James Tanner: Sam Gagner Profiling new Coyotes Sam Gagner

What you see is what you get with this kid. He'll be a 40 point guy who's good on special teams and pretty average everywhere else, except his skating, which is below average.

You know, spending a lot of time in Phoenix and seriously considering moving there, I wish this team would draft and develop a number one center.

When Arizona traded for him, there were a lot of teams with cap space. What only giving up a 6th round pick tells you is that no other GM in the league thought he was worth anything more. Reason being: he is a fringe NHL player. He needs to be in the top 6 to be effective, and isn't good enough for the top 6 of teams with legitimate NHL forwards. Been years since he showed he was still developing, no reason to think he is going to start now.

I know you have a hard-on for Gagner. I bet that with 1st lin ice time and PP time on a consistent bases, he'll put up 50 pts a season. The "experts" were wrong predicting him to have 70. How many points did vrbata and ribero have for the yotes last season? Top line players, good career #s? They hit 50 points. Top line for the Yotes.

Gagner has no track record of amazing point producing seasons. He's been a modest disappointment in Edmonton and was shipped out for proven assistance on the 3rd/2nd line.

50, maybe 55 points, a negative +/- season for Gagner. He's not a cornerstone. Poor defense, subpar skating, shows good flashes. You can't build a team on a player like him.



"Only bad luck has prevented him from being a star"....
C'mon. You just took homerism to a new level.

It's like you write troll blogs...

You and the panthers guy...

Max Domi.

It's like you write troll blogs...

You and the panthers guy...
- RoloTahmasee

That Panthers blog was hilarious.

It's like you write troll blogs...

You and the panthers guy...
- RoloTahmasee

That is so unfair.

If you read what I say, I fully acknowledge the negatives. And I don`t claim hes going to be a star, just that he has more to offer. Obviously Don Maloney thinks so.

I don`t think it`s homerish to say a guy who hasn`t had one full 82 game season, who clearly has talent, and who is getting a fresh start stands a chance to finally succeed.

I even write the odds are against it happening.

This guy has - with everything going wrong for him - put up a constant 50 points. How is it a bad thing to think that if things go right for him, if he`s in a new situation that might be positive for him, that he could do better.

Also, I know that last sentence should end with a question mark, but I have suddenly turned my keyboard into a french keyboard and dont know how to get it back and all the buttons are now different.

What you see is what you get with this kid. He'll be a 40 point guy who's good on special teams and pretty average everywhere else, except his skating, which is below average.

You know, spending a lot of time in Phoenix and seriously considering moving there, I wish this team would draft and develop a number one center.
- LeftCoaster

Is the price of real estate still extremely cheap there? I'll move with you.

I know you have a hard-on for Gagner. I bet that with 1st lin ice time and PP time on a consistent bases, he'll put up 50 pts a season. The "experts" were wrong predicting him to have 70. How many points did vrbata and ribero have for the yotes last season? Top line players, good career #s? They hit 50 points. Top line for the Yotes.

Gagner has no track record of amazing point producing seasons. He's been a modest disappointment in Edmonton and was shipped out for proven assistance on the 3rd/2nd line.

50, maybe 55 points, a negative +/- season for Gagner. He's not a cornerstone. Poor defense, subpar skating, shows good flashes. You can't build a team on a player like him.



"Only bad luck has prevented him from being a star"....
C'mon. You just took homerism to a new level.
- jackzack87

Yeah, the experts were such idiots for not predicting he would get a broken face. A rookie scores 49 points, then goes on to be plagued by injuries, has 17 different coaches and plays for one of the worst teams in decades. but during all this, does manage to put up a fairly constant 40 points. I would love to hear you explain how this is not bad luck without looking foolish.

Good work. Thanks for the insight on how the salary cap can affect a trade. Like you said Maloney thinks it's a good trade and he's paid a lot more than any of us.

Sam Gagner Can Still be a Star in the NHL
- James_Tanner

Yeah and I may grow wings out of my ass and fly around but the odds of it happening are very slim. If all you needed was heart to play in the NHL well then Gags would be a superstar but unfortunately you also need other skills. He has some skills but is lacking quite a bit in other areas so I highly doubt he'll be more than a 40-50 pt player. Great guy but just can't skate very fast at all, gets knocked off the puck very easily and can't play D to save his life. Oh and to say he can play C and RW isn't really true, he should only play RW, he isn't good at all playing centre.

Yeah, the experts were such idiots for not predicting he would get a broken face. A rookie scores 49 points, then goes on to be plagued by injuries, has 17 different coaches and plays for one of the worst teams in decades. but during all this, does manage to put up a fairly constant 40 points. I would love to hear you explain how this is not bad luck without looking foolish.
- James_Tanner

Don't get testy. I just explained it. Your explanation of why he WILL get 70+ points is foolish. The yotes system has had proven ppg/high point players (like ribero) who got only 50 points on the top line. He has a good track record. (has had 80+ points/season). The system is a D-first system. It doesn't allow for shinny like riberio and Gagner play.

Replacing ribero with a kid who has never broken 50 points and who has multiple season of being healthy, who is a subpar skater and poor defensive player and suddenly predicting a 20 point increase in a tightened system is foolish friend.

Part of the reason the Oilers were a bad team is because of Gagner, you know.

And he was on track for +/- 50 points in all season he didn't play a full season. Do the math. It's not like he was on target for 30 goals and 40 assists - he was still on the mark for 50.

