Here's how I see it. PIT will have to move some cap hit to make room for Karlsson. If Hawks are retaining part of Karllson's cap hit (which I don't want to happen) they have to receive a sweetener. Garlund alone won't be the sweetener. I imagine hopefully a 2nd round pick, plus, plus, comes back from PIT. Pens have a poor prospect pool except for Yager. In fact if it was me, the only way the Hawks take on the 4 year, 4M or so cap hit for Karllson would be for Yager. Then also maybe SJS sends a pick/prospect too.

Agree Toronto has little to offer the Hawks for taking Murray.
- boilermaker100

Ok. It's 2 separate transactions we're talking about. I didn't realize that initially.

I think the Hawks are sitting ok with future picks for now. I'd prefer KD pass on retaining on Karllson for 4 years unless it was for a blue chip prospect which, as you pointed out, Pittsburgh doesn't have much of.

Same with the Leaves. Not much prospect-wise that they would be willing to give up and that 2nd to take on Murray is going to be a late one. Still top 64 but late nonetheless.

Where did you see that?

Don't want to retain for 4 years on Karlsson. If anything take Granlund and the picks for future considerations in a separate trade with the Penguins enabling them to shed some cap hit. Then buy out Granlund. Hawks will have a second buy out window since Kurashev is going to arbitration.
- boilermaker100

I don’t mind being the middleman for Karlsson. But I hope we at least get a first round pick, plus, plus.

I can't answer that question for you. If you don't see the difference between Dumba and Zaitsev then any answer I give you, won't make your comprehension any easier.
- bjphawkfan

My comprehension is usually pretty good. Maybe my question wasn’t clear. What would be the point in making the defense marginally better in the short term? There are a number of Hawk prospects on the horizon. Why would the Hawks sign a very average defenseman in Dumba who is going to want term on a free agent deal?

Lets hope you are right. Davidson is tough to predict.


I was hoping between the cooking classes and comedy club tours at Development Camp that one or all of Rinzel, Moore and Nazar were going to renounce their college scholarships and play in the CHL. They could play twice the games and have much bigger roles in juniors than playing on College teams with lots of older guys ahead of them.
- stevefrmglencoe

So far Davidson has been easy to predict. Not one prospect has been rushed, not one. In fact it could be argued by some Vlasic and Reichel could have been up with the big club all last yr. I don't think so but a case could be made for it.

There is no one path fits all but I love the NCAA path if at all possible. NCAA is bigger, older, more mature (structure) than the CHL along with more practice time, weight room and film room time too.

Nazar was penciled in L2 to start last yr as a true freshman. Nobody is in his way at the U of MI. Rinzel is not ready for big minutes or role in the NCAA or CHL. So, nobody is in his way cuz he's not ready, yet. This kid was on the 2nd unit PP with his USHL club last yr as a 19 yr old and not on the ice in the last minute unless they were behind and needing a goal. Rinzel has a ways to go.

Moore will probably start on L2 and 2nd unit PP at U of MN as a true freshman. They have a great squad and that will allow the kid to acclimate unhurried, much like Nazar before he was hurt. Perfect path for Moore IMO and he'll play in big games next yr.

Here's how I see it. PIT will have to move some cap hit to make room for Karlsson. If Hawks are retaining part of Karllson's cap hit (which I don't want to happen) they have to receive a sweetener. Garlund alone won't be the sweetener. I imagine hopefully a 2nd round pick, plus, plus, comes back from PIT. Pens have a poor prospect pool except for Yager. In fact if it was me, the only way the Hawks take on the 4 year, 4M or so cap hit for Karllson would be for Yager. Then also maybe SJS sends a pick/prospect too.

Agree Toronto has little to offer the Hawks for taking Murray.
- boilermaker100

Knies, a first, and a third.

Although Kaiser is probably more advanced than both Vlasic and Phillips, Kaiser has one more year on his ELC than Vlasic and Phillips. Since winning is not the main object, I would hope that Vlasic and Phillips at least start the year playing regularly with the big squad and Kaiser in the minors. Wouldn't you want to see what you had in Vlasic and Phillips before having to decide what kind of contract (or to trade them etc.) to offer them?

How many more years do you hold a prospect back before seeing what they can do? This isn't the 2015 Hawks with a veteran coach that could give a hoot about developing anyone. If Matthias Samuelson, Devon Toews, K'Andre Miller, etc. etc. were on the Hawks, based upon the BOD, they would still be getting their requisite 250 games in the minors before maybe becoming the seventh defenseman on the team, or maybe needing another 200 games to really make sure they are ready?

