And yet he couldn’t stay healthy anymore, why you ask, cause he was tiny and chose to go back to a less contact, less hitting league to live out his years.
- Ross77

His knees were gone, and he played with a broken foot for a long stretch. He wasn’t getting low bridged. It was just wear and tear. It happens.

The strange thing is you would think if he was having so much trouble in the corners, it would be reflected in the results... and yet, it wasn’t. Because an opposing forward with possession down low doesn’t have all that many options when the passing lane is covered by the enormous stick, and they can’t go to the net because they have no speed or momentum now.

I’m confident Ross that you’re the taller and larger man of the two of us, but you’re not running through me if we start 2 feet apart standing still

A different season and a different excuse for Jets fans. Are people really thinking defensive size is what's preventing the Jets from winning?

Maybe I'm remembering incorrectly but I seem to recall the Jets losing in the first round of the playoffs twice, and missing them entirely twice in the past 5 years prior to this season with Byfuglien, Trouba and Myers.

A different season and a different excuse for Jets fans. Are people really thinking defensive size is what's preventing the Jets from winning?

Maybe I'm remembering incorrectly but I seem to recall the Jets losing in the first round of the playoffs twice, and missing them entirely twice in the past 5 years prior to this season with Byfuglien, Trouba and Myers.
- BWJumper

Yes cause discussing the lack of size on the Jets defense means fans think that's the only thing wrong with the team.

Doubt any Jets fans are delusional enough to think lack of size on the defense it's what's preventing them from winning.

Gawd knows there's many things wrong with the Jets, having a D core of runts is just one thing on the list.

A different season and a different excuse for Jets fans. Are people really thinking defensive size is what's preventing the Jets from winning?

Maybe I'm remembering incorrectly but I seem to recall the Jets losing in the first round of the playoffs twice, and missing them entirely twice in the past 5 years prior to this season with Byfuglien, Trouba and Myers.
- BWJumper

The Jets issue are 90% coaching. We could stand to ice a better blueline, but it’s manageable with strong systems and a deliberate youth movement including Ville and Samberg.
These things won’t be happening any time soon, unfortunately.

The Jets will continue to be mediocre by not producing enough in front of the other teams net, and allowing Hellebuyck to face a constant stream of high danger chances right in front of his net because we keep icing scrubs we picked off waivers or signed in September at league minimum over any kids

Yes cause discussing the lack of size on the Jets defense means fans think that's the only thing wrong with the team.

Doubt any Jets fans are delusional enough to think lack of size on the defense it's what's preventing them from winning.

Gawd knows there's many things wrong with the Jets, having a D core of runts is just one thing on the list.
- JetFuel

And yet you completely ignore the second half of my post, which pointed out the Jets defense had all the size they could want and it led to little to no success.

Rexpoo is right, on where the main issue is. Give me the same Jets team that was together in the July training camp and a different coach and you will see many of the problems the Jets had go away.

And yet you completely ignore the second half of my post, which pointed out the Jets defense had all the size they could want and it led to little to no success.

Rexpoo is right, on where the main issue is. Give me the same Jets team that was together in the August training camp and a different coach and you will see many of the problems the Jets had go away.
- BWJumper

So the Jets defense is better now then it was last season? Really? Ya I know that group didn't go all the way but we're kidding ourselves if we think the D we had when we went to the Western Conference Final wasn't a thousand times better then what we rolled out this season.

You came on and said we're making excuses saying the small D was the sole reason they lost which no one was, it was just a topic being discussed, like I said I doubt any Jets fans think it's the sole reason they lost, there's many reasons and too many small D that get pushed around easily is just one of them.

Yeah I know Maurice is a problem but we weren't discussing him, a different coach would help though improvements in the lineup need to happen, there's only so much that can be done with this current group.

The defense that went to the conference final, was the same that missed the playoffs the prior 2 years before that, and was only missing Enstrom the year after that when they went out in the first round, and look at the stats from Jan on that year they were as bad as this year.

And where did i say that it was the sole reason they lost? It's just another excuse on top of many the fanbase can come up with.
- BWJumper

The bottom line is this: Josh Morrissey, Dylan DeMelo, and Neal Pionk are the top 3 defencemen on this team right now. All 3 have had goals scored against us as a direct result of being outsized. This will always happen. You can put 3 prime age, Norris calibre Zdeno Charas on a pairing with each of them, and it will still happen.
I’m willing to bet that maybe 5% of the goals against for any of them are a result of size alone. Why are we trying to beat all the side quests before you finish the main storyline? Our system is broken, not our average height. I’m willing to bet Jacob Trouba has allowed as many goals by having more weight behind him to stop and start as Morrissey has by being pushed around.

