Trevor Shackles: Senators Mailbag Part 3: Wrapping it up Part 3/3 of the Senators mailbag!

Good comments.

Rebuilds are about getting to a point where the fans can identify with the young team on the ice. It means giving the young guys lots of ice time. Best rebuilds usually involve a rigorous commitment to crash and burn at all levels of the organization.

Moving Karlsson plus Stone plus Duchene for picks and prospects is the full deep dive.

Do the Sens risk going that far? Maybe.

Good comments.

Rebuilds are about getting to a point where the fans can identify with the young team on the ice. It means giving the young guys lots of ice time. Best rebuilds usually involve a rigorous commitment to crash and burn at all levels of the organization.

Moving Karlsson plus Stone plus Duchene for picks and prospects is the full deep dive.

Do the Sens risk going that far? Maybe.
- spatso

Why are the Sens in this situation in the first place after going to the Conference finals two seasons ago? Honestly I don't know enough about them to know.

Were they just riding a hot goaltender and saw they couldn't actually compete with better teams? Was it because the owner didn't want to pay Turris and that precipitated all this player movement? Was it because the owner stormed into the dressing room causing conflict between players and himself? Was it internal dressing room issues which have been overblown in the media?

The problem with the burn it to the ground rebuild, for the Sens, is you need support from the owner when you actually get better, to start paying the players. You also need a competent management group to start the process and carry it forward, do the Sens actually have that with the thin group they have above the players and below the owner.

It appears that the owner is at the forefront of a lot of specualtion when it comes to the Senators dysfunction?

everyone knows that this team will continue to be a tire fire as long as melnyk owns the team.

until he's gone, they wont' be able to retain players once they hit UFA, won't attract any other UFAs, players will be unwilling to waive NTCs to come here, the management and development staff will be undermanned and likely underqualified (compared to the rest of the league).......the list goes on and on.

melnyk is 99.9% of the problem in Ottawa right now, the rebound of this team depends 100% on that ass hat finally selling the team.........it will be status quo until then. and when I say sell, I mean 100% sell....none of this partner crap.

"Why are the Sens in this situation in the first place after going to the Conference finals two seasons ago? Honestly I don't know enough about them to know.

Were they just riding a hot goaltender and saw they couldn't actually compete with better teams? Was it because the owner didn't want to pay Turris and that precipitated all this player movement? Was it because the owner stormed into the dressing room causing conflict between players and himself? Was it internal dressing room issues which have been overblown in the media?

The problem with the burn it to the ground rebuild, for the Sens, is you need support from the owner when you actually get better, to start paying the players. You also need a competent management group to start the process and carry it forward, do the Sens actually have that with the thin group they have above the players and below the owner.

It appears that the owner is at the forefront of a lot of specualtion when it comes to the Senators dysfunction?"

I've said it before on here, but Dorion isn't very good at evaluating talent. Sure the Sens made the conference finals a couple of years ago and were 1 goal away from the finals. But did anyone who follows hockey or who watched the Sens play in the playoffs that year, really think this group of players could repeat what they did? Dorion thought so and traded the house to get an upgrade at the center position. Now it looks like Dorion will have to trade the player he acquired almost a year ago. I could be wrong but Duchene wants to play for a playoff team.
I personally believe that the Sens giving Colorado their 1st round pick in the 2019 Draft is another gamble that won't pay off for Melnyk and Dorion, and judging by the talent on the Sens roster (especially after the trade deadline) they will be the front runners for the 1st overall.
Melnyk doesn't have the cash to help this team on the ice from a management perspective which is going to make for a very long rebuild process or a botched rebuild process. Take your pick at this point.

Trevor

Who has the better D? Carolina or Ottawa?

However, his cap hit will probably be around $11M, so it’s hard to reasonably ask for a ton with a guy who has a contract that big (no matter how good he is)…

I guess McDavid is untradeable at $12.5 million

Trevor

Who has the better D? Carolina or Ottawa?

Asking the real questions here

I've said it before on here, but Dorion isn't very good at evaluating talent. Sure the Sens made the conference finals a couple of years ago and were 1 goal away from the finals. But did anyone who follows hockey or who watched the Sens play in the playoffs that year, really think this group of players could repeat what they did? Dorion thought so and traded the house to get an upgrade at the center position. Now it looks like Dorion will have to trade the player he acquired almost a year ago. I could be wrong but Duchene wants to play for a playoff team.
I personally believe that the Sens giving Colorado their 1st round pick in the 2019 Draft is another gamble that won't pay off for Melnyk and Dorion, and judging by the talent on the Sens roster (especially after the trade deadline) they will be the front runners for the 1st overall.
Melnyk doesn't have the cash to help this team on the ice from a management perspective which is going to make for a very long rebuild process or a botched rebuild process. Take your pick at this point.
- randybobandy

That first round pick they gave to Colorado IS going to blowup in Dorian's face. It'll be a top five pick in a good top heavy draft.