Also, the Hawks are about to have a car crash as far as defenseman go. Your top 4 in Rockford next year are delMaestro, Allen, Kaiser, Roos. (I can see Louis Creivier is going to win the Adam Gaudette/Dylan Sikura BOD trophy). If you keep Vlasic and Phillips in the minors by picking up another veteran defenseman (Caleb Jones?
), how much playing time do these 4 get ? And you have Korchinski on the big squad next year?
- LAHawk

Well Allen has been playing the RD position, i believe after the trade he's actually been paired with Korchinski, so maybe one less car crash

My comprehension is usually pretty good. Maybe my question wasn’t clear. What would be the point in making the defense marginally better in the short term? There are a number of Hawk prospects on the horizon. Why would the Hawks sign a very average defenseman in Dumba who is going to want term on a free agent deal?
- paulr

I believe that these are teaching years. Mentorship if you will. Isn't that why Foligno and Perry are here? Hall? I just think Dumba would add to that role. If he wants more then I withdraw my suggestion. I thought he would be better than the rookies listening to Murphy. I guess I just didn't comprehend your comment.

So far Davidson has been easy to predict. Not one prospect has been rushed, not one. In fact it could be argued by some Vlasic and Reichel could have been up with the big club all last yr. I don't think so but a case could be made for it.

There is no one path fits all but I love the NCAA path if at all possible. NCAA is bigger, older, more mature (structure) than the CHL along with more practice time, weight room and film room time too.

Nazar was penciled in L2 to start last yr as a true freshman. Nobody is in his way at the U of MI. Rinzel is not ready for big minutes or role in the NCAA or CHL. So, nobody is in his way cuz he's not ready, yet. This kid was on the 2nd unit PP with his USHL club last yr as a 19 yr old and not on the ice in the last minute unless they were behind and needing a goal. Rinzel has a ways to go.

Moore will probably start on L2 and 2nd unit PP at U of MN as a true freshman. They have a great squad and that will allow the kid to acclimate unhurried, much like Nazar before he was hurt. Perfect path for Moore IMO and he'll play in big games next yr.
- Mr Ricochet

He certainly hasn't rushed any prospects who were already in the organization when he got the big chair. We'll see if the modus operandi changes with guys he drafted. It is not just internet GM's and draft Gurus who like to be right. What they do with KK will say a lot.

He certainly hasn't rushed any prospects who were already in the organization when he got the big chair. We'll see if the modus operandi changes with guys he drafted. It is not just internet GM's and draft Gurus who like to be right. What they do with KK will say a lot.
- mohel

Had not thought of this angle, Mo. Indeed, another of many questions about the KD era we'll soon have answers for.

And I hope you're off alleging KD might make ego driven decisions. Looks like a KK PR effort could be underway but I do have confidence they won't rush him.

Fun times for Hawks fans. ..... Personally, I'm near fascinated to see how they proceed/evaluate the D prospects this yr. In some ways this is where the rubber hits the road for KD, his evaluators and LR as well.

He certainly hasn't rushed any prospects who were already in the organization when he got the big chair. We'll see if the modus operandi changes with guys he drafted. It is not just internet GM's and draft Gurus who like to be right. What they do with KK will say a lot.
- mohel

They have pretty much said they'll give him the opportunity to take the role but if he doesn't and if it takes 5 or 30 game to figure that out they aren't worried about burning a year.

I've beaten this horse but Keith was a mess his first year and not great his second. He could skate real good and you'd say to yourself - man if he could put it all together, especially with that athletic ability maybe he'll be pretty good one day. It's not like they sent him down. they let him take his lumps and learn. I don't think that anyone thought he would pretty much will a team to a cup on one leg at that point or be a top 5 defender in the league for a decade.

Pretty hilarious Michigan State gaffe and not super impressive in the AHL.

Sometimes these guys are ready but they aren't ready to be good until they get their heads kicked in for a year or two in the NHL.

DeBrincat and Brannstrom's names have been removed from the Ottawa's roster and the Hawks are attached to Gibson from the Ducks according to Hawk Nation. Do not see that happening.

They have pretty much said they'll give him the opportunity to take the role but if he doesn't and if it takes 5 or 30 game to figure that out they aren't worried about burning a year.

I've beaten this horse but Keith was a mess his first year and not great his second. He could skate real good and you'd say to yourself - man if he could put it all together, especially with that athletic ability maybe he'll be pretty good one day. It's not like they sent him down. they let him take his lumps and learn. I don't think that anyone thought he would pretty much will a team to a cup on one leg at that point or be a top 5 defender in the league for a decade.

Pretty hilarious Michigan State gaffe and not super impressive in the AHL.

Sometimes these guys are ready but they aren't ready to be good until they get their heads kicked in for a year or two in the NHL.
- fattybeef

Respectfully disagree that Keith was ever a mess. He was on a team that was 20 games below .500 and was very impressive. Many of the 3,000 people who were at the home games were amazed by his skating and stick. I don't ever remember him being shielded. The Hawks brought Seabrook along slower and it was a couple of season's until he was playing against top lines. Also as I remember it Keith left Michigan State because he wanted to play more hockey and had no interest in being Prom King.