It is literally impossible to overcome Josh Morrissey being Josh Morrissey sized in any way other than by being Josh Morrissey himself. Almost all of those smaller players have been exactly that at every stage of their career. They’ve already learned long ago how to get around the size advantage. If they hadn’t, they wouldn’t make the NHL.

Josh Morrissey got around it in junior by turning himself into a f*cking human missile. He lit people up full force at centre ice, would pop off in any scrum he was involved in, and just generally let it be known he won’t take any sh*t. Now he just gets out of the way, because he’s too valuable to take penalties that way.
Toby Enstrom, for example, went the other direction. He just got himself out of the crosshairs at every opportunity. Don’t start none, won’t be none.
Then you have the 3rd type, like a McAvoy or even a Grant Clitsome. Just get so heavy for your height that you might as well be 6’4”.

So you can go ahead and build a blueline of 6’5” monsters with the same skillset as Morrissey, but much like comparing a UFC heavyweight to a welterweight, you’ll find a new set of complications in the fact that Josh Morrissey will almost always be faster than his enormous doppelgänger

So the Jets defense is better now then it was last season? Really? Ya I know that group didn't go all the way but we're kidding ourselves if we think the D we had when we went to the Western Conference Final wasn't a thousand times better then what we rolled out this season.

You came on and said we're making excuses saying the small D was the sole reason they lost which no one was, it was just a topic being discussed, like I said I doubt any Jets fans think it's the sole reason they lost, there's many reasons and too many small D that get pushed around easily is just one of them.

Yeah I know Maurice is a problem but we weren't discussing him, a different coach would help though improvements in the lineup need to happen, there's only so much that can be done with this current group.
- JetFuel

The defense that went to the conference final, was the same that missed the playoffs the prior 2 years before that, and was only missing Enstrom the year after that when they went out in the first round, and look at the stats from Jan on that year they were as bad as this year.

And where did i say that it was the sole reason they lost? It's just another excuse on top of many the fanbase can come up with.

The bottom line is this: Josh Morrissey, Dylan DeMelo, and Neal Pionk are the top 3 defencemen on this team right now. All 3 have had goals scored against us as a direct result of being outsized. This will always happen. You can put 3 prime age, Norris calibre Zdeno Charas on a pairing with each of them, and it will still happen.
I’m willing to bet that maybe 5% of the goals against for any of them are a result of size alone. Why are we trying to beat all the side quests before you finish the main storyline? Our system is broken, not our average height. I’m willing to bet Jacob Trouba has allowed as many goals by having more weight behind him to stop and start as Morrissey has by being pushed around.

It is literally impossible to overcome Josh Morrissey being Josh Morrissey sized in any way other than by being Josh Morrissey himself. Almost all of those smaller players have been exactly that at every stage of their career. They’ve already learned long ago how to get around the size advantage. If they hadn’t, they wouldn’t make the NHL.

Josh Morrissey got around it in junior by turning himself into a f*cking human missile. He lit people up full force at centre ice, would pop off in any scrum he was involved in, and just generally let it be known he won’t take any sh*t. Now he just gets out of the way, because he’s too valuable to take penalties that way.
Toby Enstrom, for example, went the other direction. He just got himself out of the crosshairs at every opportunity. Don’t start none, won’t be none.
Then you have the 3rd type, like a McAvoy or even a Grant Clitsome. Just get so heavy for your height that you might as well be 6’4”.

So you can go ahead and build a blueline of 6’5” monsters with the same skillset as Morrissey, but much like comparing a UFC heavyweight to a welterweight, you’ll find a new set of complications in the fact that Josh Morrissey will almost always be faster than his enormous doppelgänger
- Rexypoo

Glad we see eye to eye on this Rexypoo. I guess the Jets should have started Sbisa and Dahlstrom if size was a problem.

Glad we see eye to eye on this Rexypoo. I guess the Jets should have started Sbisa and Dahlstrom if size was a problem.
- BWJumper

Needing big defenseman is old school Paul Maurice thinking!

