I agree but its still relevant, no two examples or cases would ever be the same so excuses can be made for anyone.

I was simply pointing out a case where someone chose retirement over however many millions we were offering.
- Ross77

I hope the Jets weren't offering 37 year old Bieksa millions of dollars.

I agree but its still relevant, no two examples or cases would ever be the same so excuses can be made for anyone.

I was simply pointing out a case where someone chose retirement over however many millions we were offering.
- Ross77

It’s also incredibly concerning that the Jets we’re there trying to sign a 37 year old Kevin Bieksa after years of him being totally ass.

The Jets just can’t get over the big and experienced fetish.

If that is the logic, then I am expecting Morrissey to log the most TOI on LD, while Beaulieu cruises to a 40+ point season...... Because Fox and DeAngelo sure had an easy time eclipising Trouba. Generally more TOI means more points. So lets look at the 5v5 play.

Trouba had 23 points, was a -12, with 62 PIMS (leading the rangers D by a mile)
DeAngelo had 53 points, was a +12, with 47 pims
Fox had 34 points, +22, with 32 pims.
Shatternkirk whos' buyout will cost the Rags 6M this coming season, and 1.5M AAV for the 2 years to follow notched 34 points, +22, and 38 PIMS this season

I don't see any situation how you can think this trade was a win for the Rags. I know people don't like +/- stats, and that is fair. But it should be noted when your 5v5 goal differential is a minimum of 24 different from your team mates after a shortened season. That 8M is very steep and who do you think is out there logging the tough PK minutes every time he takes an indiscipline penalty. So with that logic, I can't wait to watch the Jets bottom pairing absolute rack up the points...........
- bikeguy99

I, too, judge trades entirely based off of one year.

Shattenkirk was done in the Rangers’ eyes well before Trouba became available. That’s not related to this conversation of Pionk and Trouba.

You also never acknowledged my question of why you think Trouba will continue to trend down after one erratic season? Do you also expect Morrissey to continue to trend down? He went from promising future star, to legit top pairing guy, to struggling 2nd pairing defenceman in 2 years.

It’s also incredibly concerning that the Jets we’re there trying to sign a 37 year old Kevin Bieksa after years of him being totally ass.

The Jets just can’t get over the big and experienced fetish.
- Rexypoo

4 more years and they can try to lure Tyler Myers back.

It’s also incredibly concerning that the Jets we’re there trying to sign a 37 year old Kevin Bieksa after years of him being totally ass.

The Jets just can’t get over the big and experienced fetish.
- Rexypoo

How old was Serge Savard when he came to The Peg, not saying Bieksa was a Serge Savard?
I'm thinking Zdeno Chara - 41-yrs old and like 6'8" might have looked good on the Jets blue-line the last few years, maybe even this year.

But no, not all big oldies are golden oldies.

I, too, judge trades entirely based off of one year.

Shattenkirk was done in the Rangers’ eyes well before Trouba became available. That’s not related to this conversation of Pionk and Trouba.

You also never acknowledged my question of why you think Trouba will continue to trend down after one erratic season? Do you also expect Morrissey to continue to trend down? He went from promising future star, to legit top pairing guy, to struggling 2nd pairing defenceman in 2 years.
- Rexypoo

Trouba may have had too much tutoring from Zack Bogosian?

To me, Morrissey has not been quite the same player since suffering a major injury in, what, early 2019? Sometimes it takes a player a full year to get over an injury. I hope this is the case here.

4 more years and they can try to lure Tyler Myers back.

- BWJumper

On a another topic, "thanks" for the article Anthony! Great to keep the Jets "Hockey Buzz" alive. Very interesting!

4 more years and they can try to lure Tyler Myers back.

- BWJumper

Well, they were front runners in trying to get Bogosian back at the deadline. So getting Myers back is not inconceivable.

On another note, I had not watched hockey in some time. I turned on the Islanders/Lightning game on last night and saw Andrew Ladd. I was surprised to learn that he was still playing hockey.

There was a time on this board where some posters thought he was untouchable as well. Too bad Dano did not work out as that would have been a crazy deal for the Jets. I am hopeful that Stanley works out.

One thing I also find amusing is that some hockey people keep suggesting that a 34 year career right winger in Wheeler can somehow easily transition to Center.

Perhaps this is a way to motivate a 23 year old Jack Roslovic? I can hear both Chevy and Maurice now, "Don't worry Jack in 11 years you will be developed enough to play your natural position!"

Lol!!!