Trevor

Who has the better D? Carolina or Ottawa?
- Santo_44

show me one post where I said Ottawa's D was better and i'll rock a leafs profile pick for a year

if not, you rock a sens profile pick for a year.

make the bet, or shut the (frank) up

Remember when the Senators came into the league in 1992, they drafted 2nd - 1st - 3rd - 1st - 1st - 12th in consecutive years....yeah, they're right there again. Starting in the 2020 draft, because, you know, they don't have a first rounder this year.

The good news is, by the time the 1998/99 season came around they had a 44 win 103 point season because they draft well, something they still do, so it does get better.

I do wonder, why Melynks finacials keep getting reported particularly in social meds as they are terrible?
It was almost a cap team last year. Ive never read anywhere he is struggling. Yes he refinanced recently but so do many prospering corporations .

show me one post where I said Ottawa's D was better and i'll rock a leafs profile pick for a year

if not, you rock a sens profile pick for a year.

make the bet, or shut the (frank) up
- sensarmy_11

You argued for the better part of a Sunday that they are not that far apart.

Newsflash: they are.

I’d be surprised if you got the returns you predicted for Stone or Duchene. I’d guess each will fetch a first a B prospect, or an A prospect and a 2nd rounder.

I do wonder, why Melynks finacials keep getting reported particularly in social meds as they are terrible?
It was almost a cap team last year. Ive never read anywhere he is struggling. Yes he refinanced recently but so do many prospering corporations .
- spazzbot

1. he's refinanced multiple times.....very clear sign of financial struggles. the only sports teams who have multiple financing arrangments like that are the ones who are struggling

2. the team loses money despite having a very lucrative t.v. contract, and until very recently, pretty high attendance.....that's because all profits go to paying interest on his re-financing

3. the sens are his primary source of income (unlike basically every other sports team owner who are independently wealthy and own teams for "fun"). melnyk's primary form of income earns him negative money each year.


he's basically running the team with a line of credit, and he takes out another line of credit every few years to pay off the previous one.

You argued for the better part of a Sunday that they are not that far apart.

Newsflash: they are.
- poopstash

still waiting to see where I said Ottawa was better..........................still waiting

1. he's refinanced multiple times.....very clear sign of financial struggles. the only sports teams who have multiple financing arrangments like that are the ones who are struggling

2. the team loses money despite having a very lucrative t.v. contract, and until very recently, pretty high attendance.....that's because all profits go to paying interest on his re-financing

3. the sens are his primary source of income (unlike basically every other sports team owner who are independently wealthy and own teams for "fun"). melnyk's primary form of income earns him negative money each year.


he's basically running the team with a line of credit, and he takes out another line of credit every few years to pay off the previous one.
- sensarmy_11

No offence sensarmy as i know your a loyal fan. And im not a Melynk booster.
All of that is unprovable and some just wrong.
1. Rrfinancing even multiple times does no guarantee bad finances. Even huge corporations shuffle their debt and money around frquently. For many reasons other then going broke.
2.. the books on any nhl team have never been opened publicly. Its all very mysterious as to what the bottom line is owning a team.
3.i do believe he owns very succesful pharmaceutical corporations.and likely more.
I would just like the narrative to be accurate. 1 way or the other

Trevor

Who has the better D? Carolina or Ottawa?
- Santo_44

Lol uhh Carolina is top-5 in the league

Lol uhh Carolina is top-5 in the league
- Trevor Shackles

Sens Army in shambles

I’d be surprised if you got the returns you predicted for Stone or Duchene. I’d guess each will fetch a first a B prospect, or an A prospect and a 2nd rounder.
- Ross77

Average rentals who are second line wingers usually get like a 1st and a B prospect, and they're much better than that, so I think it's reasonable to expect a bit more.

Average rentals who are second line wingers usually get like a 1st and a B prospect, and they're much better than that, so I think it's reasonable to expect a bit more.
- Trevor Shackles

Especially if they’re willing to sign an extension with their new team.

Could be an Evander Kane type of conditional pick added in the deal.

Lol uhh Carolina is top-5 in the league
- Trevor Shackles

Knew it Boo 😘❤️

Lol uhh Carolina is top-5 in the league
- Trevor Shackles

come on trevor

Winnipeg, Nashville, st. Louis, tampa, philly, CBJ, boston

that's 7 and I didn't even have to think about it.

there are at least another 5 or 6 that you could argue are as good or better.....LA, Anaheim, SJ, Ari, Minn

come on trevor

Winnipeg, Nashville, st. Louis, tampa, philly, CBJ, boston

that's 7 and I didn't even have to think about it.

there are at least another 5 or 6 that you could argue are as good or better.....LA, Anaheim, SJ, Ari, Minn
- sensarmy_11

No chance Winnipeg and Philly are better. Boston's not nearly as deep too. Hamilton, Faulk, De Haan, Slavin, and Pesce are all legit top-4 D, which is crazy.

Rookies coming to camp.

Will be nice to see some actual ice activity.