdfitz77

Ok, now subtract 50 shots from Eichel, add 50 to Skinner and tell me where we land. Because the totals from under Housley are meaningless under Krueger.

Reinhart's shots are down too.

Skinner is absolutely going to take some of Eichel's shots. Eichel made a concerted effort this year to be less of a pass-first guy. If Skinner is on his line, he's going to try to set him up.

Skinner gets more goals, Eichel gets fewer and more assists. We're in the same place

How many more points do we have in this years standings due to having Skinner ?

Switch Ennis and skinner and you still don’t have a functioning middle 6.

Add a 2C and a 1A/1B goaltender and whether you have Skinner or “take your pick of any winger option that will be available this year” both players will produce. Is the $8M more you are paying Skinner worth the additional production ? I say not. We could have gotten both Haula and Burakovsky for $9M and been a much better team then Skinner rotting away at our cap.
- Pegullaville

Lovely hindsight
But last summer, your argument was that we shouldn’t “overpay” Skinner

Does that extra $1mil or so make a difference in the standings?
No, it doesn’t

Ok, now subtract 50 shots from Eichel, add 50 to Skinner and tell me where we land. Because the totals from under Housley are meaningless under Krueger.

Reinhart's shots are down too.

Skinner is absolutely going to take some of Eichel's shots. Eichel made a concerted effort this year to be less of a pass-first guy. If Skinner is on his line, he's going to try to set him up.

Skinner gets more goals, Eichel gets fewer and more assists. We're in the same place
- jcragcrumple

You’re making unfounded assumptions on every level of your argument

Skinner is better than Olofsson, right?
How do u know that line wouldn’t just produce 50more shots with him on it over Olofsson?
That’s less than 1 extra shot per game,
with a good 5v5 player like Skinner taking the place of an average one

How many more points do we have in this years standings due to having Skinner ?

Switch Ennis and skinner and you still don’t have a functioning middle 6.

Add a 2C and a 1A/1B goaltender and whether you have Skinner or “take your pick of any winger option that will be available this year” both players will produce. Is the $8M more you are paying Skinner worth the additional production ? I say not. We could have gotten both Haula and Burakovsky for $9M and been a much better team then Skinner rotting away at our cap.
- Pegullaville

Carolina jumped from 83 pts the year with Skinner to 99 the year after they dealt him. Gain by subtraction? Players practiced harder? No idea but they didn't miss him.