How old was Serge Savard when he came to The Peg, not saying Bieksa was a Serge Savard?
I'm thinking Zdeno Chara - 41-yrs old and like 6'8" might have looked good on the Jets blue-line the last few years, maybe even this year.

But no, not all big oldies are golden oldies.
- grahamzky

Serge Savard was not quite as old, and in a different era.

Chara is the exception, not the rule, and he’s not half the player he was a decade ago. Zdeno at 35 was a force, not he’s more of a decent shove.

Hell, even Wheeler is a weird one. He topped out at 30-31. That’s very unusual.

One thing I also find amusing is that some hockey people keep suggesting that a 34 year career right winger in Wheeler can somehow easily transition to Center.

Perhaps this is a way to motivate a 23 year old Jack Roslovic? I can hear both Chevy and Maurice now, "Don't worry Jack in 11 years you will be developed enough to play your natural position!"

Lol!!!
- TheUltimateJet

Wheeler can’t transition to centre. If anything, he needs to be moved to 2nd RW to keep him rolling.

As for Roslovic, he’s a winger now. His game just completely falls apart when he’s a centre. The reads are slower, he’s hesitant, and he lags behind the play. Let him be the solid RW he is.

Copp is your 2C.

Wheeler can’t transition to centre. If anything, he needs to be moved to 2nd RW to keep him rolling.

As for Roslovic, he’s a winger now. His game just completely falls apart when he’s a centre. The reads are slower, he’s hesitant, and he lags behind the play. Let him be the solid RW he is.

Copp is your 2C.
- Rexypoo

Sure and when Scheifele gets injured due to overuse by Maurice, Copp is your number one, which I am sure will strike fear into the hearts of opponents around the NHL

If that is the logic, then I am expecting Morrissey to log the most TOI on LD, while Beaulieu cruises to a 40+ point season...... Because Fox and DeAngelo sure had an easy time eclipising Trouba. Generally more TOI means more points. So lets look at the 5v5 play.

Trouba had 23 points, was a -12, with 62 PIMS (leading the rangers D by a mile)
DeAngelo had 53 points, was a +12, with 47 pims
Fox had 34 points, +22, with 32 pims.
Shatternkirk whos' buyout will cost the Rags 6M this coming season, and 1.5M AAV for the 2 years to follow notched 34 points, +22, and 38 PIMS this season

I don't see any situation how you can think this trade was a win for the Rags. I know people don't like +/- stats, and that is fair. But it should be noted when your 5v5 goal differential is a minimum of 24 different from your team mates after a shortened season. That 8M is very steep and who do you think is out there logging the tough PK minutes every time he takes an indiscipline penalty. So with that logic, I can't wait to watch the Jets bottom pairing absolute rack up the points...........
- bikeguy99

Where did I say I thought the Rangers won the trade?
I didn't say that, just commented that I'm sure I'd heard he played the most minutes of any Rangers dman this season which if true I assume he's asked to go against the other teams top lines, maybe I'm wrong about that idk.

Comparing Beaulieu to Deangelo and Fox is silly but idk if Trouba was getting the tougher assignments then swap Deangelo or Fox in there and I wonder what the results would've been.

Like I said I'm no Trouba fan but the guys who have to play against the top competition sometimes don't have as good of numbers, that being said playing a shutdown role is the best place for Trouba as he's really not the greatest offensive dman and sucks on the powerplay, still can't believe in his last season in Winnipeg he had the point totals he did for a guy that was as crappy on the powerplay as he was... Lol

Where did I say I thought the Rangers won the trade?
I didn't say that, just commented that I'm sure I'd heard he played the most minutes of any Rangers dman this season which if true I assume he's asked to go against the other teams top lines, maybe I'm wrong about that idk.

Comparing Beaulieu to Deangelo and Fox is silly but idk if Trouba was getting the tougher assignments then swap Deangelo or Fox in there and I wonder what the results would've been.

Like I said I'm no Trouba fan but the guys who have to play against the top competition sometimes don't have as good of numbers, that being said playing a shutdown role is the best place for Trouba as he's really not the greatest offensive dman and sucks on the powerplay, still can't believe in his last season in Winnipeg he had the point totals he did for a guy that was as crappy on the powerplay as he was... Lol
- JetFuel

Again you are making arguments that may be too complex to understand. Quality of competition apparently balances out. For an example if Scheifele and Connor go up against Draisatl and McDavid, it's the same as Copp and Lowry going up against Sheehan and Khaira. Both match ups will result in +/- of 0.