If Gagner scores 40 points you take it and run. 50 will be a career year.

Yeah, the experts were such idiots for not predicting he would get a broken face. A rookie scores 49 points, then goes on to be plagued by injuries, has 17 different coaches and plays for one of the worst teams in decades. but during all this, does manage to put up a fairly constant 40 points. I would love to hear you explain how this is not bad luck without looking foolish.
- James_Tanner

Different coaches? That's your crutch?

Is the price of real estate still extremely cheap there? I'll move with you.
- laughs2907

It's still very reasonable compared to the West Coast or cities like Calgary and Edmonton.

Different coaches? That's your crutch?
- scotch_tape

Not at all, I am just pointing out that a talented kid who is still 25 and has demonstrably and inarguably faced some trying circumstances and bad luck stands a good chance of breaking out.

I don't say he will.

I say I think he might.

I also think it's ridiculous for someone to say 70 points is out of the question when he got 50 as a rookie. 25 is still a prime age to put it all together. I fully acknowledge in the article that this is getting more unlikely by the year.

BUT the responses have been caustic and for the most part, extremely rude and condescending. If you look at all the information, and conclude he maxes out at 50 points - considering he has basically done that every year of his career as his career point per game average multiplied by 82 is exactly 50 - then that is possibly more ridiculous than my 70 prediction.

I mean, all signs point to the situation in AZ being better for him. And he did 50 points as a rookie. To think call a prediction of 70- with a fully explicit list of caveats - "homerish" or a "troll blog" is frankly one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard in my life.

Seems more likely that he would improve on his 50 point rookie season if he had a fully healthy season with better ice time at 25 than that he wouldn't.

James Tanner: Sam Gagner
Profiling new Coyotes Sam Gagner
- James_Tanner

Couple of little mistakes in your blog.

- He was drafted 6th overall in 2007.
- His Cap hit is slightly higher than Purcell's, not slightly lower.
- Your section about his merits makes it seem like he had the 8 point game in the lockout season. He didn't, his 38 in 48 was the year after.

All in all though, I somewhat agree. He's improved his skating since becoming a pro. There's still being progress being made there. I don't think he's reached his ceiling. I dunno it will be terribly higher though.

Not at all, I am just pointing out that a talented kid who is still 25 and has demonstrably and inarguably faced some trying circumstances and bad luck stands a good chance of breaking out.

I don't say he will.

I say I think he might.

I also think it's ridiculous for someone to say 70 points is out of the question when he got 50 as a rookie. 25 is still a prime age to put it all together. I fully acknowledge in the article that this is getting more unlikely by the year.

BUT the responses have been caustic and for the most part, extremely rude and condescending. If you look at all the information, and conclude he maxes out at 50 points - considering he has basically done that every year of his career as his career point per game average multiplied by 82 is exactly 50 - then that is possibly more ridiculous than my 70 prediction.

I mean, all signs point to the situation in AZ being better for him. And he did 50 points as a rookie. To think call a prediction of 70- with a fully explicit list of caveats - "homerish" or a "troll blog" is frankly one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard in my life.

Seems more likely that he would improve on his 50 point rookie season if he had a fully healthy season with better ice time at 25 than that he wouldn't.
- James_Tanner

Do you usually get this steamy when people disagree with you? When EVERYONE else says you are off the wall, do you really think you're on point?No one wants to dislike you - but when you start making leaps on illogical presumptions and crying foul on people who disagree, you take on a motif of a loud, disagreeable fat kid with ADD. Just go play by yourself.

Do you usually get this steamy when people disagree with you? When EVERYONE else says you are off the wall, do you really think you're on point?No one wants to dislike you - but when you start making leaps on illogical presumptions and crying foul on people who disagree, you take on a motif of a loud, disagreeable fat kid with ADD. Just go play by yourself.
- jackzack87

If people disagree like fully functioning, reasonable adults, i have no problem with that. When they don't.....

If people disagree like fully functioning, reasonable adults, i have no problem with that. When they don't.....
- James_Tanner

Well then I'm just glad you're here to show us the ropes.

Couple of little mistakes in your blog.

- He was drafted 6th overall in 2007.
- His Cap hit is slightly higher than Purcell's, not slightly lower.
- Your section about his merits makes it seem like he had the 8 point game in the lockout season. He didn't, his 38 in 48 was the year after.

All in all though, I somewhat agree. He's improved his skating since becoming a pro. There's still being progress being made there. I don't think he's reached his ceiling. I dunno it will be terribly higher though.
- Morris

Thanks for the heads up. I corrected the points you made, you were right. Much appreciation.

It's still very reasonable compared to the West Coast or cities like Calgary and Edmonton.
- LeftCoaster

And when are we moving?

Sam Gagner Can Still be a Star in the NHL

Sure he can. So can about 50 other guys with solid speed and skill but major consistency issues.

I agree with you James Tanner. There was no risk acquiring Gagner and he has a lot to prove. He is a competitor and looking back to his rookie season and how he absolutely killed every goalie in the shootout plus the 8 point game later shows that he has the skill and if he can stay healthy and connect with a couple good line mates there is a chance he will succeed. After all the gong show in Edmonton is not a great place to grow your hockey career. Good luck Sam, Max, Shane and most importantly Mike Smith rebound and have a great year.