The defense that went to the conference final, was the same that missed the playoffs the prior 2 years before that, and was only missing Enstrom the year after that when they went out in the first round, and look at the stats from Jan on that year they were as bad as this year.

And where did i say that it was the sole reason they lost? It's just another excuse on top of many the fanbase can come up with.
- BWJumper

The 15-16 Jets didn't have Laine or Connor yet
The 16-17 season was lost due to terrible goaltending, don't know if that team was a contender but it could of been a playoff team had Chevy acquired an average goalie
17-18 Jets were Western Conference Finalists
18-19 Jets imploded for some internal reason
19-20 Jets Trouba traded, Buff quit, Myers & Chiarot gone in free agency, replaced by lesser quality dmen

I just don't see how discussing one of the perceived needs to improve the Jets is making excuses, not that I think Maurice will ever coach a team to a cup but blaming all of what ails the Jets on him now that would be making an excuse, in the end there's multiple things wrong with the Jets, they're just flat out not good enough, Tampa Bay looks like they're cruising to a cup win and their 3rd D pairing is better then the Jets top D pairing, that pretty much says it all about the state of the Jets lineup and how far from being a contender it really is.

Laine’s better. Lol
- BernardShakey

Oh yeah LOL. 15 K Jets fans with smiles screaming that.

Enstrom was the most effective defensive player in the NHL during his last season. The Toby-Buff pairing was top 3 defensively.
- Rexypoo

This is some evidence of the need for both size and skill. Enstrom was more free to do his thing because of the physicality Buff brought to the table. Same as Trouba-Morrissey, Methot-Karlsson and every other successful playoff defensive pairing.

I think you are on to something that there are good undersized d-men out there and overlooked who can be effective in a favourable situation. The issue is finding the big body that can learn to compliment their game.

Oh yeah LOL. 15 K Jets fans with smiles screaming that.
- RogerRoeper

and 1 million Leafs fans pouting and believing it for the season. That was a good day to be a Jet fan.

The 15-16 Jets didn't have Laine or Connor yet
The 16-17 season was lost due to terrible goaltending, don't know if that team was a contender but it could of been a playoff team had Chevy acquired an average goalie
17-18 Jets were Western Conference Finalists
18-19 Jets imploded for some internal reason
19-20 Jets Trouba traded, Buff quit, Myers & Chiarot gone in free agency, replaced by lesser quality dmen

I just don't see how discussing one of the perceived needs to improve the Jets is making excuses, not that I think Maurice will ever coach a team to a cup but blaming all of what ails the Jets on him now that would be making an excuse, in the end there's multiple things wrong with the Jets, they're just flat out not good enough, Tampa Bay looks like they're cruising to a cup win and their 3rd D pairing is better then the Jets top D pairing, that pretty much says it all about the state of the Jets lineup and how far from being a contender it really is.
- JetFuel

What's the constant for the Jets for the past 6 seasons? It's the coaching. If you want to find an excuse the logical conclusion for the Jets lack of success is there, instead of the 22 players on the roster.
Or if you believe it's the players, go even further back the GM has had 9 years to build a contender through draft and development, he was suppose to have accomplished that in 2018, 2 years later and they weren't even a playoff threat which shouldn't have happened once you have your core in place.

This is some evidence of the need for both size and skill. Enstrom was more free to do his thing because of the physicality Buff brought to the table. Same as Trouba-Morrissey, Methot-Karlsson and every other successful playoff defensive pairing.

I think you are on to something that there are good undersized d-men out there and overlooked who can be effective in a favourable situation. The issue is finding the big body that can learn to compliment their game.
- 2.0

Definitely good under-sized d-men out there and who play very effectively, with some being stars.
That being said, definitely those good under-sized d-men play bigger and better when they have a bigger body beside them who can have their back. Then we wouldn't get run out of the building by guys like Tkachuk, Lucic and Bennett.

Our Jets need some size to protect guys like Heinola and Morrissey - guys like Edmundson, and someone mentioned Cernak who would be a great fit - and guys who can clear the front of the net and provide some lacking grit.
No that fact alone won't make us SC champs but it's a start.

You can certainly get away, IMO, with, say, two smaller guys with talent on a team's back-end, but after that, you'd better look for some muscle with accompanying NHL skill.