Sure and when Scheifele gets injured due to overuse by Maurice, Copp is your number one, which I am sure will strike fear into the hearts of opponents around the NHL
- TheUltimateJet

Connor-Copp-Wheeler would 100% fare better at line 1 than Connor-Scheifele-Wheeler has.

That said, Scheifele is obviously the better player

Serge Savard was not quite as old, and in a different era.

Chara is the exception, not the rule, and he’s not half the player he was a decade ago. Zdeno at 35 was a force, not he’s more of a decent shove.

Hell, even Wheeler is a weird one. He topped out at 30-31. That’s very unusual.
- Rexypoo

Funny, just a few years ago, the big debate was who should the Sens keep - Chara or Wade Redden.
I think they made a mistake (although at the time I didn't).

I think this whole off season dialogue of us being full of holes is blown way out of proportion. I honestly feel a different coaching staff could make this team look significantly different and better with the exact line up

-we need another Righ shot D, hopefully top 4 yes, that is true.
-we could use another center yes, but Wheeler or Copp could do the job if we better positioned the wingers they have to compliment them.
-I have faith both Harkins and Roslovic will be better as will Connor, Laine and Ehlers.
-Heinola and Samberg are already better and improvements over Bitteto, Sbiza, Beaulieu, Kuliand Dahlstrom.
-Vessalainen is a wild card, has all the tools will his attitude and desire to be better kick in? IMO Vessalainen already has the 2nd best one timer on the roster and would be awesome on 2nd pp.

anyways, i'd love to see a couple moves but don't bring in guys like Hamonic who are not good to block younger guys who are better.

and most importantly….Fire Maurice
- Ross77

Well for me I'm seeing a team with a lot of holes, will this team be competitive with some internal growth?
Yup, will it be a contender with some internal growth? Nah, sorry I just don't see it.

So I just wonder is this team being seen as a potential contender with a couple additions or is it a transition year, if the goal is to contend I think this lineup needs some fairly substantial changes, more then Chevy could accomplish in one offseason considering his history.

I too think a different coach could get more out of this group but I just doubt a different coaching staff could squeeze a cup out of this team as its currently constructed even with a couple dmen added.

Don't see Maurice going anywhere, I think ownership thinks very highly of him.

Just my $0.02.

Wheeler can’t transition to centre. If anything, he needs to be moved to 2nd RW to keep him rolling.

As for Roslovic, he’s a winger now. His game just completely falls apart when he’s a centre. The reads are slower, he’s hesitant, and he lags behind the play. Let him be the solid RW he is.

Copp is your 2C.
- Rexypoo

I thought Roslovic did pretty well at center this season, should've been playing center the entire year imo.

I thought Roslovic did pretty well at center this season, should've been playing center the entire year imo.
- JetFuel

That 2015 line definitely was very impressive. Did exactly what a really good third line is supposed to do, and that is score to help out the top two lines.

That 2015 line definitely was very impressive. Did exactly what a really good third line is supposed to do, and that is score to help out the top two lines.
- TheUltimateJet

I’ll allow the 2015 line. Anything else, Roslovic better be on the wing

Funny, just a few years ago, the big debate was who should the Sens keep - Chara or Wade Redden.
I think they made a mistake (although at the time I didn't).
- grahamzky

Honestly, keeping either of them in that situation in 2020 would be a mistake.
But could’ve predicted Redden would decline almost instantaneously, while Chara would fend off his decline until his late 30s

Re: Trouba
Unfortunately Chevy got screwed over by Trouba and his agent, to the point where the trade could only be made with the Rangers (possibly 1 other team). Chevy did the best he could under the circumstances.

Re: Trouba
Unfortunately Chevy got screwed over by Trouba and his agent, to the point where the trade could only be made with the Rangers (possibly 1 other team). Chevy did the best he could under the circumstances.
- bennythehat

And whose fault was to wait until he was 1 year away from ufa status. Trouba asked for a trade in 2016 and didn't get traded for 3 seasons.

And whose fault was to wait until he was 1 year away from ufa status. Trouba asked for a trade in 2016 and didn't get traded for 3 seasons.
- BWJumper

Yep, this. Should have traded him while he was on his original bridge deal. I understand wanting to wait it out, and try to change his mind, but now that we know his reasons for wanting to be a Ranger, he should’ve been moved in 2017. He was obviously not staying

And whose fault was to wait until he was 1 year away from ufa status. Trouba asked for a trade in 2016 and didn't get traded for 3 seasons.
- BWJumper

This just goes to show how our GM has no intentions of ever being proactive.

I have said since the 2017-18 season that this franchise needs to make a bold move. The lack of boldness has this team tail spinning into the abyss.