If I were KD, and Pit wanted me to be the middle man in the deal, I start DlCrosby. Can you imagine Crosby mentoring Bedard?
- powerenforcer

If this is true with these rumors, then imo Davidson should dictate what he wants back. Knives from Toronto for taking Murry contract and Yager from Pittsburgh for taking grandlun contract. Otherwise hang up the phone. So as I see Toronto is over the cap by 8 million give or take so brodie and Murry costs them knies and draft pick. Pittsburgh same situation not as bad as Toronto , hawks take grandlun and rutta contracts for Yager and pick or just grandlun for a 2nd and 4th. Davidson is in the driver seat hear so he should be asking for a high return, but be realistic and Meet in the middle.

Had not thought of this angle, Mo. Indeed, another of many questions about the KD era we'll soon have answers for.

And I hope you're off alleging KD might make ego driven decisions. Looks like a KK PR effort could be underway but I do have confidence they won't rush him.

Fun times for Hawks fans. ..... Personally, I'm near fascinated to see how they proceed/evaluate the D prospects this yr. In some ways this is where the rubber hits the road for KD, his evaluators and LR as well.
- Mr Ricochet

Indeed: Fun times ahead
We may be excited some moments KK shows well then other times clearly he needs to not play NHL next season as he is not ready. Just plan on watching preseason if you want to see future Blackhawks

Evaluation of KD and Richardson will turn out well; I believe most would say they expect a good job is (will be done)

One interesting future development could be what KD might extract for one of his kiddie dmen. Perhaps a polished or NHL ready forward exchanged for the equally ready forward. Who knows if straight up trade. My idea is more about finding the type center perhaps a good L2 offensive center as we might see some of our drafted centers move to wing. Then too some of our centers already drafted might be superior as a third line center but not as productive offensively as preferred for L2 duty.

I really hope in a few years we have four solid lines to roll and each dman skates fairly well to above average. Dmen who can handle the puck fairly well but are not offensive dynamos from blue line - wish for Allen, Vlasic, Crevier, even DelMastro - now this could be the description of a well balanced deep team. I imagine a comparison the 2010 team build but upgrade the blue line quality depth

DeBrincat and Brannstrom's names have been removed from the Ottawa's roster and the Hawks are attached to Gibson from the Ducks according to Hawk Nation. Do not see that happening.
- bjphawkfan

Gibson doesn’t make sense for the Hawks and the Ducks don’t need to shed his salary.

Gibson doesn’t make sense for the Hawks and the Ducks don’t need to shed his salary.
- DarthKane

Gibson for Knies

Samsonov and Gibson duo

Gibson doesn’t make sense for the Hawks and the Ducks don’t need to shed his salary.
- DarthKane

The over/under on Mrazek pulling his groin is 1.

DeBrincat and Brannstrom's names have been removed from the Ottawa's roster and the Hawks are attached to Gibson from the Ducks according to Hawk Nation. Do not see that happening.
- bjphawkfan

Maybe hawks are the middle man I deal where Anaheim gets DeBrincat and brannstrom's and Ottawa gets Gibson.

Gibson doesn’t make sense for the Hawks and the Ducks don’t need to shed his salary.
- DarthKane

I have read that Gibson is extremely unhappy in Duck land and he say's he will not play for them.

I have read that Gibson is extremely unhappy in Duck land and he say's he will not play for them.
- bjphawkfan

He is from Pittsburgh so maybe something there possibly.

The over/under on Mrazek pulling his groin is 1.
- rpeters01

I'll take the second period

The over/under on Mrazek pulling his groin is 1.
- rpeters01

1 second into the first pre-season game? Agreed.

I'll take the second period
- 6628

Wait and see if he makes it out of camp and the exhibition season, I have my doubts.

Is Perry on the upswing? Foligno? Would he maybe help out the young defensemen more than Murphy, Jones or any other veteran?
- bjphawkfan

No DUMBA will not.

Jones and Murphy have more leadership qualities and tire life.

He is from Pittsburgh so maybe something there possibly.
- Scott1977

Maybe
But Penguins cannot afford to be surrendering any more assets to upgrade in goal. Their goaltending isn’t bad anyway
As for trading Yager, he is their checking center with some offense to his game as well. They may have Crosby until he retired but Malkin and Letang I bet go for draft choices after next season. Dumas must rebuild maybe on the fly because the team does have good players; it is just that Crosby, Malkin and Letang are getting too old to be always the big stars. In Yaeger they see center depth and they like his game. I bet they would sacrifice anywhere else before trading Yarger

Interesting they allowed Doumolin to leave. Penguins will struggle ti make playoffs

I think a couple NHL teams are gambling on waiting out DCst for a lower salary. Once Hellybuyck signs then Gibson is right behind signing somewhere

It doesn’t make sense that Chicago takes on four years of Karlsson salary without getting something better than a 2nd round pick

Karlssion to Pittsburgh makes more sense than Carolina. Teams are purposely low balling for Karlsson. The Penguins would bend and trade Guentzel if necessary to add a bigger fish in Karlsson?

I don’t think Carolina moves prospect picks and a roster player. For Karlsson