What's the constant for the Jets for the past 6 seasons? It's the coaching. If you want to find an excuse the logical conclusion for the Jets lack of success is there, instead of the 22 players on the roster.
Or if you believe it's the players, go even further back the GM has had 9 years to build a contender through draft and development, he was suppose to have accomplished that in 2018, 2 years later and they weren't even a playoff threat which shouldn't have happened once you have your core in place.
- BWJumper

Thing is you could have Scotty Bowman, Barry Trotz, Jon Cooper, Punch Imlach and Toe Blake running the bench, and you might not win.
As well, you could have Sammy Pollock or Steve Yzerman putting the team together and you may not win.

Oh, don't worry, I too swear at coaching and management at times (often?)

Look at the Leafs, (not picking on them) - the last Stanley Cup parade in 1967. I'm sure they've had some good coaches and GM's since that time.
It usually takes several years, and a smattering of good luck, in between, or first Cups. 30 NHL teams (and their fans) are disappointed each year.
Our turn will come! Patience, my friend, patience. Do the Jets entertain us?

Thing is you could have Scotty Bowman, Barry Trotz, Jon Cooper, Punch Imlach and Toe Blake running the bench, and you might not win.
As well, you could have Sammy Pollock or Steve Yzerman putting the team together and you may not win.

Oh, don't worry, I too swear at coaching and management at times (often?)

Look at the Leafs, (not picking on them) - the last Stanley Cup parade in 1967. I'm sure they've had some good coaches and GM's since that time.
It usually takes several years, and a smattering of good luck, in between, or first Cups. 30 NHL teams (and their fans) are disappointed each year.
Our turn will come! Patience, my friend, patience. Do the Jets entertain us?
- grahamzky

Patience will turn the 2 most important players on the team (Scheifele, Hellebuyck) into 31 year old UFA's looking for big money contracts

This is some evidence of the need for both size and skill. Enstrom was more free to do his thing because of the physicality Buff brought to the table. Same as Trouba-Morrissey, Methot-Karlsson and every other successful playoff defensive pairing.

I think you are on to something that there are good undersized d-men out there and overlooked who can be effective in a favourable situation. The issue is finding the big body that can learn to compliment their game.
- 2.0

Read my novel about Morrissey.
Also, Methot-Karlsson worked because of Karlsson being the best right shooting defenceman in history. He was the better of the two defensively, and it wasn’t close

Definitely good under-sized d-men out there and who play very effectively, with some being stars.
That being said, definitely those good under-sized d-men play bigger and better when they have a bigger body beside them who can have their back. Then we wouldn't get run out of the building by guys like Tkachuk, Lucic and Bennett.

Our Jets need some size to protect guys like Heinola and Morrissey - guys like Edmundson, and someone mentioned Cernak who would be a great fit - and guys who can clear the front of the net and provide some lacking grit.
No that fact alone won't make us SC champs but it's a start.

You can certainly get away, IMO, with, say, two smaller guys with talent on a team's back-end, but after that, you'd better look for some muscle with accompanying NHL skill.
- grahamzky

Edmundson is a bad hockey player.
Cernak I’ll take

Thing is you could have Scotty Bowman, Barry Trotz, Jon Cooper, Punch Imlach and Toe Blake running the bench, and you might not win.
As well, you could have Sammy Pollock or Steve Yzerman putting the team together and you may not win.

Oh, don't worry, I too swear at coaching and management at times (often?)

Look at the Leafs, (not picking on them) - the last Stanley Cup parade in 1967. I'm sure they've had some good coaches and GM's since that time.
It usually takes several years, and a smattering of good luck, in between, or first Cups. 30 NHL teams (and their fans) are disappointed each year.
Our turn will come! Patience, my friend, patience. Do the Jets entertain us?
- grahamzky

Patience will run this core out of its window. We are already in danger of it closing altogether. Scheifele and Hellebuyck have 5 years at best to get it done as top guys.

But to answer your question: the Jets do not entertain me. They are an incredibly difficult team to watch.
Watching this Jets squad is like trying to paint your house with a whiteboard marker. It’s slow, arduous, and while it will technically end up the right colour, it’s ultimately super unrewarding and will probably give you a headache

Pionk for Letang

Pionk for Letang
- Rexypoo

Letang has a NMC

Hated Enstrom’s long stick. He couldn’t shoot, take passes, or stickhandle with it.

Letang has a NMC
- grahamzky

Letang told his teammates not to expect him back, Rutherford is apparently taking offers